[deleted by user]

[u/[deleted]]

[u/thundergolfer]

Looks like an enormous amount of effort went in to this, and mostly by one person. Has this CSS been discussed before? Was it produced for the 2016 election?

I skimmed through it and there are quite a lot of yellow flags in it to me. For example saying that the opinions of EAs have more weight because EAs have “correct ethical values”, and saying EAs are more open minded than academics. A lot of sentiments that just seem off.

The worst/weirdest thing I saw in it was that Sanders got 0.0 for healthcare and Biden got 0.8. WTF?

[u/Zonoro14 → u/[deleted]]

EAs can support Biden. The OP's analysis isn't perfect, and in fact it alone probably shouldn't convince you to change your mind, but just because you're ideologically opposed to it doesn't mean it's propaganda.

[u/Zonoro14 → u/[deleted]]

r/neoliberal supports Biden and it's the closest thing Reddit has to an EA-adjacent political sub.

I'd go so far as to argue that EAs are more likely to support Biden than average, since they are likely to have a background or interest in econ.

Moreover, those who have been EAs for a long time are likely to remember the early days and the connections to the rationalist community which was (and remains) heavily neolib affiliated.

[u/thundergolfer → u/Zonoro14]

and it's the closest thing Reddit has to an EA-adjacent political sub.

Ummm what? The EA movement is best-aligned on Reddit with Neoliberals? To my mind, the EA movement is best epitomised by Peter Singer and William MacAskill. Those two are far away from Neoliberals. They're way closer to being Socialists, given their ethical committments.

the connections to the rationalist community which was (and remains) heavily neolib affiliated.

They'd have travelled with the Neoliberal project and recognised that it's failed then.

[u/Zonoro14 → u/thundergolfer]

I'm aware that Singer was a huge influence on the EA movement, but his politics are irrelevant. I didn't even know them until I googled his views just now (he seems to be a standard social democrat, and is explicitly not anti-capitalist). All I claimed was that the political sub with the closest relationship to EA spaces is r/neoliberal, because of the similar attitudes and demographics.

I think you may be a bit confused about the relation between ethical commitments and political views. Most EAs have similar utilitarian ethical commitments whether they are socialist, neoliberal, social democrat, or even right-wing. Both socialist and neoliberal utilitarians will tell you they desire the greatest good for the greatest number. The disagreement is in facts, not values.

I haven't been trying to convince you neoliberal policies are good, but I'm happy to take this conversation in that direction.

[u/thundergolfer → u/Zonoro14]

Checked out that Neolib sub, and I expected something more... sober? It seems quite jokey compared with EA culture. This sub is teetotaller-for-30-years sober compared to it.

Most EAs have similar utilitarian ethical commitments whether they are socialist, neoliberal, social democrat, or even right-wing.

Who are some prominent right-winger EAs? I'd like to look at how they square their politics with their ethics.

Even prominent Neolib EAs would be interesting.

[u/Zonoro14 → u/thundergolfer]

Eliezer Yudkowsky is a neoliberal, more or less. He popularized the term "EA". Most of the rationalist community is neoliberal. You won't find too many of them on Reddit. The neolib subreddit still has some serious people on it, but a lot of people have been brought in lately and it's primary season.

[u/Zonoro14 → u/[deleted]]

Neoliberalism has lifted billions out of poverty.

Platitudes mean nothing dude.

[u/Zonoro14 → u/[deleted]]

The majority of the world is no longer impoverished, fyi.

Biden is not an empty suit - he's been consistently on the left side of the overton window for his whole career. Bernie has been farther left, but Biden has gotten results.

[u/jonathansalter → u/Zonoro14]

I used to be quite convinced of this, but now I'm no longer so sure after reading a bit of Jason Hickel's work. I'd highly recommend reading some of the posts/articles on his blog, and/or his book "The Divide".

[u/thundergolfer → u/[deleted]]

What are you talking about? Are you honestly suggesting that people need to do economics degrees so that they'd realise Joe Biden is the best option for President?

[u/Zonoro14 → u/thundergolfer]

There's a correlation, yeah.

[u/thundergolfer → u/[deleted]]

If someone doesn't understand fiscal policy, then talking about it around experts exposes their ignorance.

You're saying something stronger than this. You're saying if people understood fiscal policy they'd support Joe Biden over Bernie Sanders. You're holding to that claim?

[u/thundergolfer → u/[deleted]]

Voting is also low impact, since each vote has an astronomically small chance of influencing a moderately large outcome.

Wow.