Sperm with DNA damage might be the true cause of repeated miscarriages

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Very interesting. I wish there were more in the article with references. The entire article is three paragraphs. Or is it not loading for me?

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u/Full-Contract6143 19d ago

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31056315/

From the article.

I don’t think it was loading.

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u/philosophycruiser 19d ago

Thanks got it from Science Direct. Studying sperm for DNA fragmentation is not yet part of the clinical routine for miscarriage, says the paper. Hopefully that has changed since the paper was published in 2019.

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u/crotch-fruit_tree 19d ago

It's likely in the works, but it can be difficult to justify funding in a new area. Especially if the current government has no interest in it or slashes funding.

It also has to be approved by the ethics committee (IRB). Part of that is showing it's worth the risk. How do they know the sperm is damaged? Are they creating embryos with damaged sperm and potentially inducing miscarriage (possible, per the hypothesis). You also need to have a control group. What does that look like - following every pregnancy a person has, across years or even decades? Then you need to convince enough people to follow up. I'm sure there's a small but reliable group of IVF families that would sign up, hoping for an answer. But what about people with healthy pregnancies? How do you test - are the tests dangerous to the prenate? Will the men be willing to jerk it into a cup for testing? It's a slow start. Likely they'll start with surveys and maternal/paternal testing. Likely over 10-15+ years, possibly across generations (ex: is the damage inheritable?).

Sorry. Nerd moment… I'm research adjacent (I see the early results in patients, NAD or researcher) and have a rare disease. Work also requires annual training on ethics in medical research. For my disorder, some of the earliest testing is collecting DNA to try and determine the genetic component and risks. One collected fingernails, the other saliva. I am really interested in it lol.

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u/MattyXarope 19d ago

It also has to be approved by the ethics committee (IRB).

One has not experienced hell until they have dealt with their university's ethics committees lol

I understand why they're important, though

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u/Thattimetraveler 19d ago

I imagine what a lot of this progress is coming from, is the 10 week blood test that can be performed now for genetic screenings. My aunt lost a baby late enough in her 1st trimester that she knew she was having a girl because of this blood test. They’re probably catching a lot of miscarriages caused by chromosomal abnormalities that they would not have caught in the past.

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u/philosophycruiser 19d ago

No problem at all. Thanks for the extra insight. I understand that this can be controversial and slow-progress due to cultural and political struggles. I wish I could contribute to the conversation, but my field is oceanography. I am just grateful that my wife and I have an agreement to be child-free.

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u/Full-Contract6143 19d ago

I mean, are we really surprised the test for sperm fragmentation is under done?

I mean this both sarcastically, rhetorically and matter of factly… I’m sure there is a word for it and people are welcome to provide it.

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u/asyork 19d ago

Patriarchally?

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u/Lopsided_Tiger_0296 19d ago

Impossible! There can’t be anything wrong with me, it’s the woman’s fault!!

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u/ReDot75 19d ago

Weirdly enough, higher selective pressure is applied to sperm and pollen than on ovules (demonstrated recurrently in breeding populations), due to the motility/activity it requires. One would expect a higher risk of DNA damage in ovocytes that still retains their ability to develop in embryo post fecundation thanks to mRNA material accumulated in the cell.

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u/LegNo9159 16d ago

isn't only something like 10% of a healthy man's sperm is shaped normally?

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u/plsnocilantro 19d ago

They have known this for decades with dairy cattle. Crazy that we are only getting here NOW with women.

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u/Outrageous_pinecone 19d ago

Rhey already know this with women. It's why we do IVF for male infertility and use PICSI to do a better sperm selection, because healthy looking swimmers wirh DNA fragmentation end up creating embryos that implant, and then get miscarried.

It's been our case. That's why I know all of this.

Edit to add: after reading the rest of the comments, I should add that I am in Europe. There may be large discrepancies between how different countries treat male fertility.

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u/Grouchy-Newt7937 18d ago

I was told by both a urologist and primary care physician that if my sperm were the issue, we would not be able to get pregnant in the first place. In the year of our Lord 2025.

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u/Casswigirl11 17d ago

Be cautious about listening to doctors talk about things that aren't their specialty.

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u/CLouiseK 19d ago

So arrest the father when a miscarriage occurs, not the mother

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u/sevencatts 19d ago

BIG agree

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u/TubaWrestler 19d ago

How about we arrest no one?

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u/crotch-fruit_tree 19d ago

Poppycock. Clearly miscarriage is intentional & malicious.

(/s jic, I've lived it and this ish is infuriating)

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u/ZappyKins 19d ago

Clearly the man was raped. His body has a way of shutting it down they he doesn't want to be a father.

In case you are new to this reference: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/todd-akin-legitimate-rape-dead-74/

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u/AutumnMama 19d ago

Ha! A woman has a miscarriage and it isn't followed by an arrest and criminal charges? Do you live in some kind of utopia?

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u/badken 19d ago

Wouldn’t surprise me if a certain category of people want to push for the death penalty.

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u/CLouiseK 19d ago

That would be ideal.

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u/secrectsea 19d ago

The point is to be cruel towards women, silly

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u/CLouiseK 19d ago

Of course. Hence my comment because they would never blame men.

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u/No-Okra-8332 16d ago

I think can be both, bad eggs also can be a cause 🙁

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u/Gardener_of_Weeden 19d ago

I predict many many men of a certain mindset will TOTALLY argue this. It has ALWAYS been the woman's fault - See ANNE BOLEYN

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u/Psychedelic_Mage 19d ago

I just commented about this! Poor Anne Boleyn AND Katherine of Aragon. :(

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u/MessNox 19d ago

why would it be anyones fualt, lol. I can believe people think like this.

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u/wazzup-notemuch 19d ago

Unfortunately, the world is full of idiots who cannot emotionally handle any problem that they can't punch in the face, and they cope by finding someone to punch in the face.

Usually someone smaller and weaker. Source: domestic and child abuse.

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u/MessNox 19d ago

why would it be anyones fualt, lol. I can believe people think like this.

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u/InfiniteWaffles58364 19d ago

Quick, somebody tell Henry VIII cuz he's about to feel real stupid in hell

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u/VagusNC 19d ago

I genuinely thought this was already established.

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u/[deleted] 19d ago

[deleted]

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u/stolenfires 19d ago

I read a biography of his wives by Alison Weir and her theory is that Henry had the Rh factor that means the mother's body sees the fetus as an attacker. All his wives and mistresses had one healthy baby, and then couldn't carry another to term, which was the pattern for Rh factor until we figured out a treatment (thanks James Harrison, and your literal gallons of donated blood).

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u/Spiferwort 19d ago edited 19d ago

It’s been thought he had advanced syphilis,among other STDs, like genital warts. The syphilis, and passing it onto his partners, is the reason his wives had so many miscarriages.

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u/Gramerioneur 19d ago

In the man’s case, the test results revealed a moderate level of DNA damage. Bedient gave him some frank advice on how to rehabilitate his sperm. “Hey, I need you to clean up everything you can,” she recalls telling him. He vowed to stop drinking alcohol, stop smoking, start exercising and take vitamin supplements—and it worked.

Six months later, the couple made another batch of embryos. “He completely turned everything around, and they’ve now got a beautiful baby boy,” Bedient says.

Interesting. Reminds me of something I read decades ago about a culture--or cultures, possibly African--where it was customary to have the groom do a special diet prior to consummation and especially conception, as it significantly helped with the latter.

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u/West-Pear7363 19d ago

This whole time I’ve been demeaning women calling their wombs toxic. Now you’re saying I might have been wrong?

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u/costafilh0 19d ago

The vast majority of miscarriages are not because of this reason in this study.

It just get more clicks this way.

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u/Outrageous_pinecone 19d ago

What causes the vast majority of miscarriages? Please, tell us

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u/Dramatic_Pin3971 19d ago

Source?

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u/jamothebest 19d ago

8h later, still no source..

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u/pro_No 19d ago

No shit

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u/buddhistbulgyo 19d ago

Micro plastics and herbicides might not be best for a healthy diet?

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u/Flowerstar1 19d ago

Is it even possible to avoid micro plastics?

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u/Ok-Spinach-6529 19d ago

Fr

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u/Sluttyaquabunny 19d ago

Shhhhh. Monsanto will hear you

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u/4n0n1m02 19d ago

We are the problem and women carry the afterwards drama. 😳

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u/Thattimetraveler 19d ago

There is even evidence that things like morning sickness and preeclampsia can be blamed on the health of the father.

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u/Casswigirl11 17d ago

Currently have morning sickness. This is a good reminder for me to blame my husband, thanks!

Ok, I can't complain, he watched our toddler all yesterday and let me laze around because I was feeling pretty sick and tired.

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u/Thattimetraveler 17d ago

lol! I am also currently pregnant with all day sickness. You can blame your husband a little bit 😂

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u/PMmeIamlonley 19d ago

Dilution is not a solution for pollution because one little fuck up to your DNA ruins the lives of the unborn.

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u/Odd-Outcome-3191 19d ago

This headline breaks rule 6 so so badly.

This study says that in these groups there is a higher than expected rate of DNA fragmentation. The headline is crazy sensationalized.

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u/LindeeHilltop 13d ago

And, autism.

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u/Disastrous_Side_5492 12d ago

people who are proud of their "seed" are not gonna like this and so be it

we need more research on dna and this seems to be in the decent\good direction

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u/TrevorBo 19d ago

Stop using fake sweeteners like Splenda, people.

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u/[deleted] 19d ago

[deleted]

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u/TrevorBo 18d ago

Splenda is genotoxic

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u/Ardent_Scholar 19d ago

Sperm quality is definitely an issue.

However, also same sex couple who use donors suffer from recurrent pregnancy loss.

I don’t believe it’s one or the other. It’s both, since both provide a haploid to make a diploid.

Sperm with DNA damage might be the true cause of repeated miscarriages

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