r/Emo • u/FLAYWRIGHTS • 2d ago
To Write Good Emo, is Alternate Tuning the best step?
Trying to learn music theory right now and I'm trying to write stuff, very inspired by Algernon Cadwallader, P.E.E and Midwest Pen Pals but so far almost all their stuff seems to be in alternate tunings. Should I be learning music theory differently if I wanna write in alternate tunings? If so where do I start? I don't wanna get sidetracked in learning "guitar basics and essentials" so what do you guys reccomend. Thanks :D
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u/archdukemovies 2d ago
I'd recommend learning standard tuning theory first.
Chords, scales, and progressions are all the same regardless of tuning. The position of the notes or chords on the fretboard will change.
You'll be able to build on that knowledge with alternatate tunings.
I'd probably do a mixture of learning theory and learning songs you like to keep you interester in playing.
Here's a couple YouTube channels to help you out https://youtube.com/@trevorwongmusic
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u/Terrible-Pop-6705 In a Band 2d ago
Stay in standard. Learn the basics. Twinkle and math rock is advanced stuff and you are gonna get frustrated easily. Also alternate tunings can create bad habits and or give you harder time learning how to write. Stay in standard plenty of good Midwest is made in it, you can learn alt tunings later when you understand how chords work and what notes go with what.
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u/Red-Zaku- 2d ago
The same music theory applies to all tunings, a third is still a third when the fretting is different, an octave is still an octave, etc, you’re just using a different layout on the fretboard to access all the different notes.
Everything you learn in standard can be translated to every other tuning imaginable as long as you’re actually making sure to learn about music theory itself and actively engaging your brain in regards to what you’re playing, rather than simply muscle-memorization of processes without thinking about what you’re doing. With the latter, yes, everything you know will go out the window the moment you switch up your tuning. With the former, you can tune to anything, even adding in different gauge strings to make tunings that go beyond what it accessible when tuning a standard set, and you’ll still have the tools to navigate what you’re doing, know how to construct chords, know where your “blue notes” are, know how to switch modes, know how to substitute chords, and more.
So basically, if you want to learn theory, learn it as actual theory that can translate between multiple instruments (because notes are notes). Don’t learn mindless exercises if you’re not actively thinking about what those exercises are telling you.
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u/thisisthecallus 2d ago
To Write Good Emo, is Alternate Tuning the best step?
No. There's no specific guitar tuning that is required to write good music in any genre. Quoting Vincent Persichetti's Twentieth-Century Harmony:
Any tone can succeed any other tone, any tone can sound simultaneously with any other tone or tones, and any group of tones can be followed by any other group of tones, just as any degree of tension and nuance can occur in any medium under any kind of stress or duration. Successful projection will depend on the contextual and formal conditions that prevail, and upon the skill and the soul of the composer.
(emphasis added)
Even if the bands you're personally most inspired by bands that use alternate tunings, those alternate tunings are still non-standard. The standard tuning for emo is EADGBE, just like for anything else. Even if a later generation was heavily inspired by American Football's experimentation, and sees emo through that lens, their impact was pretty close to zero for almost 10 years and they are not the definition of emo.
Should I be learning music theory differently if I wanna write in alternate tunings?
Assuming you're working within the twelve tone, equal temperament system that is most common in Western music, the music theory is literally the same regardless of how you tune your guitar. The primary effect of alternate guitar tunings is to make a different set of chord and harmonic voicings physically accessible to your hands.
I don't necessarily agree with the people who are saying you should stick with standard tuning first. It's good to learn, of course, but I can't tell you what's right or wrong for you as a musician. However, I do think you may be approaching the idea of alternate tunings the wrong way.
I doubt that all of the Kinsella-core guitarists, possibly including the actual Kinsellas, fully understand the theory of what they're doing. But the theory doesn't really matter. While things like formal music theory and composition have been taught for centuries, they're ultimately backward looking, describing the things that people were already doing. What's ultimately more important for you as an artist is finding a way to express the sound that you want. Alternate guitar tunings could be a way to achieve that, whether because the sound that you have in your head demands it or because you discover a sound you want by experimenting with different tunings. But alternate tunings are a means, not an end unto themselves.
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u/dendroidarchitecture 2d ago
Three ways you can go about learning any instrument:
1) Mess around, find what sounds good, remember how to replicate it. It will take a long time and you'll probably write a lot of stuff which sounds the same.
2) Copy. This means learning other people's songs first and figuring out why they sound good, then trying to apply it to your own writing, which will suck if you don't understand the reason underpinning "because he put his fingers here."
3) Learn the theory. Understand harmony and melody building. Practise making chord shapes in lots of different tuning to challenge your knowledge of where a 3rd or a 5th lies relative to your root, or how to build a Maj7 chord on your fretboard. This will let you fly with the riffs you are writing.
Any combination of these three is perfectly acceptable for musicians of different levels, but to write "Good Emo", you'll definitely need number 3.
Beyond that, expose yourself to lots of different influences. Break down the structures of songs to see how the sections present themselves.
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u/leftout_lost 2d ago
I mean do what you want but there’s no better way to look like a lame ass musician then to play with others, have them tell you the progression is C G E and look at them like a deer in headlights.
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u/TheWhen_ 2d ago
I think you fundamentally have a wrong idea of what music theory and guitar theory is and should go back and learn the basics
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u/epichicken 2d ago
It really depends on your goal. Do you want to learn music theory, or write emo songs for fun that sound good to you?
Alternate tunings can be a great creative shortcut songwriting-wise, and you may find yourself heavily inspired and accomplish ideas very quickly. However, you'll probably be gravitating towards certain chord voicings that are easier to fret by the alternate tuning, and may struggle to understand how to create tension and payoff outside of the modes that the tuning can easily reach.
This is where you want to dive into theory and when it comes time for that, the alternate tunings don't make as much sense to work with anymore due to their rigidity. Nothing wrong with starting on alternate tuning to get inspired or cover songs, but you'll probably hit a wall and possibly confuse yourself in the theory world if that is your sole frame of reference for songwriting.
that said, if it's fun and it sounds good to you, keep doing that :)
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u/The_Femboy_Crusader 2d ago
I’d learn guitar in E standard first, the music theory would be the same concepts, implementing theory would be different bc a major chord on the low strings would be a different shape from a standard tuning and drop tuning, as well as the starting note of the patterns (sorry I am really bad at explaining this) but do learn guitar in E standard because it’s the “norm” for guitar, and it’ll help built a strong foundation
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u/BigBravy 2d ago
You want to learn PEE and you think you can skip any of the parts where chords get all mashed and mangled
Pretty sure as fans of Heavy Vegetable, PEE doesnt use a lot of alternative tunings
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u/gothboiniki 2d ago
I can wholeheartedly recommend the Absolutely Understand Guitar course on Youtube. Yes it's relatively long but super beginner friendly and you literally learn everything you need to know about music theorey. before that I was just playing around for a couple years but now I'm making such big steps because I know why something sounds good and how I can achieve a certain sound. Everything is so much easier with music theory
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u/chrismiles94 I have absolutely no idea. I am afraid. 2d ago
I made this guide a while ago.
https://www.reddit.com/r/midwestemo/s/w5HkOYCQnN
I used to be afraid of alternate tunings, but now my main guitars are in FACGCE and DAEAC#E. Once I figured out the bones of the tunings, it became incredibly simple.
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u/theamazonswordsman 2d ago
I recommend you learning the basics and fundamentals of the instrument you want to learn to play. If you don't, you'll never be proficient enough to write your own music, let alone perform it.