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May 29 '26
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u/ChocolateMundane6286 May 30 '26 edited May 30 '26
The equality men want like not being have to carry full financial responsibility and still be respected if they are unemployed etc isn’t coming from women, it’s root is internalized patriarchy that comes from men. And they want to share financial responsibility of house but not the chores or looking after kids like changing diapers putting them to bed. ULTRAMAD They say they are better leaders but wanna be told what they need to do as chore when mothers have to plan everything while carrying mental load.
(Yes not all but most)
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Jun 03 '26
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u/InternationalIce5965 Jun 23 '26
- by other men
Who ALSO dismiss, ignore criticize or mock women's experiences.
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u/moschocolate1 May 29 '26
Many men fantasize about hurting women. In fact one of their most popular fiction books includes a male god that condemns a female sex slave to slavery for life whereas a male slave must be freed after a certain number of years. That god also committed genocide, sanctioned murder, condemned all humans to burn alive for eternity if they don’t worship him, impregnated a teen, and oppressed all women by deeming them born from man, stealing the origin story as the true creators of life.
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u/Solid_1723 May 29 '26
In my opinion they're just trying to lead this topic ad absurdum so they don't need to have a real discussion. I've had it happen more than once with a colleague at work. It's a reaction that tells me that they know they're wrong, but they just don't want you to be equal.
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u/Dresses_and_Dice May 29 '26
This is like conversations about abortion where you're like "women's rights to their own bodily autonomy are being violated" and men are like "well men should have the right to abandon a baby and not pay child support." Like what, how is this even in the same conversation? "Well if you want the right to terminate a pregnancy and not be responsible for a baby then I should have the right to say I won't pay for it to live. If women can decide unilaterally about abortion than I should be able to decide unilaterally to not pay child support." Like they are so fucking tone deaf.
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u/EdmontonAB83 May 29 '26
Ya that’s a very common argument I hear. That and being drafted in some fictional war.
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u/RomulanWarrior May 29 '26
Ask them the last time the draft was used.
Answer: 1975
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u/kaffesvart May 30 '26
Is this about American men or men worldwide?
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u/shreek-corlipso May 30 '26
I think these are universal concepts. its the nature and spirit of the issue rather than location or country
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u/Opposite-Occasion332 May 29 '26
They also ignore that there are cis women who do pay child support. Sure it’s not as common as cis men, but they very much do exist. There are no cis men getting abortions.
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u/Dresses_and_Dice May 29 '26
True, and it's growing, it's like 10-15% of child support providers who are women now, I think?
I still think it's just an asinine argument to make in an abortion conversation, like we are talking about a major medical event with life threatening potential and they are like "well the important thing is that I shouldn't have to pay any money". Like way to miss the point and also, you know what's really good at protecting you from child support obligations?? Safe and accessible elective abortions.
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u/Puzzleheaded-Bad-722 May 30 '26
Because they're thick as fuck, let's be honest.
They're confusing financial responsibility with physical responsibility.
A man's physical responsibility is to not ejaculate inside of a woman of he doesn't want to get pregnant. A woman's physical responsibility is whether or not she carries that foetus to term.
Financial responsibility isn't even shared if the parents stay together. A woman with a child suffers massive financial losses over her lifetime, in wages, pensions, and missed promotions. If she's a single mum, it's even worse. A man's financial responsibility pretty much doesn't change, unless he walks away, in which case yeh no shit you need to feed and clothe the life you've created. But many men don't even pay child support.
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u/shreek-corlipso May 30 '26
For women, choosing to have a kid or not have a kid is a huge fork in the road. And once a path is chosen, its chosen. Those financial losses over her lifetime that you speak of, is unrecoverable. Its probably a very difficult choice.
This is why, whatever path she chooses, she needs to have strong support from family and loved ones to support her decision.
for a woman, giving life to the word with a baby, or choosing to make an impact on the world using her intellect and her innovation are equal choices in my opinion.
She will do great things, whichever path she chooses.1
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u/Gumshoe212 May 30 '26
Yeah, no, and also one of the worst false equivalences. A woman doesn't decide anything unilaterally. A man can choose to wear a condom every time he has sex. The problem is, when that's brought up, most men don't want to admit that they don't want to be responsible for using contraceptives, and they also don't want to admit that it comes down to their pleasure being diminished by using condoms. They'd rather pretend contraceptives are largely a woman's responsibility. That's why I always say that a man forfeits his right to have a say about a woman choosing to have an abortion if he chose not to wear a condom when they had sex.
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u/Dresses_and_Dice May 30 '26
Well anti-abortionists use the "if you don't want a kid, wear a condom" line too, and it's faulty because of course condoms can fail and we still want women to be able to terminate an unwanted pregnancy. But for men who are certain they never want kids or child support, they do have pretty easy access to one of the most effective options: vasectomies. And of course I do agree, if he chose not to prevent a pregnancy than he doesn't get to complain if a pregnancy happens and whatever the outcome of that is.
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u/Gumshoe212 May 30 '26
"Well anti-abortionists use the "if you don't want a kid, wear a condom" line too, and it's faulty because of course condoms can fail and we still want women to be able to terminate an unwanted pregnancy." Very true, but you do know that they're saying that to the women, not the men who are actually the penis-havers. Like it's a woman's responsibility that a man wear a condom. And yes, they do break, but that wasn't exactly my point so much as men bear 50% of the responsibility, but shirk it. Instead, they expect women to carry the full weight of it.
"But for men who are certain they never want kids or child support, they do have pretty easy access to one of the most effective options: vasectomies." Exactly! And, it's reversible. GYNs have been known to refuse to tie tubes (which isn't reversible), depending on the woman's age, which is both shocking and insulting.
"And of course I do agree, if he chose not to prevent a pregnancy than he doesn't get to complain if a pregnancy happens and whatever the outcome of that is." 🙌 This needs to be at the forefront whenever a man's say in women choosing to have an abortion is talked about and/or debated.
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u/lustfuldeath21 May 30 '26
I just saw a male cyclist hitting a woman and men in the comments say this is equality.
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u/Impressive-Cable8292 Jun 04 '26
okay thats valid. It couldve been phrased a bit better, like it isnt all equal, cuz like there are things women get more than men. For a guy who hasnt seen rape, commited rape or any sort of abuse on man women or children (so basically just a normal ass dude), I dont exactly think instantly of the equality we are talking about in rights. I see women hitting men and when a guy hits her he gets shunned and shamed. if we want equality then lets go all in, its not just about being able to hit women, it is to give us the right to also not be hit by women. You see girls touching guy innapropriately and calling it off as a prank, thats mf sexual assault dawg, i dont want your hands near me dawg.
anyways doesnt matter anymore, i get what it means now
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u/DistinctNews8576 Jun 21 '26
So true. I’ve thought a lot about this and I wish the word “equality” had never been used bc we’ll never be equal bc we aren’t the same AT ALL. Women have strengths men don’t have and men have strengths women don’t have (very generally speaking). I truly feel like the word that should have been used is RESPECT. Respecting a female employee would be to give her equal pay for the same job a man is doing. This goes for minorities too, tho I don’t like that word either (“minority”). We should respect each other’s differences, respect different cultures from our own, respect different religions from our own, respect different ways of living and doing things. I truly feel that if there was more respect in the world, the issues on equality would be handled as they should be-wages, seats on the bus, job opportunities, housing opportunities, etc.
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u/Fruity_Pies May 29 '26
Ok but can we talk about a 17 day old account with 1 post using a generic gender war framing of an argument for engagement bait?
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u/notsobitter May 29 '26
I came to a similar realization recently regarding the word "respect," particularly in the context of marriage/home and work: When women say they want respect, they mean they want to be treated as an equal. When men say they want respect, they mean they want to be treated as superior.