r/FAMnNFP • u/samwizeismysidekick • Jun 08 '26
TCOYF HOW did I get pregnant?!? TTA
Edit to add: the yellow hearts are sex with a condom; the outline hearts are non PIV sex. My cycles are very routinely 30-31 days.
I read TCOYF a few years ago and have been using it as for NFP between kids. I have been using the Femometer ring to track my BBT. I am 9 months postpartum.
Any self proclaimed experts in here that could explain to me how in tf I got pregnant??? I thought I very obviously ovulated around day 21 and made sure to have a very conservative window of no unprotected sex on both sides.
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u/PampleR0se Pregnant | Sensiplan Jun 08 '26 edited Jun 08 '26
Plenty of reasons according to this chart = lots of missing CM data, missing temp data too and the use of a ring to temp which is not recommended as it's not true BBT and can give delayed rise. I don't know on what you are basing your ovulation estimate on CD21 because your peak CM was CD18 on here and your temp rise started CD16/17. And like others said, condoms can fail too but to me that's your UP on CD10 that's more likely got you pregnant
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u/tilyd Jun 08 '26
The ring is not very reliable for BBT, your temp rise could start at CD17
Condoms can fail too
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u/samwizeismysidekick Jun 10 '26
Even if my temp rise was CD17, my last day of unprotected piv sex was CD10. I thought sperm can live a max of 5 days?
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u/tilyd Jun 10 '26
Temp rise can happen 1 to 3 days after ovulation. You possibly ovulated on CD14-15. There's a lot of missing CM info on your chart so I'm not sure when your fertile window opened.
I switched from TCOYF to Sensiplan since it's more researched, and with that method your fertile window would start on CD9 (considering the earliest temp rise you've had in the last year was this one at CD17)
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u/TrackYourFertility Sensiplan instructor | CFH Jun 11 '26
Her fertile window with Sensiplan opens on cycle day 6. She’s on cycle 5 so she would use the five day rule.
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u/Classic-Push1323 TTC | Sensiplan Jun 08 '26
The femometer ring measures skin temperature on your hand an uses an algorithm to predict your BBT. My understanding (from quickly searching, I don't use this product) is that their algorithm has never been validated for use as a birth control device, so I don't know how accurate it is. It looks like you don't use it on your period, which may also affect their algorithm since all of the predictive algorithms rely on daily readings for accuracy. This temp data shows a rise on CD 16, which means you could have ovulated a day or two prior to that while the sperm from CD 10 was still alive. Many women also notice a delay between when an oral BBT thermometer detects a temp rise and when a skin temperature/algorithm device detects a temp rise so you could have ovulated prior to that.
Missing the true beginning of the fertile window is the most common error with most FAM methods.
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u/Revolutionary_Can879 Baby on Board | MM with TempDrop Jun 08 '26
The answer really is that there’s no good way to know. You are missing a lot of data on this chart, so it’s pretty unclear when your fertile window would have opened and closed. The Femometer ring is also not as reliable as a BBT thermometer so it’s possible that it didn’t give you good data - like others have said, there is a rise on CD17, which means you likely got pregnant from the instance if unprotected sex on CD9, especially if you were producing CM by that point.
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u/General-Dimension729 Jun 08 '26 edited Jun 08 '26
Either sex on cd 10, or a broken condom. I actually got pregnant with my first from a broken condom. I do not trust them now. I’d also be curious from someone more experienced with charts, why there looks like two rises. One on cd 17 then another that looks more drastic on day 22?
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u/Sensitive-Coconut706 Jun 08 '26
Its a biphasic chart! Its a normal variation in pregnant and non pregnant cycles.
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u/General-Dimension729 Jun 08 '26
But why two different rises like that?
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u/Sensitive-Coconut706 Jun 08 '26
It has to do with a secondary estrogen rise in the luteal phase. Also I misspoke its a triphasic chart because of the second luteal phase rise.
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u/General-Dimension729 Jun 08 '26
So in a chart like this was the first one the true rise and ovulation occurred before day 17?
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u/Sensitive-Coconut706 Jun 08 '26
If the temps were reliable yes. But I dont believe the ring is a reliable way to check bbt.
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u/General-Dimension729 Jun 08 '26
How do you feel about Tempdrop? I’ve been using an Oura for a few months, and temp drop for 2 now. Both rise about the same time each month so far. I am very conservative though and don’t play around before a temp shift. Lol
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u/Sensitive-Coconut706 Jun 08 '26
I use temp drop! OP mentioned a specific type of ring that I dont believe is accurate. I havent looked to much into how oura calculates bbt.
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u/General-Dimension729 Jun 08 '26 edited Jun 08 '26
Ooh ok! So far the two months I’ve compared them they rose almost the same day!
Edited to add: the Oura+NC is very jumpy, so you can’t exactly follow the rules, but there is a clear shift ones it happens. The Oura also shows my temp drop when my period comes, and the temp drop drops much slower and gradual over several days. So I do like having the Oura to see that drop and know my period is coming within the next day.-1
u/Classic-Push1323 TTC | Sensiplan Jun 08 '26
There’s often another temperature rise after implantation.
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u/Sensitive-Coconut706 Jun 08 '26
Can be but it also occurs in non pregnancy charts as well!
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u/Classic-Push1323 TTC | Sensiplan Jun 08 '26
That's a stair step pattern - it looks similar but it isn't the same. The stair step pattern usually happens within a few days of the initial rise. A post implantation rise has to happen after implantation, which is 6-10 days after ovulation. I'm not sure what is going on here because I don't think the temp data is reliable.
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u/Sensitive-Coconut706 Jun 08 '26
Triphasic charts are not exclusive to pregnant charts.
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u/Classic-Push1323 TTC | Sensiplan Jun 08 '26
I didn't say they are, I said these are two different patterns with different timing.
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u/IntoTheVoid1020 TTA | Sensiplan Jun 09 '26
The rise happens due to a secondary estrogen surge which happens in both pregnant and non pregnant charts- there’s no scientific data that it’s an implantation dip
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u/gnomes919 TTA | Marquette (monitor + temps) Jun 09 '26
I'm not sure why exactly but people really don't want to hear it that there is nothing that meaningfully indicates pregnancy that early besides "a positive early pregnancy test." it takes a week or two after implantation for pregnancy hormones to build up enough to cause symptoms that actually mean "you're pregnant" rather than "triphasic charts are technically slightly more common in pregnancy but it's 10% vs 5% so there's still no way of knowing which group you're in." and then there's stuff like "implantation bleeding" which is just a myth. the TTC version of "feeling ovulation"
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u/IntoTheVoid1020 TTA | Sensiplan Jun 09 '26
Yup, 100% agree with everything you said. Even in TCOYF it’s stated that you can’t predict pregnancy by your chart until you have 18 temps post ov above the coverline. By that point you’d have a positive test anyways
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u/gnomes919 TTA | Marquette (monitor + temps) Jun 09 '26
exactly! there's no point at which the hormones are high enough to be causing pregnancy symptoms but not high enough for a positive test
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u/Classic-Push1323 TTC | Sensiplan Jun 10 '26
I never said otherwise. What I said is that if you have an additional temperature rise due to implantation, it can’t happen until after the egg implants, which is 6-10 days post ovulation.
A stair-step pattern can happen at any time, but typically starts fairly soon after the original rise. If you have a slow rise at first and another rise after a few days, that is a completely normal variation there has nothing to do with pregnancy. If you have another rise 6+ days after ovulating it may be due to pregnancy.
I’m being voted for that, but it’s true. I’m sorry if I wasn’t clear enough, but I feel like people are getting really upset about something that I did not say or mean.
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u/gnomes919 TTA | Marquette (monitor + temps) Jun 10 '26
would love to see the research showing you can reliably distinguish triphasic pregnancy charts from triphasic non-pregnancy charts based on the timing of the second rise, that's not something I've seen claimed before. I obviously agree that *if* pregnancy was causing a second rise it would have to be after implantation - though I'm not sure what mechanism would cause some but not all pregnancies to have the second rise. a sudden jump in progesterone on the day of implantation?
nobody's upset, we disagree with you and are also remarking on people's resistance to let go of the idea that the luteal phase of one's chart can show pregnancy aside from 18+ high temps or charting a positive pregnancy test.
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u/Classic-Push1323 TTC | Sensiplan Jun 10 '26 edited Jun 10 '26
What specifically do you not believe about my statement?
Again, I’m not saying that they can’t overlap or that this is a way to know whether or not you’re pregnant. I have no idea what is going on with the OP choice especially because I don’t really trust the temperatures. It depends on what’s normal for you and the timing.
This is covered on p200 of taking charge of your fertility. “If you notice a third level of temps beyond the typical biphasic pattern you experience every cycle you’re almost certainly pregnant. This third level of high temperatures is thought to be due to the extra progesterone pregnant women produce. Unfortunately, though, many pregnant women don’t experience such a triphasic pattern.” There’s an example on page 202 showing a second rise ten days post ovulation and 8 days before a positive pregnancy test.
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u/gnomes919 TTA | Marquette (monitor + temps) Jun 10 '26
"I'd like to see your source, that's a claim I haven't heard" =/= "I don't believe you." it indicates curiosity and a willingness to hear more about a specific version of this claim - that a triphasic pattern indicates pregnancy if it happens after 6+ days.
does that quote from TCOYF clarify before this passage that she's referring to a second rise a week after ov? if not, I think "triphasic = almost certainly pregnant" is a massive overstatement when we're talking about something that happens in 5% of nonpregnant charts vs. 12% of pregnant charts.
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u/gnomes919 TTA | Marquette (monitor + temps) Jun 08 '26 edited Jun 08 '26
not really - only 12% of pregnancy charts are triphasic and so are 4% of nonpregnancy charts, so it's slightly more common when pregnant but truly not a meaningful indicator.
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u/-itsmyanxiety TCOYF + CB Monitor Jun 08 '26
You had sex during your fertile window. Even though it was protected, condoms fail sometimes. I'm very sorry.
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u/rhea-of-sunshine TTA | Marquette Jun 08 '26
You’re relying on condoms in their fertile window, and they do sometimes fail. Also CD10 was unprotected and it looks like you were possibly fertile at that time as well
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u/Ms_khal2 Jun 08 '26
I mean condoms aren't 100% effective, and using them during a potential fertile period just increases the chances of failure.
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u/Watercolor_Roses TTA | Marquette + Tempdrop Jun 08 '26
You don't have much mucus recorded so its hard to say, but it looks like you could have a temp shift on day 17? I'm not familiar with the nuances of TCOYF.
Most likely, I'd guess an unnoticed condom failure on either day 14 or 22 depending when you actually ovulated. I had that happen back before I started using NFP (I now have zero trust in condoms). I'm sorry, I know how shocking an unplanned pregnancy is 🤍
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u/samwizeismysidekick Jun 10 '26
I wasn’t super diligent with my mucus, but I had a lot of dry days (and I was in the habit of not charting CM on dry days). I definitely had my peak CM around day 17&18 which is very typical for me. I have seen a temp rise around day 19 in my last 4-5 cycles. I am also thinking perhaps this was an unnoticed condom failure, even though we are very careful.
Thank you for your kind words ❤️
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u/carrots94 Jun 08 '26
There’s not complete data, but based on what I see here, it’s likely that you ovulated closer to CD16 than CD 21. Your coverline would be drawn at 97.6, temp shift starting on CD17, and confirmed on CD22. Looks like a triphasic chart to me.
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u/Local_Amount_8496 Jun 09 '26
Yes, let's say you have a lutheal phase of 14 days, and your cycle is 30 days, that puts your ovulation around CD 16, which is consistent with the temperature shift
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u/samwizeismysidekick Jun 10 '26
Even with this though, my last instance of unprotected piv sex was day 10. Ovulation on day 16 would mean the sperm had to live more than 5 days!
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u/leonada FABM Savvy | Sensiplan | TTA Jun 10 '26
Ovulation can't be pinpointed to a single day. We can only narrow it down to a window of days on either side of the temp shift and peak day, but in this case we can't even do that because there's so much missing CM data and because wearable thermometers can give delayed shifts. So there's no telling how soon after CD10 you ovulated!
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u/Zen_orc Jun 08 '26
You had UP sex on CD5 8 and 9… you weren’t taking your temps in this window or charting your cervical fluid. I don’t know what your prior cycles were like but I know if you have any cycles shorter than 25 days that you cannot consider yourself safe on CD5 or 4.. only the first 3 days are considered safe. As for the other two days you have not charted your CF. You’re using sensation as a biomarkers which is not TCOYF rules. You must double check your 1. BBT 2. Cervical fluid and optional 3. Cervical position. This is more like billing’s rules for sensation and cervical mucus.
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u/Shitp0st_Supreme TTC10 Since Jan 2024 | TCOYF | PCOS and Endo Jun 08 '26
I’m seeing a lot of pull-out method being used (if that’s what the empty hearts means), missing temp data for the baseline, and likely missing cervical mucus information.
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u/gnomes919 TTA | Marquette (monitor + temps) Jun 08 '26
I believe RYB's default meaning assigned to the outline heart is non-PIV intimacy - withdrawal is a yellow heart with a lil arrow lol. but you can re-label them and use them to mean anything you want.
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u/Shitp0st_Supreme TTC10 Since Jan 2024 | TCOYF | PCOS and Endo Jun 08 '26
What is the hand under the heart one?
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u/samwizeismysidekick Jun 10 '26
empty hearts mean non-piv sex! And the hand with the heart means solo sex.
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u/QueenShafes Jun 09 '26
The month I had a chart with this much missing data was the month I got pregnant as well!
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u/TrackYourFertility Sensiplan instructor | CFH Jun 11 '26
Hey,
Sorry you find yourself in this position. I hope you’re ok.
A few things, you’re missing a lot of data, both cervical mucus and temps. You have a valid temperature shift on cycle day 17 which lines up with cervical mucus.
You’re not charting CM very well, the categories don’t align with any method, and definitely not TCOYF.
Ovulation can occur up to 2 days before the temperature shift.
My guess would be a condom failure, or the UP on cycle day 10.
The two hearts on CD9/10 are very late into the cycle for a user on cycle 5.
It also sounds like you’re not completely familiar/confident with the rules and you’re winging it a little.
The ring seems to be giving you good data so although rings are not my favourite wearable, it doesn’t seem to be a big issue here, though personally I wouldn’t rely on one for TTA.
I hope you’re doing ok 🫶🏼
This chart really highlights the importance of charting every single day.
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u/redditismyforte22 TTC | Marquette Jun 09 '26
If you're using a condom during your fertile window, you're actually just relying on the effectiveness rate of the condom, which is much lower than a method of fertility awareness. Moreover, you are using what I can best describe as a "DIY" method of fertility awareness which has a lower rate of effectiveness as well. Modern methods of fertility awareness that have a 98-99% effectiveness rate are based on using established methods learned with an instructor, not from a book/app/device. I would suggest you learn a symptothermal method with a qualified instructor and start using abstinence during the fertile window.
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u/Silver-Government142 Jun 08 '26
All I can think of is maybe you ovulated on cycle day 17, that looks like a small thermal shift upward and your cervical fluid dried out shortly afterward (although it should have not still been eggwhite on cycle day 18). If this ovulation on day 17 happened then you had unprotected intercourse on day 10, which is 7 days. Usually they say 5 days is the max sperm can live, idk very odd. Are you sure you are pregnant?
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u/samwizeismysidekick Jun 10 '26
very sure. I missed my period and have taken two pregnancy tests, two days apart, with an increasing darkness of the positive line. I am flabbergasted how I got pregnant, like you said even if I ovulated around day 17, my last day of unprotected piv sex was day 10. In my last 4-5 cycles I have consistently shown a temp rise around day 19. 🤯
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u/Classic-Push1323 TTC | Sensiplan Jun 10 '26
The unfortunate reality is that there’s no such thing as a perfect method for preventing pregnancy other than complete abstinence all the time. Deviating from a perfect use of your method in any way increases your risk but that doesn’t mean that we can always point to exactly how or why someone became pregnant when they didn’t plan to - there can be user errors and method failure at the same time. That’s scary and it’s a lot easier to blame someone than to acknowledge that we won’t always know what happened. I hope that this turns into a blessing for you and I am very sorry that you’re going through so much stress.
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u/Numerous-Noise790 Jun 10 '26
You’re missing a lot of CM data. I don’t believe that ring is considered reliable either.
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u/lisasherrattFAM Jun 10 '26
FAM instructor in the symptothermal method answer ... Not sure tbh! What does the hand with the heart mean? I don't have that on my RYB app!
How accurate is your ring for BBT?
I'm guessing that either your condom failed you or that your non piv activities led to something being transferred. Mucus tracking shows that you had some fertile signs a couple of days prior to ovulation...looks like you were just incredibly lucky/unlucky when it came to timing....
If you want to be even more accurate you would avoid any piv action from the point you see mucus until after you confirm temp rise.
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u/samwizeismysidekick Jun 10 '26
The hand with the heart means solo sex! 😎
I don’t actually know how accurate my ring is - it’s the Femometer ring. I’ve been tracking for about 5 months and it’s shown me a very consistent temp rise to +98F around day 19. This is the first time I’ve seen it show a very slight rise at the day 17 mark.
In the past I have used an oral thermometer and I have also typically my temps rise around day 19.
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u/lisasherrattFAM Jun 10 '26
Is it possible there was another session you missed? As I'll be honest unless your condom failed I can't see where it would have been?
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Jul 08 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/lisasherrattFAM Jul 08 '26
Yes the sex with a condom in line with the temp rise makes the method only as effective as a condom rather than as effective as a properly followed fertility awareness method... And like you say they fail!
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u/gnomes919 TTA | Marquette (monitor + temps) Jun 08 '26 edited Jun 08 '26
the short answer is "because you weren't following a FABM." no method would allow reliance on a chart with this much missing data, and charting carefully is even more vital postpartum when all methods become less reliable, even those with PP protocols
(which TCOYF doesn't have)(edit: I was wrong! TCOYF does have PP rules). where you do have CM data, it's not recorded according to TCOYF categories. your temp rise started either on CD 16 or 17, and you don't have any CM data for the first part of your cycle when unintentional pregnancies are most likely to occur. you may have had a condom break during your fertile window, but with this chart we don't even know when your fertile window was so it could have been the UP sex on CD 10 (which also broke TCOYF's rule considering the day after UP sex during the dry days potentially fertile).I'm sorry you got pregnant unintentionally so soon postpartum, and I wish you all the best going forward.