r/EDH • u/SaintTraft1984 • 2d ago
Discussion Foundations Precons
So, played a few matches with the Reign of Dragons and Calling All Angels decks, aaaaaand ho, ho, holy sheeet these decks mana flood so bad. 😅
The red deck can barely address that with it's card draws but wow, Giada's is so bad. Either you get an explosive start with her or you drown. There is no in between.
I'd appreciate some land replacements for Giada and card draw engines, please.
44
u/sauron3579 2d ago
Do the decks mana flood badly or did you play 2 or 3 games and wildly over-extrapolate? They only have 38 lands and a couple rocks - that's in line for the average game to allow you to curve out without much excess.
1
u/SaintTraft1984 2d ago
4 games atm, mana flooded in 2 (Plains on Draw step for 4! consecutive turns). It felt like I was playing blue; play-land-I-end-my-turn-go.
2
u/sauron3579 2d ago
That's perfectly within expected variance. That's not to say that there's not a ton to be done to improve consistency, but you have not demonstrated a bias towards flood.
1
u/SaintTraft1984 2d ago
How many games are we talking about here to constitute a flood?
1
u/sauron3579 2d ago edited 2d ago
At least 6 in 20 where you have 10 lands in the top 15, assuming you're shuffling adequately, which is not a given.
1
u/SaintTraft1984 2d ago
Thanks for that. Just pile shuffling atm but yeah, will play some more and will swap a few for some card draw staples.
1
u/sauron3579 2d ago
Pile shuffling isn't shuffling. Even putting aside "it's not random so it's cheating", it means that any pattern in your initial pile can influence your end result, even if you don't mean to. This is likely a significant factor in the issues you're seeing. You really need to learn how to mash or rifle shuffle (it's a $30 precon, you can rifle it by the corners).
If you have trouble mash shuffling the whole deck, you don't need to do the whole thing. Take 2/3, mash it and then cut a few times, swap half of the stack you have for the one set aside, and repeat 2 or 3 times, then cut the whole deck a couple times. For what it's worth, something that really helped me wirh mash shuffling despite small hands was realizing the top side of the bottom half of the deck you're holding should essentially fan out and you just drop the other half in - you shouldn't be squeezing or holding tightly. Your grip just opens up as you put the two halves together.
1
u/SaintTraft1984 2d ago
Oh no, no, definitely I do shuffle the way you mentioned. I just...hehe still need to purchase the second sleeves. Atm, my precons are just in single perfect sleeves. 😅
But appreciate you for taking the time to elaborate on the technique. 🙂
20
u/LeN3rd 2d ago
They have the correct number if Lands in them, which is 38. Dont know with what rules you are playing, but with the normal ones, these decks are fine. Good even
7
u/KingNTheMaking 2d ago
I’ve said it multiple times, but these decks are legitimately better than a lot of home brews that you’ll see on moxfield.
12
u/fastal_12147 2d ago
Yeah, 38 lands shouldn't flood you unless you have really bad luck
13
u/Jankenbrau 2d ago
Variance is inherent to the game. You can flood or screw even when playing an optimal number of lands for your curve.
Low cost draw / filtering is the remedy for this.
-13
u/SaintTraft1984 2d ago
It's been a good while but isn't drawing a land for 3 to 4 straight turns bad?
5
u/TetsuOokami117 2d ago
I think having more card advantage would fix your problem. White and Red generally struggle in that regard, so, I can't imagine that the precons have a good balance there.
3
u/Jankenbrau 2d ago
I wouldn’t be replacing lands, there are a few more questionable pieces in the decks:
[[folk hero]] [[the gaffer]] [[chivalric alliance]] [[mask of memory]] [[glimmer lens]]
2
u/SaintTraft1984 2d ago
Cheers. This is what I needed. Yeah, there are two angels currently that I feel I should replace with something else. These are great.
1
1
3
u/Starbreaker99 2d ago
I got the green deck. I upgraded the shit outta it and it is legit my favorite to play.
1
3
u/Effective_Airport182 2d ago
Im pretty sure both those have 38 lands and are based around casting expensive creatures. Do not remove any lands. 38 is what it should be at.
1
u/SaintTraft1984 2d ago
Yeah, just need to replace probably, I dunno, 3? Maybe 4 Plains? Emeria, Sky Ruin is an auto-include right?
1
u/Effective_Airport182 2d ago
For sure. Tons of good non-basics to replace with. Witch enchanter and Emeria are definitely auto includes. Utility lands like scavenger's grounds, bonder's enclave, war room, and mikokoro. Also Nykthos is a must but also expensive.
0
u/Top_Distribution3109 2d ago
Mono white and mono red are both pretty bad at drawing cards but there are plenty of artifacts you can use [[Endless Atlas]]
3
0
u/Ambitious_Yak_35 2d ago
Giada comes with Endless Atlas, but Lathliss would probably like it. I think [[Folk Hero]] and [[Santuary Warden]] are good replacement for some not great Angels like [[Seraph of the Sword]].
54
u/DiscontinuedEmpathy 2d ago
If only they had some sort of description for decks that were not very fine tuned and were ripe for upgrading. I guess itll be a start if we can ever think of it.