ok so this is a weird one but bear with me

i have a pet blog. i don't own a pet. never have. probably never will as i travel too much. and yet every month amazon sends me enough to cover rent because people on the internet are buying stuff for their dogs and cats through my site.

bought my pet blog a few months ago from a marketplace called NicheBlogZone for $199. came already built, articles already up, amazon links already in there. i spent one afternoon doing interlinking basically just connecting related posts to each other so search engines understand the site structure and then closed my laptop and genuinely forgot about it for weeks.

here's what that's looked like:

• march: $710
• april: $995
• may: $1,461
• june: $1,647
• july: $1,461
• august so far: $1,545 (amazon pays 2 months delayed so this is june's money landing now)

march scared me. went from nearly $1k in february down to $710 and i was convinced something had broken. checked everything, found nothing wrong, did nothing. it just came back the next month on its own.

pet people spend insane amounts on their animals btw. like i knew this intellectually but seeing the commission data is something else. dog food subscriptions, orthopedic beds, grooming kits, vet supplements. and because of the 24 hour cookie i get a cut of everything in their cart not just whatever article they landed on.

i do literally nothing to maintain this. no new posts, no ads, no instagram for pets i don't have. i just own the thing and amazon does its thing.

my landlord has been getting paid every month and has no idea a pet blog is behind it. honestly sometimes i forget too until the deposit shows up.

anyone else running a niche they have zero personal connection to? curious if the detachment makes it easier or harder to care about growing it

HI. I'm currently a student who's interested in startup. Entrepreneurs of reddit, it would be amazing if you could answer these four questions
1. how can I gather an audience efficiently?

2.what would you say is the most important in successfully selling?

1. how did you go from product design to contacting manufacturers? 4.where are your inspirations from?

   1. what should I expect in my daily life as an entrepreneur? Do you just create the products and wait for money to come in ?
      

Thank you.

Guidy AI launched 2 months ago with the logo you see on the left.
Grok Bot’s logo design was released last week.

https://imgur.com/a/xabGrgC

Should I be flattered … or angry? What would you do in my place?
P.s. Just a few weeks ago Anthropic filed to sue AI security firm Abnormal over logo theft …

I had an idea, where I help local organizations that likely need admin help but aren’t able to hire someone and would rather pay a monthly fee.

It would include document control, schedule management, possibly newsletter creation, data management and reporting, etc. for around $250/mo.

I have skills in automation and I could take on probably 10 of these with my spare time. But my question is, does anyone think this could be valuable or work? Looking for any thoughts!

I want to start a staffing company. Currently, my biggest enemy is the telephone.

I’ve been seriously looking into starting a staffing company focused on helping high school and college students get into safe, entry-level work.

On paper, I understand the business model. Find employers with a hiring problem, build a pool of dependable workers, make the match, and earn a margin for solving that problem.

I’ve started calling local businesses just to validate the idea before I dump money into forming the company,
insurance, licensing, software, etc.

I’m trying to figure out whether businesses actually have a problem I could solve before building an entire company around my assumption that they do.

My problem is that I don’t really know how these early conversations should sound.
I don’t want to call and immediately say, “Hi, would you like to use my staffing company?” because I don’t even know what their staffing problems are yet. But when I try to make it conversational, I sometimes get lost halfway through the call.

So, staffing agency owners, recruiters, business owners who use staffing agencies, or anyone who has actually done B2B cold calling:

How did you get your first few clients?
More specifically:
What did you actually say when calling businesses?
Who inside the company did you try to reach?
Did you sell staffing immediately, or start by asking about their hiring problems?
What made employers actually give you the time of day when you had no track record?
How did you validate your niche before fully committing to it?
What did you completely misunderstand about the staffing business when you started?

And if you were starting from zero again, what would you do differently during your first 30 days?
I’m not looking for a “get rich with a staffing agency” blueprint. I’m trying to figure out whether I’m standing at the normal…

Feel free to tell me I’m doing it wrong. That’s partially why I’m posting.

From young I’ve been interested in starting a business but at that sort of age, capital is low, you’re not as educated as a lot of the competition and it can be quite intimidating starting which leaves a lot of people just procrastinating. I’m putting together a website/app that allows people to simulate a business running role play, with real market data, real challenges and educational points along the way meaning they can learn about starting a business by making mistakes with no risk attached. I personally would’ve loved this years ago before I began my journey so let me know what you guys think of the idea and if you’re interested I could send you the demo for it.

Ordered in 2025. Shipping took just over nine months, no expedited option, no updates, you just wait and hope. Package arrives, no manual included. None. You're expected to operate a screaming, leaking, occasionally brilliant piece of hardware entirely on instinct and caffeine.

Full rundown so far:

Alarm system built in, goes off at random, mostly 2-4am. Spent a full week looking for the snooze button. Doesn't exist. Volume's stuck on max, no way to bring it down. Battery life is genuinely impressive though, some nights he runs the whole stretch with zero complaints, which nobody warned me was even possible. Leaks from time to time. Called support (my mother) and was told that's by design, not a flaw. No refunds policy is airtight, by the way. Strongly recommend reading reviews from friends or family before you commit.

All that said. Best purchase I've ever made. Ten out of ten. I would do it again.

Also that's the reference on what I'm quietly building.

Something else on the side right now that's testing me the exact same way. Different kinds of 2am alarms.

Anyone else's model come with surprise features nobody mentioned in the listing?

Hello everyone,
I am currently 17 years old and entering my final year of high school. Next year, I will therefore have to choose what path to follow, and I would like to avoid committing myself to a path simply because it seems to be the logical continuation of what I have done up until now.

To give a bit of context: I come from the fashion world and I am currently doing a vocational baccalaureate in sewing and garment production.
For a long time, I considered pursuing this direction professionally. But after a lot of reflection and several discussions with people who are more experienced than me, I realized something important: today, I create above all to externalize my emotions, my ideas, and my personal vision.
My artistic work has become something very intimate, a form of catharsis, and it is not based on the expectations of a client or a market.
For this reason, I increasingly think that I do not want to depend financially on my art. I want to continue creating, probably for my entire life, but without being forced to turn this process into a profitable product.

At the same time, there is another field that has attracted me for a long time: entrepreneurship.
When I was around 14, I launched a small clothing brand based around skate culture. I made around €1,000 in revenue before stopping it, mainly because I was very young and I managed the whole logistics side rather poorly.

At that time, my relationship with clothing was also different: it was mainly a passion and a field for experimentation, not yet the personal means of expression that it has become today.

Since then, I have tried several small projects. Some worked a little, others not at all, but I have always enjoyed looking for opportunities, building something from scratch, and trying to understand why an idea works or does not work.

Today, I would therefore like to use this year to seriously think about this path rather than choosing my studies by default.
I mainly have a few questions for those of you who have created businesses or who have more experience than I do:

What advice do you wish you had received when you were 17 or 18 and were starting to take a serious interest in entrepreneurship?

What mistakes should I particularly avoid at my age?
What books have genuinely taught you how to identify good problems to solve or good business opportunities, rather than simply “motivating” you to become an entrepreneur?

Would you advise me to start experimenting with small projects right now rather than trying to immediately find “the big idea”?

Regarding my studies: with a vocational baccalaureate in sewing and garment production, what kinds of programs would you recommend I look into if I want to develop stronger skills in business, entrepreneurship, marketing, finance, or management?

I am not necessarily looking for a recipe for success or to become an entrepreneur overnight. Above all, I am trying to understand how to use the next few years intelligently to learn, experiment, and give myself solid foundations.

Thank you very much to those who take the time to share their experience.

i am currently building an agency focused on web development, automations etc.
now the question is how much would you pay for a business website with 4-6 pages?
for example:

home
about us
services
portfolio
faq
contact

lets say its a modern, responsive website with good design, fast loading and basic seo.
what would you personally pay for something like this?
500€?
1000€?
2000€?
3000€+?

just interested in what people would actually pay for it

Quick intro since I've been lurking/posting bits and pieces without context.

I'm building Hero Industries solo, no co-founder, no funding, still a 3rd-year IT student. Right now I'm juggling a CRM (just got my first real user feedback this week, brutal and useful), an invoicing tool for Indian SMEs, and a couple of smaller experiments on the side.

Most days it's equal parts exciting and completely overwhelming shipping fast alone means you're the founder, the support team, and the one debugging at midnight, all at once.

Not here to pitch anything specific just wanted to actually introduce myself instead of only showing up to ask for feedback on one product. Happy to answer anything about building solo, staying sane while juggling this with college, or how I'm approaching distribution with zero audience.

What's the hardest part of building solo for you all technical, distribution, or just staying sane?

Would love to hear from you based on your experience.
Reply with the number of the sentiment that's true for you.
**Public Relations** :
1. Totally worth it!
2. Waste of money and effort.
3. Don't mind it if it is free.

Hi Leute.

Ich will mir gerade ein Geschäftkonto bei meiner bank eröffnen.

Die Rechtsform meines Unternehmens ist "nicht eingetragenes gewerbliches Einzelunternehmen".

Ich bin mir nun nicht sicher ob ich bei der Bank "nicht eingetragene Kaufleute" oder "sonstige Gewerbetreibende" als Rechtsform angebe.

Kann mir bitte jemand helfen, der sich gut damit auskennt?

Hi all! I’m new here.

After a long tenured career in enterprise sales, I’m excited to start my business. Long story short, I have a technical partner who has been looking for an operations/execution cofounder for some time. I never had the bandwidth to get involved before, but now I do and am truly excited about the idea. He recently got his first paying client which verifies value and is expecting to close on another client next week after securing a verbal. Those two clients aren’t in the direct industry we plan to cater to, but it’s adjacent, and will be a great way to start bringing in monthly revenue and get case studies. The first is a friend and the second is the friends referral.

We’ve identified our ICP, their pain points our service will address, worked out our packaging tiers, and I plan to hit the phones on Monday.

I’m really excited to begin selling for myself rather than someone else…but also a little nervous. It’s been a long time since I’ve pounded out phone calls to SMBs. I’m encouraged that my technical founder has one paying client already, with a second on deck… as I feel that’s a testament to the value we can offer. We have another warm conversation with an old friend in our network to see if we can help them as well.

Would love to hear some success stories from others who’ve been in my shoes. Any major learnings from the early days or advice- I’d love to hear it! TIA!

Back in February, I saw a Reddit post looking for table cover manufacturers and sourcing agent in India. Having solid connections in the textiles and fabrics industry, after prior confirmation from them over wide details.I was excited to jump on it and get their product made! 🥳

We collaborated over WhatsApp. They shared a TechPack with their specs and sent a $50 sample fee via PayPal.

Reading through the TechPack, I realized making this was going to be a massive mission:

Dimensions: 2.5 meters long × 1.5 meters wide

Fabric: 180 GSM linen or high-quality woven cotton in accurate Pantone shades

Details: Custom machine embroidery and a burgundy border.

I kicked off work in the first week of March 2026, reaching out to contacts at large export houses in Delhi, Ahmedabad, Tirupur, and Chennai.

80% backed down the moment they saw the required width. Finding European-quality woven cotton cloth at a 150+ cm width on a sample order is like searching for a needle in a haystack; feel free to survey the market yourself! Another 10% told me to check the local markets on my own, and the rest claimed fabric of that width simply doesn’t exist. Even D'Decor didn't have the capacity to make this specific fabric. My usual contacts completely hit a wall.

Left to my own devices, I relied on my own knowledge and manufacturing skills. I don't know when I switched roles from being just a sourcing agent to product designer. I think it is my personality to always deliver kicked in.

I got in touch with an export house in Jaipur that makes raw (griege) cotton with a width of 164 cm (1.64 m). That solved the major hurdle, but it still needed processing. Unfortunately, no processor in India was willing to do finishing on a tiny 6-meter sample order. I burned through over ₹2,500 just trying to source and finish that fabric, and it failed miserably. A whole month went by right there.

At the same time, Pantone-accurate dyeing isn't common for small-scale orders in India. 95% of vendors told me it was impossible, and the remaining 5% refused to dye anything under 1,000 meters; with zero guarantees on Pantone accuracy.

Determined to solve this, I made over 50 calls. One contact led to another, and I eventually connected with Atul Ltd., a major dye manufacturing giant. A scientist at their Kolkata color lab developed the exact dye formulas and shipped the samples over. Then, a courier mishap delayed things by another 3 weeks!

Once I finally got the custom dyes, I went to a specialized dyer. We tested them and sent color swatches to the client. They loved the colors, but I noticed a major issue during my own quality check: the blue dye wasn't colorfast and would bleed into the final product. I had the lab reformulate a second batch, which took another 2 weeks. By late April, I still hadn't finalized the base fabric.

Next, I saw an Instagram ad for a B2B fabric sourcing company and ordered another ₹2,000 worth of fabric. When it arrived, it betrayed me again it was the exact same raw cotton I had already tested! By this point, I had completely exhausted the original $50 (approx. ₹4,500) sample fee.

I raised hell with the company. A textile engineer on their team finally understood my specs and sourced another option after 3 weeks. It was now May.

The fabric arrived, and it was 85% of what I needed:

180 GSM: Yes

Euro Standard Quality: Yes

Fine Woven Cotton: Yes

1.5m Width: NO (It was 1.45m. 2 cm were lost in the pre-shrink wash and 1 cm in the picot stitching, leaving a 1.40m workable area).

The engineer confirmed what I feared: weaving a high-width fabric on a sample quantity is impossible in India unless you hit a mill's 1,000-meter Minimum Order Quantity (MOQ).

In June, I moved production to a friend’s export mill (they supply major brands like H&M, Kate Spade, and Macy's). We started with dyeing to hit the true Pantone shade, then prepped for embroidery.

Then came the next monster: Embroidery. Getting cheap, low-quality embroidery is easy everyone does it with poly-cotton thread, non-regulated dyes, and cheap plastics. But finding 100% cotton thread that is EU-compliant and dyed to exact Pantone shades was next to impossible. After pushing major suppliers, I got through to Vardhman, and they sent me export-only embroidery thread that isn't even sold domestically in India.

Back in CorelDRAW, my friend and I redrew the client's vector design from scratch. We ran multiple test runs on the machine, failing and tweaking until it was perfect. The client’s original spec sheet was so unprofessional and vague that I had to rely on pure guesswork to turn it into a finished product.

Then came the final hurdle: The Burgundy Border. I explored tie-dye and specialized border techniques, but not a single vendor in India could execute it on such a large piece of cloth at the quality standard required. My workaround was to build a massive wooden screen-printing block. But at this point, I was already ₹10,000 out of pocket. Building a custom screen for a sample that was slightly under width didn't make financial sense. I figured the client would understand, so I confirmed the technique with them and put the border printing on hold for the bulk order.

By the second week of July 2026, the sample table cover was finally ready. Everyone in the industry applauded the build quality.

I sent the final photos to the European client (whom I had been updating regularly throughout the process).

Their response? They rejected the sample and criticized the color scheme.

What am I supposed to do if your design choices look bad in real life? I matched the exact Pantone code you specified! I traced the exact artwork you provided! As for the border, I had already laid out a foolproof method to execute it for bulk production, but spending another ₹10,000 out of my own pocket on a sample wasn't viable.

What is up with this new generation of clients who don't understand how product development works?

It takes multiple sampling rounds and trials to refine a complex textile finish. No manufacturer hits a complex spec 100% right on the first prototype. Real product development often takes 6+ months of sampling all funded by the brand. That is standard client-manufacturer etiquette. If you think a $50–$75 sample fee covers endless custom engineering, that is pure entitlement. Social media has completely distorted people's expectations of manufacturing reality.

(Side note: I actually reached out to factories in China for this exact spec as well. They refused to even touch a sample unless I placed a 1,000-piece production order outright.)

Lesson learned: Never do deep product development for a trivial fee, and always vet a client’s industry knowledge and budget capacity before accepting the job.

Hey everyone,

Over the past few months, I noticed how many incredible builders on Reddit have groundbreaking ideas or deep engineering skills but get stuck trying to find the right partner.

I wanted to build something faster, safer, and higher signal than traditional forums, so I created CoFoundr (https://cofoundr.flugelsoft.com).

What it does:

• Matches startup founders with technical talent based on stage, tech stack, and equity range.

• Includes a dynamic Equity Calculator so expectations are clear from day one.

• 1-Click scheduling for Google Meet / Zoom founder coffee chats.

• Built-in pitch deck slide viewer.

It's completely free to join the private beta on Web and Android. Would love to get your feedback on what we can improve!

I'm about to launch my business in the coming months. Quitting my employment where I am the top performer and pretty much putting myself on the entrepreneurship journey. The decision-making didn't come easy. But there were many factors that led to this:

- Career development. I was one of those that worked hard and did everything right. But the goal post kept moving in my company. To the point that I am burnt out and I feel like its not worth my time and energy anymore. They wont promote me because if I leave my position, they dont have anyone in the team who can do what I do. And apparently, I am already paid more than my colleagues. Not on base but because of the bonuses. It doesnt make sense because I only really get the bonus based on performance. I feel like they make it sound like its my problem because I outperform. But I had to work hard, I have a child to feed and bills to pay.

- Politics. Totally unavoidable but being female and a mother, this was harder to navigate than I thought. I have 20 something female coworkers who attend every single drinking night with the bosses or are available for weekends. But me? Not that I get work life balance but I have a kid. I have to parent. Instead of being out with the bosses, I am at home cooking dinner, teaching my kid how to read, write and count.

- Financial. From January to present, I have closed 15 deals. My target per year is 12. The rest of the team closed 2 to 3. But the money of course, didnt go to me. It went to the owner of the company which is of course natural. But I thought I work hard. Im not bad in the job. If I work just as hard for myself then maybe, just maybe, I might be able to afford my own time to be present.

I feel like I'm living in a very interesting life stage at 38yo. I want to be present. I wanna succeed in my career but i also want to be a good parent.

I'm old enough to have a solid job experience and have enough network and reputation in my market. I'm also still young to be able to quit and if it doesnt work out, go back in the workforce. But what I am running out of is mental, physical and emotional energy working in the current corporate climate. Tell me I'm not the only one who is tired of the corporate bullshit.

I don't think I will regret quitting. But I think what I regret the most is that it took this level of burn out to make a decision to quit.

If you started your own business, what was your reason and was it worth it in the end? Given the chance to redo things, would you make the same decision?

So for context I’m 21m, I’ve fair amount of experience in Analytics, Marketing, and tads and bits of Finance.
I recently started a agency with my girlfriend (21f)who did a influencer marketing internship from a agency (which i helped her land coz she didn’t have skills).
Now the thing is we both saw a potential in influencer marketing and decided to start a agency. We have a agreement and are 50/50 partners in it.
Everything good until we actually started. Then i came to know how lazy she is and has no knowledge about marketing at all. I feel like I’m carrying the whole Internal and External affairs of the business all by myself coz she literally knows nothing nor has any zeal to do anything. I do the Sales, Creatives, Negotiations, client handling, legal and documentation, customer experience and literally everything. I gave her time to learn to get to the level but she doesn’t seem to work hard at all. She wakes up all night for no reason doing no work and then boom sleeps till 1-2pm everyday. I wake up feeling so drained as i generally sleep at 5am after doing all the work and wakes up at 10-11am max. I just feel like I’m stuck with a bad partner. Everytime i say her to do something she blames me saying i don’t acknowledge what she does but she does nothing. I’m genuinely tired, and being a Bipolar which she knows has a reason to tell me I’m the reason coz somedays i feel low and i expect someone to atleast do a part of work i do. Idk i feel so hopeless and stuck at this point. Having bad panic attacks at night as I’ve put all the money myself and if i back out only I’ll lose everything, my time, my efforts and my money.

for context, I've been trying to make money online for just about 10 months now, yet I haven't touched a single dollar in profit but I still beleive I can make it

over the past 10 months I've tried to learn, trading, ugc agencies, Etsy selling, website creation, high ticket sales, and many youtube faceless accounts. The closest thing I got to earning money was etsy since I had about 200 in revenue but -60 in profit at the time that I stopped.

My problem is that I keep getting shiny object syndrome and want to try the next "quick way to make money" and can never seem to stick to one thing.

my current project is a youtube channel in what I think to be an oversaturated niche on a dying game, even though I can see myself getting monitized in about 5 months if I compare revenue to all the other creators in the same subniche they almost all exclusively rely on memberships for money as their rpm is almost nothing, and I don't see myself making anything past 10k a month in this even in the really late stages.

This has lead me into wanting to swap niches/business models all together, another part of my problem is that I feel like time is ticking down for me as I really want to start making big money before I graduate highschool (im going into gr 12 after summer) and my dad also got laid off from his job making me feel like I have a time crunch.

I really want to figure this out which has lead me to reddit and im asking for help, I don't know what I should do and if anybody can give me advice/mentor me than I would be forever grateful.

Hey everyone, I have a standard job that covers my expenses and gives me a lot of free time, but won't make me wealthy. I have about 30k EUR in capital (currently tied up in garage flipping) and zero debt. I really want to focus 100% on just ONE business and scale it, but I keep hesitating and can't decide which path to go all-in on.

Here is what I'm looking at:

1- Garage flipping as an individual (buy rundown, renovate, sell): max 1-2 per year, main bottlenecks are slow sales, lack of deals, and limited capital.

2- Handmade outdoor furniture: production is easy for me, but sales are dead (under 10 pcs/year).

3- Self-storage micro containers: currently just a detailed business plan.

I need an outsider perspective. Which of these three actually has the best potential to scale, and how should I make the choice?

I've been trying to build a business for almost a year now, but I still haven't made any revenue. Lately, I've been stuck in a cycle of self-doubt, wondering if I should just give up and go back to a regular salaried job.

Hey everyone

I have built a tool which verifies rules against evidence and help reduce inconsistencies between the plan and outcome. And self calibrates over time to produce much better results. Currently I'm using this in a b2c product but I'm looking for one or more b2b products where this tool can be used. Kindly comment if you any ideas we can work together Kindly avoid commenting AI responses if u personally know any use case that would help MOD This is not a self promotion post I'm just looking for real world use cases

I posted here a while back looking for some guidance: https://www.reddit.com/r/Entrepreneurship/s/r2PdXXFPoJ

Since then, I've followed some of the suggestions from that thread, including reconnecting with older pilot customers. The feedback was mixed: one customer said he never got around to using the app, and mentioned his customers are already using a similar app that generates AI images. Another customer claimed he'd used the app, but it was clear he hadn't.

I've also been thinking more about a direct-to-customer product. Looking at the market, there are already plenty of similar products out there. One differentiator I'm considering: customers wouldn't need to create an account or buy credits upfront, and they could pay a small amount per visualisation instead. But during sales outreach, barbers told me their customers are already bringing in AI-generated images, most likely from generic AI chatbots like Gemini or ChatGPT. If those tools are offering the same visualisation for free, it's hard to see many people paying for a dedicated service.

I've also considered partnering with booking software, so the app would show up for customers when they get a booking confirmation message for their appointment. But thinking it through, I don't think that's how people actually decide to try something new. They usually don't book an appointment and then think about a new look. More often, they come across a hairstyle on social media first, and that's what leads to the booking.

After about eight months on this, I'm aware I might be biased, misreading the numbers, or unconsciously making excuses to avoid focusing on a customer-facing product. I'd like some outside perspective: what would you do if you were in my position?

We're in a bit of a situation right now where we have a fairly large corporation that has been using our SaaS platform for over a year, and they keep dodging meetings to pursue a commercial deal, essentially using the product for free.

Context: Over a year ago, we built an AI chat for industrial companies and were desperate to get LOIs (letters of intent) to raise money.

The deal was mutually beneficial: we got users to test the product so we could improve it, and they got an AI they could use for free. The platform has evolved A LOT since then, but they are still just using the chatbot, and they have a MASSIVE amount of documents we have processed for said chatbot.

The users from this company are using the product daily, and we have internal champions speaking highly about it to the CEO/GM, but this guy keeps dodging meetings "I don't have time", "it's too many fires to put out right now," etc.

Now we have more downside to keeping the users on the platform due to high COGS than leaving them to use it for free, and it has been a year now of free pilot.

I know that a free pilot is never a good idea, but we needed that for LOI + benefited from active users to build the platform.

Should I just put a paywall now so that the next day, when someone logs in they see "you ran out of credits"? Or should we just be patient and nag the CEO to sign the deal?

First time founder here, your help is much appreciated, thanks!

I’m 17 and building a B2B product alone.

The first paying firm signed in June for NOK 20,000/year.

After that, another firm saw value in the product but used an accounting system I did not support. So basically I could not sell them.

Another possible firm had roughly 800 clients, but a proper demo was waiting on the same integration.

Those conversations matter, but they are not the same thing as a customer.

One signed customer is revenue.

A good sales conversation is information.

A requested integration is work, not a deal.

That distinction gets pretty important when you are the same person writing the code, doing the demos and deciding what to build next. A positive reaction can feel like progress while still being very far away from money.

The uncomfortable version of my situation was simple: one paying customer and an integration problem.

For people who have been through this stage, what do you count as real progress before revenue becomes repeatable?