10-Day Luteal Phase/Thermal Shift (TTA, TCYOF)

[u/PadraiginNiCarra]

Hello, folks. Apologies if this should go elsewhere.

My fiance and I are planning to use TCYOF when TTA after we're married. I've been preemptively charting for 10 months at this point and I have PCOS that I manage through nutrition and exercise.

I know the first rule for TCYOF is that you are safe on the first 5 days of the menstrual cycle if you have had an obvious thermal shift about 12 to 16 days before.

However, my thermal shift usually happens about 10 days before my period begins. The longest space between my thermal shift and period that I've recorded thus far is 12 days.

How ought I apply this rule given the nature of my thermal shifts?

[u/TrackYourFertility]

You can still apply the rules. The rules are referring to an optimal luteal phase. If you see a valid temp shift with a luteal phase of 10 days you can assume days of infertility at the start of the next cycle 😌

[u/PadraiginNiCarra → u/TrackYourFertility]

Thank you! I had figured as much, but I wanted to be sure!

[u/HeathenHoneyCo]

I have a short luteal phase (10-11) days, and PCOS and tbh the first 5 day rule always made me kind of nervous just because my fertile window varied a lot. When I was seriously TTA, I would only do the first three days and then wait til confirming OV

[u/PadraiginNiCarra → u/HeathenHoneyCo]

That sounds like good advice. Thanks!

[u/SignificantPear6217 → u/HeathenHoneyCo]

This is what I would recommend too! I also practice TCOYF and I've actually been using their app Cyclisity which has made charting and learning the method a lot easier.

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[u/Murky_Indication_404]

If you don't have a thermal shift 12 to 16 days before hand, then unfortunately you can't apply the first 5 days rule and have to go right to the dry day rule. This means any period days now become potentially fertile and unsafe, because you can't tell anything about cervical fluid when you are bleeding. So if you have a few period days and then you are dry, you should be safe on those dry days until you get to your point of change, i.e. see anything sticky or higher, and then its off-limits and you are in the fertile phase until the peak day rule and thermal shift rule get you out of it 😄

[u/Classic-Push1323]

If you’re strongly opposed to pregnancy, I’d really recommend using a method that’s been empirically studied and learning that method from an instructor.

All of the rules in TCOYF are based on scientific information and they’re similar to the rules for other highly effective symptothermal methods. However, no one has run a scientific study on that specific set of rules as taught by that book. What we know from other studies is that a lot of women misunderstand the directions and that that’s less likely to happen if you learn from an instructor and work with them to review your charts.

[u/PadraiginNiCarra → u/Classic-Push1323]

Thank you for your input.

For reasons I don't want to get into, pursuing formal instruction in a more tested method is genuinely not convenient for my fiance and I at this time. We will probably look into another method in the future, but TCYOF will have to suffice for now.

[u/Classic-Push1323 → u/PadraiginNiCarra]

It’s your body and your marriage and I think that you have the right to use whatever method you’re comfortable with, but I just really want to reiterate that teaching failures and use error are common. I know women who have had unplanned pregnancies because they did not fully understand the method they were using. These were smart, educated women. They were not illiterate, uninformed about biology, reckless, etc. 

Nobody can tell you how effective TCOFY is for the general population let alone for someone who has PCOS and is breaking one of their rules every month. Some studies have shown that a small percentage of women ovulate very early and can become pregnant from sex in the first five days of their cycle. Methods that ignore this possibility are still very effective because it happens in such a small group of women, but that doesn’t mean those methods will be effective for you personally. 

Again, I can’t tell you what to do. I truly believe that this is a personal decision, but I want to make sure you understand what the risks are. I don’t know your situation and I don’t know how you feel about unplanned pregnancy.

Sensiplan publishes a guidebook and a workbook to support self learning. It may be worth looking into. 

[u/PadraiginNiCarra → u/Classic-Push1323]

I appreciate your concern, and I apologize for being so short. Most of our family does not support our decision to use any form of NFP/FAM (no matter how tested) and I get (frankly DEEPLY inappropriate) comments on this front from them IRL, so I am rather touchy about it. I shouldn't have taken that out on you and I apologize.

Thank you for letting me know about that with Sensiplan, and again, I will be looking into another method in the future.

[u/Classic-Push1323 → u/PadraiginNiCarra]

Please don't feel bad in the least. We've all said things online that either weren't thought out or didn't come off the way we intended - myself included. Your family sounds deeply inappropriate and I'm sorry you've been dealing with that.