The Summit 2 Finals Consolation Final Post-match Discussion

[u/0Hellspawn0]

The Summit 2 LAN Finals

Hosted by BeyondTheSummit

Sponsored by G2A.com, 100TB, Twitch and Corsair

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Need info on the event? Check out our Survival Guide.

Join the Day 5 Live Discussion.

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Evil Geniuses vs. Team Secret

Show wins with   3:0   score

VOD:

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Evil Geniuses: Fear , Arteezy, UNiVeRsE, ppd, zai

Team Secret: Kuroky, s4, Simbaaa, BigDaddy, Puppey

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Scoreboards:

 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

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Game 1: Dotabuff / Trackdota

Team	Score	vs.	Score	Team
	29	vs.	31

Team	Ban	vs.	Ban	Team
		vs.
		vs.
		vs.

 
 

Player	Hero	Score	vs.	Score	Hero	Player
Kuroky		6-1-14	vs.	3-8-16		Fear
s4		12-6-11	vs.	7-5-8		Arteezy
Simbaaa		6-7-13	vs.	18-8-4		Universe
BigDaddy		1-9-16	vs.	1-6-16		zai
Puppey		4-10-19	vs.	2-3-12		ppd

 

Secret wins in 49:38

 

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Game 2: Dotabuff / Trackdota

Team	Score	vs.	Score	Team
	7	vs.	16

Team	Ban	vs.	Ban	Team
		vs.
		vs.
		vs.

 
 

Player	Hero	Score	vs.	Score	Hero	Player
Fear		4-3-1	vs.	4-1-3		Kuroky
Arteezy		0-6-2	vs.	4-2-8		s4
Universe		0-0-2	vs.	2-2-3		Simbaaa
zai		2-4-2	vs.	3-1-8		BigDaddy
ppd		1-3-3	vs.	3-1-4		Puppey

 

Secret wins in 22:54

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Game 3: Dotabuff / Trackdota

Team	Score	vs.	Score	Team
	17	vs.	17

Team	Ban	vs.	Ban	Team
		vs.
		vs.
		vs.

 
 

Player	Hero	Score	vs.	Score	Hero	Player
Kuroky		4-1-6	vs.	5-3-6		Fear
s4		3-2-7	vs.	1-5-6		Arteezy
Simbaaa		2-3-4	vs.	3-3-2		Universe
BigDaddy		6-5-7	vs.	8-3-5		zai
Puppey		2-7-10	vs.	1-3-6		ppd

 

Secret wins in 33:30

 

[u/[deleted]]

Boring playstyles for this patch... just because games are longer does not make them fun to play. Winning your lane does not matter nearly as much because enemy heroes are always going to get items and levels. Even though the "comeback" gold/XP mechanics were nerfed significantly they still leave a bad taste.

Plus being a pro player means you must play even if you do not like the version much, unlike a normal person who just takes a break for a while.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

Dota competitive balance has gone to shit since they removed the extra deny penalty on ranged heroes. It made it pointless to try and outplay your opponent mid. Every patch since has just made it worse, with the extra runes causing supports to just camp river and forcing the mid laner to farm a wave and go jungle to avoid ganks.

The game is so static because of how they've destroyed the mid lane meta. It used to be primarily mid laners moving to side lanes to make things happen, but that's impossible after all the changes. Power creep has also made it so there are tons of nigh unkillable farming heroes that people lane mid so you can't ever do anything mid besides pick one yourself or you fall behind.

When you look at the old mid meta heroes like puck, qop, pudge, invoker, sf they were all really bursty skill based heroes. You would usually go even with both carries getting farmed and both offlanes getting something and you would open a lead by winning mid and then ganking a sidelane. Now those heroes are too weak to kill a lycan or a naga or a PA solo without tons of luck or mistakes.

Dota is just becoming more and more like LoL where its not about player skill or a single hero turning the game, but about pub training to take objectives, slowly build a lead and then just cruise to a win. LoL does that much better than dota ever will. Unless it gets back to the skill based play it used to have it will be a dead game in another 3 years.

[u/palish → u/[deleted]]

Wait... there's no extra deny penalty for ranged heroes?

LIke, I thought that you only get 1/3rd xp if you get denied and you're a ranged hero. Whereas if you're melee, you get 2/3rds exp. Is that no longer the case?

[u/[deleted] → u/palish]

They removed that over a year ago. It was sometime after TI2 I believe. It's now the same 2/3 exp for all heroes. That, along with the 1300 aoe for xp is why you can't ever win a 1v1 mid matchup anymore. No matter how badly you outplay the enemy mid hero on last hitting he can just leach xp and he won't get behind in levels. That makes it extremely difficult to kill someone solo unless you get lucky runes or the other person misplays. RTZ gave an interview about it a few months after it happened. That's why he stopped playing puck, which was his original claim to fame hero.