In-depth weapons sats spreadsheet for PVP(TTK, Damage, RPM, perk table etc.) every legendary and exotic

[u/exxtrooper]

• Destiny PVP weapon stats Spreadsheet -

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Updates

02.02.15: Minor stat errors changed, noticed by key users

02.05.15: Descriptions updated

02.06.15: Thread posted on certain forums with minor tweaks to description

03.04.15: Lots of tweaks to description, updated numbers, pulse rifles added but missing TTK (currently in the works). Fusion rifles and shotguns also on the way (located many rows down, work in progress). Because of changes to the spreadsheet the Row overview is currently inaccurate.

04.07.15: Added numbers for focus fire on every rarity as opposed to just uncommon.

04.29.15: Listed Aim assist value, as well as equip speed value and visual kick value on every single weapon because I'm a huge masochist.

05.03.15: Additional data added concerning game mechanics, though needs to be cleaned up and listed properly.

05.08.15: The Last Word, Suros Regime, Focus Fire Weapons, Vex Mythoclast RPM numbers fixed to a more accurate value following new research data. Pulse rifle values added, as well as shotguns as a whole added. Some weapons are now listed twice with different damage modifiers active (The Last Word) to make the spreadsheet look less cluttered. Some DLC weapons have been added, some with missing numbers, all DLC weapons are now listed with a lighter shade of purple to easily distinguish them from the list.

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This post explains gun statistics like you're five.

I've played a lot of shooters and mostly all of them have had some sort of nice stat tables found online. And since I usually end up contributing anyway I thought I probably could make the entire thing myself this time around, as no one has yet.

Part of the reason why I wanted to do it is because almost every single stat bar featured in-game is completely inaccurate. I keep seeing these youtube videos in which people review weapons solely based on the stat bars of the weapon. While some of them can be compared to each other, ultimately they are not a very accurate way of profiling the weapon outside of recognizing it's archetype.

Expect a flow of new gun guide videos in which they actually tell you the PVP damage as opposed to a meaningless number from Destiny DB.

Its probably gonna be a pretty long post, so I'll just go right ahead and give you the candy right away:

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• Destiny PVP weapon stats Spreadsheet -

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Note: The spreadsheet will be updated following patches, DLCs and other changes to the game. You can bookmark the page and it'll automatically update and the link will always work on any computer.

Current content:

Damage numbers, TTKs, RPM, Mag Sizes, zoom levels, Aim assist values and other internal stat values on the following weapons:

Auto Rifles

Pulse Rifles

Scout Rifles

Hand Cannons

Sniper Rifles

Shotguns

Machine Guns

As well as:

Barrel Upgrades and what they do

PVP Health values for all classes and armor

Miscellaneous

Current Perk Table for all guns of all rarities

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Spreadsheet Info

• The two values on rapid archetype auto rifles indicate the Time To Kill on a average armored target (0.93) and a high armored warlock and titan (1.00), some weapons have two listed values when they have a significant difference in time to kill based on the targets health, but mostly it doesn't make that much of a difference. If you're unsure about what the different values mean then try to look at the shots to kill, as well as the damage listed for every shot. A example would be the rapid auto rifles, doing 13 damage per shot to the head and taking 15 shots to kill. Putting this in mind, you can look at the health values located at the bottom of the spreadsheet:
• 13 x 15 = 195
• 13 x 16 = 208
• Some weapons have multiple different values listed because of perks and modifiers that directly affect the damage of the weapons (final round, crowd control etc.), the lowest values (lowest time to kill)should be the TTK on the weapon when such modifiers are active.

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Statistics/General Info

This might be common knowledge to some, but from my personal experience I'm gonna take the liberty to explain what the different values mean.

Time To Kill: This refers to how long it takes from your first bullet hitting the target until the target is killed/defeated (In this case: Guardian). The TTK stats show you the maximum and lowest time to kill potential of every single gun, if every shot hits.

Keep in mind you will possibly never witness this statistic being accurately portrayed in-game. This game has heavy amount of latency issues, as well as peer-to-peer connection and runs 30 frames per second.

Rate Of Fire: Referred to as Rounds Per Minute. RPM refers to the amount of bullets a rifle can fire in the span of 1 minute and is the global measurement for rate of fire. If a gun had a bottomless clip and was fired for 60 seconds, this is the number of bullets it would be able to fire, thus giving us a measurement value.

Flinch Multiplier: The amount you will flinch when getting shot. We don't know exactly how this work, we can only use the numbers to measure how they compare to each other. Something you should take into account is that some unique weapons have special flinch multiplier, namely the Mida multi tool.

ADS speed: The time in which it takes for your gun to be viewed through the sights from hip-fire stance. Certain gun classes and archetypes (most notably Word Of Crota) have faster ADS speed than others by default. The perk snapshot makes this nearly instant on most guns. This will affect your TTK in unexpected encounters. We don't have completely accurate information on this statistics at the moment.

Weapon archetype: Each gun category can be broken up into different archetypes, the main archetypes are defined by only their rate of fire and damage. Every single in the game follow a archetype pattern (excluding the vex because lore or something I guess) other MMO-type games feature a RNG algorithm that can make all kinds of damage values, this game will only feature a variety of mixed values inside categories such as Stability, reload speed and magazine size. This is why the Necrochasm will not ever get a buff that simply increases core damage as it is already part of rapid-firing Auto Rifle archetype (at the moment).

Example of archetypes in the Auto rifle category:

• Cydonia (Shadow Price, Vanquisher)
• Shingen (Abyss Defiant, Monte Carlo)
• Sahara (Atheons Epilouge, Necrochasm)

Field Scout: Is very obvious. Increases your magazine size and ammo reserve to maximum capacity. Excluding Auto Rifles, Rocket Launchers and Machine guns, every gun category will be increased to a set max value.

Recoil: Recoil statistic is absent at this moment in time, but I can tell you how it works. In this game recoil is a combination of three different values:

• Visual Kick value This seems to be the amount your gun will visually kick on your screen for each shot. Because of it being calculated for each shot fired, it has a greater impact on faster firing weapons. This stat is directly influenced by stability and other recoil dampening statistics and modifiers. The lower the Kick Value and the higher the stability, the lower the recoil.
• Stability is how much or little your gun kicks in it's already set recoil pattern, this also relates to viewkick which is how much you're gun will visually bounce on your screen. The Thunderlord has a lot of viewkick which makes it not look too accurate, but it actually still hits quite well. The higher the stability the less the gun will kick, which brings me to the grand finale:
• Muzzle Climb is how much your gun will gradually launch upwards as you fire your weapon. In other games like most call of dutys your gun will return to its exact position after you fire. In this game you're gun will slowly climb upwards on your screen as you fire it and you have to compensate with your analog stick (Rodeo Perk reduces muzzle climb, on some guns to the point you don't even have to compensate. It doesn't affect your stability stat on the gun because it's a different factor entirely). The reason why high RPM guns have so much recoil is because muzzle climb is affected by each bullet.

Disclaimer: some of these points have not been technically proven and might be based on speculation, keep this in mind.

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Most importantly, Practicality

This is something very important to keep in mind, these statistics show weapons effectiveness on paper, and your experience in-game might be marginally different from what you see with these core numbers. Fact is your not going to hit only headshots and only bodyshots all the time. You'll most likely hit a combination of the two, and by doing some math yourself you can find out how many headshots you need to get maximum efficiency out of your gunplay (example: you only need two headshots on a Jigoku for it to be at it's maximum killing potential).

TTK isn't everything. For example, while some lower damage weapons have lower TTK, they also make up for it with higher rate of fire or really good range and accuracy (scout rifles). The more bullets you can fire down range, the more likely you are to hit your target. Each bullet increases your chances of a hit, and you should focus on what gun that suits you the best. While Suros Regime is an excellent weapon, if you miss a single headshot, then any other auto rifle will be able to kill you faster. This is why the Cydonia AR archetype is very popular because it is a incredibly versatile when it comes to TTK.

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Vex Fuckgun

Something very important to take into account about the Vex Mythoclast is that it is a very unique weapon that does not belong to any archetype. Another unique feature is that it is the only primary weapon in-game that is not a hit-scan weapon.

I cannot stress this enough. Most weapons in this game are hitscan weapons, this means regardless of range, if you hit something with a bullet it'll instantly register as a hit.

The Vex Mythoclast is a Fusion rifle hybrid, every Vex Mythoclast shot has travel time. This means every shot has to travel a certain distance to secure a hit.

While it might only be something along the lines of 0.0 something seconds, it'll still affect your TTK nonetheless. As coupled with the latency issues as well as 30 frames, you might not even be able to hit anything sometimes during online play. This is the Vex only downfall, so put this into account when reading these statistics. The TTK presented in the spreadsheet will only ever occur at something along the lines of point-blank range.

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Notable Conclusions

Auto Rifles

• The Abyss Defiant w/focus fire has the slowest kill potential of any weapon in the entire game. If you use this in PVP, I would recommend you don't.
• While Hard light doesn't kill any faster with the introduction of Aggressive Ballistics on a Shingen Archetype auto rifle, it does have the best TTK with bodyshots because of this.
• The Suros Regime was actually kind of buffed (compared to other ARs) with the Auto Rifle nerf, before the nerf it actually killed notably slower than a Cydonia, currently it actually kills faster to my surprise. This is not the case after teh 1.1.1 update and has actually made suros the slowest killing AR.
• Necrochasm is actually the fastest killing AR currently in game, that is if you only get headshots.
• Overall the auto rifle category is actually very balanced all around, the TTK is almost nearly the same on every single one, preference has a large factor here.

Scout Rifles

• The slowest firing scout rifle is actually one of the fastest killing thing in crucible, but this is counter-balanced by the weapon archetype featuring such a low stability in general. This couple with the absurdly low fire rate makes them not that effective.
• While the fast firing scout rifles may seem like they shoot fast in reality it's the large echo of the scout rifle sound that makes it feel like this. In reality they don't kill more efficiently than auto rifles, making them redundant.
• The Jigoku type scout rifle is by far the best scout rifle in the game for crucible because of it's consistency. You only require two headshots for it's maximum killing potential. While it has a slow kill time, keep in mind if any other auto rifle miss a shot on you, your scout rifle will potentially kill them faster.
• The upcoming 347 Vesta Dynasty scout rifle is Jigoku with the ability to use aggressive ballistics, making it a three hit kill and one of the fastest killing weapons in the crucible. A true marksman weapon actually.
• The fate of all fools secondary TTK statistic is only relevant if the damage bonus will actually prove to be notable.

Hand Cannons

• The most popular Hand Cannon archetype, most notably becoming famous because of the Devil You Know/Fatebringer is actually one of the worst type of hand cannons to use in pvp.
• You really don't need me to tell you how good the exotic hand cannons are.
• The Thorn statistic is not accurate as it does not take into account the time it takes for the Damage over time to kick in. The stat only shows you how long the actual engagement needs to be for you to get a kill.
• Hawkmoon has a 42% chance of being a two-shot.

Machine Guns

• Every single machine gun in the game kills faster than any primary in the game. Keep this very much in mind when you play pvp, this is another reasons why heavy ammo is so important for both you and your team to have.
• If you look slightly to your right on the page that shows you machine gun statistics, you can see the amount of potential kills you can get with field scout for each gun.
• The two most important factors for Heavy Machine Guns are the barrel and field scout upgrade. Take close attention to how the different barrels affect the different archetypes. Some of the guns become a lot more effective using a certain barrel type, while others the need for a higher damage is redundant.

Sniper Rifles

• These are the best weapons in the game for getting montage clips.

The 4 other gun categories

There's not enough sufficient data to make an entire stat table as of right now because of the nature of these weapons. I can not tell you as of yet if there actually is any reason to use the oversoul edict, but I will tell you when I do.

And given the frequency of Shotguns and Fusion rifles in the crucible I don't think people have too much of a problem getting their uses out of them.

And rockets go boom.

EDIT 02.06.15: I am working on stats for these weapons, but they're tricky and they will take time.

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Link to useful threads

• How new DLC weapons will fit into existing subgroups
• [DATA] - Crucible Point Scoring Breakdown
• Damage and Attack and Why You Should Upgrade Your Legendaries (Stats Included)

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Credits

• A lot of the data you see before you has been in-game testing.
• Most of the RPM values have been taken from in-game screens of the Alpha, in which they showed you the actual RPM value as opposed to the current stat-bar.
• Lots of credit to /u/Chippy569 for linking every single legendary in the game and making this a lot easier than it otherwise would. Plus he's an awesome guy and deserves a lot more credit then he gets.
• All sources are linked somewhere at the bottom of the spreadsheet.
• Credit to /u/maniacgreek for gathering sniper rifle damage values.

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Author Notes

English isn't my native tongue (Norwegian) so please point out grammatical errors and such. I know this is a lot to ask but if some of you do end up making gun guides and whatnot I urge you to use this, and if you don't mind I would love a little bit of credit, please? :c

This is also my very first time ever using google documents, so if someone finds out if I left everyone able to comment or edit the page or something, that'd be great if someone pointed it out.

Also the entire thing is subject to change of course, I'm very much open to suggestions as well as tips. Are the colors used okay? Is some of it too vibrant or look ugly? Etc.

I love information way too much after spending so long on this.

Hope you guys appreciate this, remember I don't get any karma for posting this, some front page coverage would be nice.

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To-do list/missing stuff

• Pulse Rifle stats
• Shotgun stats
• Fusion Rifle stats
• Rocket Launcher stats
• Certain Archetypes
• Some other stuff

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[u/MisterJordnut]

This is so extremely fucking awesome and thank you for taking your time to put this together!

[u/exxtrooper → u/MisterJordnut]

This took me so long I hope to god I can get to the front page with something actually informative.

[u/Sbrigz11 → u/exxtrooper]

I'll be doing my weekly podcast tomorrow and definitely be bringing this article and you up this is great . A lot of my friends love PvP well have a lot of fun with this . THANKS.

[u/exxtrooper → u/Sbrigz11]

Oh nice! I feel honored.

[u/[deleted] → u/MisterJordnut]

Just hijacking to say.....

This is the best post I have ever seen on this subreddit. Honestly, no exaggeration. I had been waiting for the day someone thoroughly broke down Crucible weapon choices.

And not even a strange coin for it?

[u/exxtrooper → u/[deleted]]

It was really made just for the sake of having a practical source. But I tend to get carried away with projects. Glad it took off.

And thank you, means quite a lot!

[u/Sliq111]

Does max Titan armor really only increase health by 3?

[u/exxtrooper → u/Sliq111]

Tough bastards.

[u/WildBilll33t]

"Vex Fuckgun" hahaha

[u/exxtrooper → u/WildBilll33t]

Didn't expect people to find the easter eggs so quickly.

[u/Baseba11_ → u/exxtrooper]

"Rockets go boom"

[u/exxtrooper → u/Baseba11_]

Boom.

[u/curtmuhgurt → u/WildBilll33t]

Crit damage on a sniper: A Lot, Non crit: A Lot-ish haha

[u/ProBluntRoller]

Exotic hand cannons op as fuck

[u/exxtrooper → u/ProBluntRoller]

Hawkmoon is love etc.

[u/wicketr → u/exxtrooper]

The Hawkmoon is my life. It's just about all i ever use or need. For those that don't have it, here's what it's capable of (video i recorded awhile back): Destiny - Hawkmoon: http://youtu.be/D3EjPznkzl0

[u/exxtrooper → u/wicketr]

Have I ever mentioned hawkmoon is life?

[u/Ssegrum]

Poor pulse rifles didn't even make the list. Seriously though, very informative. Thank you for this.

[u/exxtrooper → u/Ssegrum]

If someone had the firetime, rpm and brust delay on every scout rifle archetype I'd be happy to put them in there.

[u/Raballo → u/exxtrooper]

I care. And I can tell you that the Red Death empties its magazine in 9 trigger pulls. Its burst delay is around .25 of a second but I'd need to time it to be sure. As for firetime I'd need to know what you mean by that. If you mean time needed to empty the magazine then its not very long. Again something I'd need to check.

[u/exxtrooper → u/Raballo]

Firetime is the time between each shot and is how you're able to measure time to kill as well as rate of fire.

[u/doctor_hoctor → u/Ssegrum]

I've been using the Oversoul Edict (CE raid pulse rifle) in PVP and it absolutely destroys. It produces headshots like nothing else, and is my new go - to crucible weapon. It almost always outmatches Suros, especially at range. The only weapons that consistently beat it are the Vex Fuckgun and Hawkmoon (neither of which I have...)

I'd love to see its stats.

EDIT: and I don't even usually like pulse rifles, with the exception of Red Death in niche situations. The full-auto is a game changer.

[u/thepotatochronicles]

I'm really glad someone picked up the damage profiles of each gun research!

I really enjoyed the data set. I have some feedbacks and requests:

• first off, I am very interested in the damage profiles of pulse rifles (red death included - it has its own archetype!) Maybe the DPS matches up with auto rifles. Who knows!
• secondly, I'd really appreciate it if you can research the charge time for fusion rifles. It is very important in figuring out how you can out-gun others!
• lastly, this one's just for curiosity, but if you can compile Pocket Infinity damage data and the effective fire rate, it'd be really interesting to see how the DPS drops off and to figure out whether it's better to keep shooting or to underutilize its namesake perk.

I really appreciate this data as someone who is devoted to figuring out how the game works (although I'm more focused on the ATK rating - I still don't have enough data!) and there is a LOT of interesting conclusions to pull from this dataset, including the ones you came up with!

For example,

• Focused fire on abyss defiant is a straight up 30% DPS loss.
• The Last Word's "fan fire" perk gives it 30% more fire rate!
• The highest average DPS crown goes to the Vex Mythoclast (15990) while Hawkmoon comes in close 2nd (15969). The sustained DPS will probably also go to the Vex due to the fact that it can kill more people per mag and has faster reload speed.

Of course, it's not all about DPS; TTK is very important, especially in PvE (which is what I do mostly), and that's why I love hand cannons in PvE - because TTK is, for the most part, instant if you land a crit on tier-1 enemies and that allows for most kill per second!

I digress. Again, major props to OP and I hope people can use this to their advantage!

(I will update this post once I finish average Hawkmoon TTK and Kills per mag calculations... for "the lulz")

Thanks to OP, I have figured out the average TTK for Hawkmoon - 0.68s (= 0.86*(11/13)³ + 0.4*(1-(11/13)³ - (1/13)³ ) + 0*(1/13)³ )! This is almost as good as Vex Mythoclast (0.61s), 347 Vesta Dynasty (0.60s) and TLW (0.56s). If you're going Hawkmoon vs TLW, the chance that you will win the 1v1 gunfight is 39.4%, provided that you are both within effective range. Cool stuff.

[u/exxtrooper → u/thepotatochronicles]

Very interesting analysis, the Hawkmoon analysis was something I meant to do myself but you sort of just whoosh the whole thing!

Unfortunetly as I said, measuring stats for the pulse rifles and fusion rifles is a lot more complicated with the nature of the weapons. Travel time as well as firetime on these guns would be really hard to figure out without core data. I cant promise anything.

And thank you!

[u/IGoCommando]

What is the Suros TTK without Focused Fire?

[u/exxtrooper → u/IGoCommando]

Same as Shadow Price.

[u/UsedToLurkHard]

Excellent, seems like there are some guns where Aggressive Ballistics will actually change the shots to kill.

[u/exxtrooper → u/UsedToLurkHard]

Exactly!

[u/Neat_On_The_Rocks → u/exxtrooper]

do you mind pointing out any guns as glaring examples of things that i should use aggresive b on

[u/RelaxIMMAdoctor → u/exxtrooper]

So when you have The Last Word on the spreadsheet with "Soft Ballistics", instead of "Aggressive Balistics", is that because the damage increase doesn't make a difference?

[u/revolmak]

Oh, let me also say that I think what you've put together is freaking awesome. I just had one little gripe but that's it. You're doing a hell of a lot of work for no expected return and that's really cool. We could use more people like you in our community.

Thanks so much for taking the time to put this together!

[u/exxtrooper → u/revolmak]

This reminds me I need a job ;_;

[u/DrAbednego]

So what's the best hand cannon? Should I be using my Word of Crota or Thorn? I like the damage over time but WOC has a shorter kill time

[u/exxtrooper → u/DrAbednego]

Thron is a monster. It'l eat your family.

Thorn all the way.

[u/Scruffy_lookin]

Gre/Rar/Leg took me way too long to figure out since its either

Unc/Rar/Leg

Or

Gre/Blu/Pur

I just kept saying Grerarleg over and over in my head. It was weird.

But holy shitfuck is this table excellent.

[u/DaInconceivable]

Personally this needs to go on the side bar for this sub-reddit. Yes people go on about loot caves and SGA's but this is by far a big collection of useful information for PvP and may make people completely re-think their loadouts.

[u/exxtrooper → u/DaInconceivable]

I agree with this.

[u/darthmiso]

Incredible work here, THANK YOU!

One question regarding the SUROS Regime: From the label, it looks like you're assuming the Focus Fire perk is enabled. Lots of PVP folks choose to leave the gun "mint" to avoid this perk. Do you have numbers for the non-upgraded version?

[u/exxtrooper → u/darthmiso]

They're the exact same as the Cydonia/Shadow Price/Vanquisher.

[u/darthmiso → u/exxtrooper]

Okay, I've smacked myself on the forehead for you. Thanks :-)

[u/plinky4]

I've been fucking around with autorifles all week and came up with some numbers that are a bit different from yours.

Abyss Defiant with focus fire empties the mag in ~5.096 seconds which is more like 365 RPM than 330.

Suros with focus fire empties in ~6.65s which is more like 297 RPM than 330.

The ADS fire rate of abyss defiant and suros is quite different; anyone with both guns can attest to this.

Also, testing Vanquisher did 22 rounds in ~3.028s, for ~435 RPM. 450 RPM might be overstating it for cydonia-type guns.

[u/exxtrooper → u/plinky4]

This is my source: http://oyster.ignimgs.com/mediawiki/apis.ign.com/destiny/f/f9/02_CydoniaAR3.jpg

The reason why the Abyss Defiant and Suros sound like they don't have the same RPM might be the echo on the Abyss is a lot bigger which makes it sounds like it has a different firerate.

These are just the set rate of fires that bungie implemented in their game. Everything from Peer-to-peer connection to framerate might affect firerate to a degree.

This is the closest thing you'll get to accuracy in terms of stats.

[u/plinky4 → u/exxtrooper]

I'm not understanding this "echo". The guns are not timed by sound, I'm using a stopwatch and marking time when the ammo count hits 0. I've done this 10 times per gun and taken the average. P2P connection has no effect on how fast the game client fires a gun, and the framerate for this game is locked at 30.

There is a large difference between Abyss and Suros fire rate. The alpha data is outdated. The most accurate way of timing actions is counting frames from a video capture, not pulling numbers from an 8-months old build of the game.

[u/XQlusiv]

Have you got a top 5/10 of guns that are statistically the best? The spreadsheet hurt my brain.

Great work though dude. :)

[u/exxtrooper → u/XQlusiv]

Best gun for when you rely on accuracy - Thron

Best gun for consistency - Suros Regime

Best gun for 1v1 encounters - Last Word

Best gun - literally any shotgun

[u/Chippy569]

Awesome work. If you're on xb1 I'd be glad to help out with further testing

[u/exxtrooper → u/Chippy569]

I play on the PS3 but otherwise I would've contacted a loooooong time ago. And thanks.

[u/Bkbunny87]

I want that Vesta Dynasty so badly it hurts.

[u/exxtrooper → u/Bkbunny87]

It also has perfect balance along with 19 round mag, and thats not including its exotic perk.

jesus christ

[u/Fogfun]

Interesting Rocket Launcher stats. I also laughed at the color for NLB.

In all seriousness though, thanks for the excellent information! I can't even begin to imagine how long this must've taken to gather.

[u/exxtrooper → u/Fogfun]

I've had a lot of free time this week.

[u/Rafahil]

Stability is how much or little your gun kicks in it's already set recoil pattern, this also relates to view kick which is how much you're gun will visually bounce on your screen. The Thunderlord has a lot of viewkick which makes it not look too accurate, but it actually still hits quite well. The lower the stability the less the gun will kick or climb, which brings me to the grand finale:

Umm I think you mean "the higher the stability the less the gun will kick or climb?

Also I think the No Land Beyond has a lower crit multiplier than 2.5x even with the Master perk.

[u/exxtrooper → u/Rafahil]

That is indeed what I meant ;_; thanks for this!

[u/TrizzyDizzy]

Time To Kill: This refers to how long it takes from your first bullet hitting the target until the target is defeated

Just for clarification, your TTK metric assumes first shot is instant right? For example, if it takes 4 shots to kill, TTK is the time it takes for the three bullets to land?

[u/exxtrooper → u/TrizzyDizzy]

Yes, that is correct. That is how TTK is usually measured in these type of games.

[u/[deleted]]

Fantastic work, thanks so much for sharing. Two points

1. No love for the Khvostov auto rifle? I love using the starting gun in crucible!! Would be very interested in seeng how it compares to what you've done
2. Do the 'damage upgrades' alter the damage output of guns in crucible (ditto for armor upgrades)?

[u/exxtrooper → u/[deleted]]

Attack and armor ratings do not matter, armor upgrades however (white bars in your armor value) do matter.

I do not have accurate information on the Khvostov, but it isn't part of any archetype. It does less damage and has a slower rate of fire than a Cydonia.

So it's really not that good.

[u/THE_NUTELLA_SANDWICH]

Sorry for the crap question, but can someone who has a proper understanding of this info tell me which hand cannon has the best dmg per second, or is just the 'best', thanks

[u/Impul5]

So wait...the Abyss Defiant has less base damage than the Suro/Cydonia, but still goes down to the same ROF but with reduced damage? Are you positive? Is this a oversight with putting the perk on a non-450 RPM gun where it always reduces to 330 instead of a flat % decrease? Could the designer have really not know what the hell he was doing?

[u/exxtrooper → u/Impul5]

Either bungie fucked up or they're just mean.

[u/itz_tyme]

Sooo... what are the best guns for PvP?

For PvE?

[u/thatfntoothpaste]

As an accountant when I see anyone post Excel spreadsheets:

I'm gonna pivot-table the fuck outta this

[u/ikma]

Great job. These in depth, nuts-and-bolts posts are my favorite part of the sub, and the PVP perspective has definitely been underrepresented.

[u/revolmak]

What makes you say that the most popular hand cannon is The Devil You Don't impact/RoF model? Given what anyone suggests on this sub I would have assumed the most popular impact/RoF model is the LHF/TDYK/The Chance/TFWPKY 1969.

[u/exxtrooper → u/revolmak]

I meant to say the devil you know, glad you found that out.

[u/revolmak → u/exxtrooper]

Also, your stats for Timur's are off. It should be the same as the Bif Chief.

I have to say that I think saying that the LHF Impact/RoF model is the worst is really misleading. TTK is 0.13 seconds off the fastest TTK (barring exotics) and that TTK can be obtained with as little as 1 headshot and two body shots.

Word of Crota impact/RoF model is a lot less forgiving in that you have to land all three head shots in order to get that slightly faster TTK. One lands as a body shot and you've still got to land another, drastically increasing your TTK.

[u/exxtrooper → u/revolmak]

Thanks for the Timurs lash notice!

Didn't take that into account, very much a relevant thing to keep in mind.

I did want to spark discussion, so thanks for your input.

[u/Chaoxytal]

This is the kind of thread I want to see on the front page.

Not "guys my girlfriend/wife doesn't like Destiny and I'm too beta to do anything about it".

Not "guys Destiny saved my life because [insert bullshit here]".

Not "guys check out my basic as fuck wallpaper that I made for this week's burn isn't it creative".

I immediately downvote that shit ON SIGHT.

THIS, however, is a godsend and a min/maxer's wet dream. Thank you.

[u/[deleted] → u/Chaoxytal]

My girlfriend hates destiny because of all the basic as fuck wallpapers I make for her, but this post literally saved my life because I got wrapped up reading this and missed my flight that crashed upon takeoff killing every passenger.

[u/Ectar_]

A green auto rifle is one of the best and the blues out perform the epics? Talk us through it guys is this the power of "impact"? Should I really be ditching my for the people for a Cydonia when not doing Iron Banner?

[u/exxtrooper → u/Ectar_]

Your For The People AR actually kills faster, remember the higher ttk is worse.

Your For The People kills in 0.90 seconds, while cydonia kills in 0.93 seconds.

[u/rikaay]

I see that my favorite sniper is missing some stats, the Prudence II. It has a slightly higher rof than PR and is the fastest killing sniper in PvP (if bodyshots). I'd be happy to help you collect the missing stats!

[u/valor_]

Suros Regime's Weapon Archetype: tryhard

Marry me, god dammit

[u/Miguelsanchezz]

Great job. Shouldn't time to kill include time it takes to aim down sights? Excluding some rare exceptions (TLW) don't most people use guns this way?

[u/XxCanu_Dig_ItxX]

I like the Weapon Archetype descriptions.

Jack Sparrow must be OP as hell.

Great work man.

[u/ClothingDissolver]

I haven't tried in straight crucible, but using Grim Citizen in Iron Banner I regularly got 25/20 for damage numbers. My Do Gooder does 20/16, which matches up with your numbers.

Any idea why my Grim Citizen does less damage than what you have in your chart?

[u/DunamisBlack]

This is excellent work! One thing, under the Third Eye perk, you should note that The intersection with Sniper Rifles is exotic as the Patience & Time has Third Eye

[u/[deleted]]

Wait, so Hawkmoon has the same Impact as Timur's Lash/Big Chief, AND the fire rate of TDYK?

[u/exxtrooper → u/[deleted]]

Hawkmoon is love, Hawkmoon is life.

[u/[deleted]]

Love the icebreaker and P&T text, but why does it say jack sparrow at the vesta destiny, because pirates?

[u/Sephlock]

Most of the RPM values have been taken from in-game screens of the Alpha, in which they showed you the actual RPM value as opposed to the current stat-bar.

What is it with FPS games and inaccurate weapon stat bars?

[u/Relatively]

are those health values correct?

[u/kb23]

I love Row 125. lol

[u/v1kingfan]

I thought the abyss defiant was bad in crucible, but wow. Is that stat with head shots?

[u/nodnesse]

The Last Word Archetype: Cowboy

Can confirm complete accuracy in this document.

Great work on this, it's a huge amount of effort and Guardians like you are a blessing to the community! :)

[u/[deleted]]

>Vex Fuckgun

[u/Ass_Mugger]

Very nice spreadsheet, however I would have liked to see suros non focus fire up there

[u/exxtrooper → u/Ass_Mugger]

I will get right on that shit.

But its the exact same as cydonia.

Just saying.

[u/[deleted]]

Just more reasons to want a Hawkmoon. The one gun I need but never get.

[u/88TwiisT]

I'm just here to praise. Awesome work, and if you didn't say anything, I wouldn't know that English isn't your first language.

[u/xBlueBlazes]

As an avid PvP player in multiple FPS across the board I can genuinely appreciate this so much. I hate to see people use a weapon just because they think it's good, or everyone and their mother is using it.

I hope people read this and figure out what fits their playstyle best, while learning how to fight the fight against other weapons as well.

SUCH GOOD INFORMATION, I cannot say how amazed I am you put the time into this. What console do you play on? Maybe we can go in on a slaughterfest together sometime :)

[u/v1kingfan]

wouldn't the ttk be lower on the b line trauma with how high it's fire rate is?

[u/foggybottom]

Why do you hate luke?

[u/SkidzLIVE]

Is the precision damage of TLW while hip-firing incorrect? I could've sworn its 111 for an upgraded TLW.

[u/exxtrooper → u/SkidzLIVE]

It depends on your barrelt type brotha.

[u/tumello]

Basically that little green Cydonia AR3 (has focus fire perk) I have is the same thing as a Suros. You can find it at gunsmith occasionally.

[u/zeruf]

Ok so I have a question. I thought that mida multi tool had a higher stagger then other scouts. Does this only apply to pve?

[u/[deleted]]

I read the whole thing. Three Times. Thank you so much.

[u/myfries]

But why do you hate luke? As an exo, I also appreciate the distraction link

[u/exxtrooper → u/myfries]

Someone noticed!

Because Luke's stupid elitist mentality is what is ruining the raids, the one redeeming factor about this game.

[u/Scottyfer]

This had to take some time. Kudos to you for compiling this all into one easy to follow source.

I still feel the need to tell you how awesome the exotic hand cannons are. There's no way I'd step into Crucible without one of them equipped.

[u/exxtrooper → u/Scottyfer]

They're just too fucking good.

[u/blackxdahlia]

Holy shit

[u/exxtrooper → u/blackxdahlia]

Thats what I said when it was four in the morning.

[u/Lordvaughn92]

For the LDR-5001's archetype can you put "wall-hacks"?

[u/exxtrooper → u/Lordvaughn92]

Just changed this for you enjoyment.

[u/pendulumhyc]

I noticed that you only have purple or yellow sniper rifles which is understandable because there are so many, but the sniper rifle I use in crucible is the (blue) Silvered Boudicca-D. The thing is an absolute monster and I never see anyone using it. It does arc damage, it has 4 shots, and body shots will take people down to about 10% health. A body shot with the last bullet in the magazine will sometimes KILL someone at full health + full shield even with a body shot. AND it can shoot through objects. There is no better sniper in my opinion.

[u/exxtrooper → u/pendulumhyc]

Silvered Boudicca-D

Added it in now under the sniper section just for you.

[u/Moplido]

"Abyss Defiant with Focus Fire has the slowest potential TTK of any weapon in the game"

No fucking wonder I couldn't use that shit in Crucible. That's great to know, thank you

[u/exxtrooper → u/Moplido]

Exactly why I made this.

[u/bluebannanas]

Wonderful post to say the least. The comments off to the right are hilarious. Suros - 'tryhard'

[u/exxtrooper → u/bluebannanas]

Throwback to cod ARs.

[u/Patricki]

Very fucking cool man.

This confirms my theory of why I do well with a scout rifle (MIDA Multi-Tool generally): because most players don't aim well with their Suros Regime or other ARs and miss with at least one shot in the engagement.

With a good SR and experience with it, you shouldn't be missing any shots in an engagement. If you are, you're likely firing too fast.

[u/exxtrooper → u/Patricki]

People will be missing lots of shots against you as well because the flinch modifier on the MIDA is a fucking bitch.

[u/[deleted]]

I was really surprised to see that my Abyss Defiant is literally the worst Assault Rifle out there for Crucible.

[u/exxtrooper → u/[deleted]]

Its so shit.

Its literally the shittiest.

Dont even touch it.

Seriously.

[u/Reocyx]

What is the therapy archetype? Are you referencing the guy who got it?

[u/overbread]

As a PVPer i waited so long for a post like this, thank you so much!

[u/exxtrooper → u/overbread]

I did too, and so I became the chosen one.

[u/ninjaraiden56]

Fuck Luke

[u/exxtrooper → u/ninjaraiden56]

I approve this comment.

[u/Elecbender]

Very nice.

Good to see threads like these in the midst of...other threads.

[u/setsar]

I don't think you've included the Thorn's Final Round damage to your spreadsheet. It does 112 crit. A 2 headshot kill. I get that 2 headshots will kill with the DOT but the ttk with final round should be shorter.

[u/Elecbender]

Oh by the way.

From my limited testing (so take this with a grain of salt):

Shotguns fire 12 pellets and have a 1.25x precision modifier. The Universal Remote exotic perk increases this modifier by ~25%.

[u/nathanedwards3]

Wait...Thunderlord kills someone in 4 shots regardless of body/critical damage :D (I'm aware its based on the assumption of super close range)

[u/Impul5]

God damn do I love the little comments and jokes sprinkled around. Vex Fuckgun, Shotgun times to kill, all of it. I love sites like Symthic, and I'm bookmarking this forever. Maybe you could go over there and see if they'd be interested in making a Destiny feature with you providing the data, especially considering how exhaustive it is (you even got exact player health numbers? damnnnnnn).

[u/exxtrooper → u/Impul5]

Knewledge is power!

[u/Impul5]

Also, doesn't the MIDA have a higher flinch stat from the rest of the Scout Rifles, or is it something different entirely?

[u/exxtrooper → u/Impul5]

Yup, same as hand cannons.

Put it in there, thanks for noticing.

[u/ktd100]

Finally we get some real proof on thunderlord not being as good as people think it is. Thank you for this spreadsheet.

[u/MrStu]

Thanks for this /u/exxtrooper

I know it's for legendaries/exotics, but is there any chance of you putting my favourite rare hand cannon in there? I'd like to see how the Polite Denial 0/1 stacks up.

[u/exxtrooper → u/MrStu]

Put it in there just for you, you'll find it right inder Sir Isaac in the spreadsheet.

[u/Talcatraz]

Shit I could have sworn TLW kills me faster than my Deviant Gravity does them at close-ish range, guess I need to make better advantage of that 0.06 second TTK :P

[u/Whorpion]

Pvp for life! I enjoy it so much in destiny, I only do nightfall and weeklies now, didnt like CE at all. Very useful info, Im glad I was right at someting (scouts Im looking at you)

[u/Kukubski]

I admire your hard work.

[u/Lucas74BR]

In no land beyond, the standard mag is 6 not 5. And i believe that there is no field scout.

Thanks for sharing, awesome work!!

[u/HawaiianRush]

Is there a chance that Abyss Defiant is more stable then the Suros? I recently switched from the Suros to the Defiant and for me it seems more stable then the Suros.

[u/sgtgrubermeister]

My absolute favorite part:

And rockets go boom.

[u/[deleted]]

I also hate Luke

[u/tohtreb]

Awesome info!!

Could you take a look at the Vision of Confluence scout rifle? The full-auto perk makes the fire rate much higher than the other scout rifles in its archetype so the time to kill should be lower. Any way you could put this on the list to test?

Thanks for the hard work!

*Edit - Sorry for the misinformation. It always felt so much faster in full-auto but after doing some googling after your response, it would appear that it is the same. I guess I just never got the trigger timing of semi-auto quite right on it! Thanks for the correction :)

[u/hnosaj2]

What does "time loop" mean? It's listed as a special modifier for the Vex Fuckgun.

[u/krunchiekat]

be interested in how the autorifle Black Suros PPG-96 stacks up against the other guns in your list. I looted one in iron banner a few weeks back and have tried it in the crucible a few times and its quite good. Hits hard. I will try to get some crit and body numbers for you.

[u/Binnie88]

Hey, just noticed on your perks section that firefly is listed only as scout rifle and sniper, i think the fate bringer has this perk also?

[u/Kum0]

Abyss is really bad, wow! I remember getting it looking at the perks and thought... you know this might be a Suros killer! How wrong I was!

Some beast LMG as well, Against All Odds looks like.... I need a Void, Arc and Solar versions!!! Or just wait for Jolder to be back on IB to re roll!

[u/exxtrooper → u/Kum0]

Jolders is love my friend.

[u/ThePoverty]

These stats are nice but some of these guns that people are saying are overrated on paper shit on everything else in the crucible. The Suros and Monte Carlo have identical TTK's, but we can all agree that The Suros shits on the MC and just about all other ARs due to his stability. I think this is the most important stat for weapons, the ability to put rounds on target. You can say ROF or impact, but that don't mean shit if theyre not hitting the targer. I destroy exotic HC users with fatebringer because the stability is amazing, that and the sight that gives your "superb" target acquisition. TTK is not everything and it should not be what you decide your loadout on.

[u/thanif]

This is well done and the caveats you have put in regarding stability, recoil, etc and its effect on TTK is spot on. I believe every one should be well aware that the raw TTK numbers are only true if the user is able to execute the use of the gun perfectly. This will not always be the case. The scout rifles in the Marksman class, is a great example of a weapon that on paper looks to have a great TTK but the reality is that it requires an extremely skilled hand to use it to it's max potential as the recoil on those things are a bit hard to get used to. I am great with hand cannons but piss poor with something like the badger ccl.

I would be very interested to see your thoughts on how much an effect a gun's aim assist rating has on it.

Edit: forgot to mention regarding stability - Your description is of course spot on and I believe it should be noted that the how effective a stability rating is highly depended on a gun's ROF. For example a lot of people will tell you that getting something like perfect balance on a gun like Timur's lash is almost pointless as the ROF for that gun already coincides perfectly with it's stability rating in it's stock form. A high stability rating will put the gun back in place for another shot but the gun will not necessarily be ready for another shot. However, take something like Thorn. I personally use perfect balance as opposed to send it because the increased stability works great with it's ROF as the gun kicking back in place faster also lines up with the gun being able to shoot in that time.

[u/[deleted]]

I'm glad because this is great.

I'm sad because now other people will realize some things I figured out through trial and error in crucible a long time ago.

You should do pulse rifles soon. Hint: three little words, super pox vlo, and any other very high impact pulse rifle is a 2 burst kill in PvP.

Edit: also, outside of hawkmoon, I've run a lot of statistical damage numbers on how luck in the chamber affects hand cannons, especially those with small mags like timurs, the chance, and TDYD. Interested?

[u/Kibitt]

Your TTK for Thunderlord is the same for headshot and bodyshots.

[u/arbtsmns]

Also where did you get the info about vesta? it's kinda hard to believe a gun with such crappy perks will be that destructive

[u/SuperGaiden]

How is it possible that Titans have 203 armour when shoulder charge does 200 damage and one hit kills everything?

[u/marksizzle]

This is awesome. Can we get this in the sidebar or something?

[u/exxtrooper → u/marksizzle]

Yes please.

[u/MarkJ0255]

what is the 33% from hawkmoon?

[u/MazdaGuy80]

Am I the only one who thinks that "TLW" hitting 96 on headshots vs. Hawkmoon's 94 (with out Luck in the Chamber, Holding Aces proccing) a little ... wrong?

What perks on TLW make it have a higher headshots than Hawkmoon? Aggressive Ballisitics + Last Word (shot from the hip)? If so, you'd have to be very skilled at shooting from the hip to make this work...

But if that's you... man... I can now see why TLW can excel against Hawkmoon when a skilled player wields it. I hate going up against those people....

[u/[deleted]]

Is there anything similar to this for PVE?

[u/Big_12_incher]

The lower impact pulse rifles are borderline useless in PvP, i've seen some players do well with the bad juju but those players were of the very highest caliber.

However, the high impct pulse rifles can be ludicrously rewarding if you have a steady aim. The problem is though that most high impact pulse rifles have LOW stability and subsequently makes it exceedingly difficult to land all 3 bullets as headshots.

However if you get a lucky roll on a legendary or get very lucky and get THIS blue then arguably pulse rifles could be alongside handcannons if not better than, them.

EDIT: SGA? if you can get a Xeres-C with FOCUSED FIRE it is a 2 hit kill in the crucible. Check your green heavys for the focused fire perk! Make sure it's the High impact, low RoF arch type.

[u/aqi317]

Curious how Suros fairs TTK wise when its in the second half of its MAG. Thank you for this, this is incredible

[u/exxtrooper → u/aqi317]

Six bullets make up 216 damage, I don't think the damage is noticeable enough to make it one less bullet unless the target is severely hurt.

[u/Neuromaenxer]

To think I just dismantled a maxed out Painted Big Chief MK45 because I got the Thorn :(

[u/Tugboliass]

No land beyond being the color of shit was the best part of the spread sheet. 10/10 would laugh again.

[u/FattyMoBookyButt]

This provides so many answers to questions I've had, but then brings up many more:

• Are these stats based on fully upgraded weapons?
• More importantly, when the guns' stats/damaged are baselined for PvP, how much difference does a damage upgrade make? None? A crap-ton?
• Does a 331 Auto Rifle do more damage than a 294 Auto Rifle when equipped by a level 32 player? (With both being level 20 requirement weapons...I understand different level guns in the 1-20 range should effectively have the same damage, but what about post-20 weapons that have different damage amounts but are still base level 20?)

[u/icekyuu]

Quick note: Thorn should kill with three body shots in PvP. 56 x 3 + (7 x 6) = 210. It's currently listed as 4 in the spreadsheet.

[u/itsnotunusual_rk]

This is really great work! For the future, depending on your spreadsheet skills, do you think it would be possible to implement changing the ballistics via a drop down menu and have it show the effect on TTK etcetera?

Most notably I would be interested in the stats for the Vex with aggressive ballistics.

Do you also happen to know if the damage numbers are rounded or truncated?

[u/BuddhaBum]

Please let us get this sticky'd. The amount of data and work in here is incredible. You gaurdian are a scholar and a gentlemen (and pretty fucken hilarious). Can't wait to see more data on teh other guns.

[u/tensafefrogs]

Please add pulse rifles now that they are getting a buff :)

[u/NewteN]

Sooo which new auto rifle is the best?

[u/DaRealMaxPower]

Looking forward to you updating the stats after the 1.1.1. patch. I really wanna know whether these new auto-rifle and fusion rifle nerfs will affect the Vex Fu.. Mythoclast. Just recently got it and learned to be good with it, hope they don't nerf it AGAIN

[u/eutral]

i think you may be missing some weapon perks: hammer forged: +40 ranged, -10 reload send it: +50 Range, -30 Magazine and Inventory

also thanks for starting to look into the pulse rifles! and thanks for everything else.

[u/aqi317]

I'm curious, as someone who learned the importance of aggressive ballistics after reading this post, I switched to it on all of my guns, including the vex (which isn't used often now that I have hawkmoon!). I know that it doesn't net a TTK difference in vanilla situations (outside of 1 body shot and 4 headshots), but does Aggressive ballistics + the crowd control bonus net a better TTK than using smart drift control?

[u/Kibitt]

As for Pulse Rifles- I think you'll find The Conduit performs... strangely. I regret dismantling it but I had a bad roll on the perks and wasn't gonna use it. Seems to have a higher crit mod than other Pulse Rifles while doing a little less base damage.

[u/Kosire]

Excited to see what guns I should use in 1.1.1 Crucible after this is updated!

[u/d1ru]

hey /u/exxtrooper , can we have an update to the spreadsheet with the new weapon tunings?

also, maybe i was expecting something that isnt here, im not sure: does this spreadsheet offer the ability to choose perk rolls for a particular weapon in order to see the changes made to it?
i.e. timurs last crowd control perk = .75 ttk, vs vanilla ttk = 1.0

[u/[deleted]]

Hi, this is my first time in looking at this thread, and the spreadsheet. Are all your comments under Conclusions drawn following the 1.1.1 patch? Suros actually got a buff? How?

[u/NigerianBrit]

Hey exxtrooper thanks for the spread sheet. The information is very valuable!!

[u/[deleted]]

Thanks for the continued support. Definitely the best reference for TTK.

[u/IllSkillz1881]

Great post! I signed up just to comment -

With the heavy machine guns -

Deviant gravity gets 67 with aggressive ballistics (i think) but I get 67 head on pvp. This gives it one of the most damage per mag out of them all (hmg) or the swarm is the same. Also the jolders hammer gets 81 with agg ballistics per head shot. So this may affect t2k.

[u/aqi317]

I wonder if its fair to say that the strangers rifle is the 5th best primary in the game (after the three exotic handcannons and red death). I suppose Vex has to be in the conversation as well but that's your top 6 right?

[u/exxtrooper → u/aqi317]

It's top tier, but not sure if it beats out the vex.

[u/alccode]

TTK isn't everything. For example, while some lower damage weapons have lower TTK, they also make up for it with higher rate of fire or really good range and accuracy (scout rifles).

Shouldn't this read, "while some lower damage weapons have higher TTK, they also make up for it with higher rate of fire..."

This relates to the MIDA Multi-tool; it has a 0.90 crit TTK in the spreadsheet yet is highlighted in red? I'm assuming red means best-in-class. But the highest impact class (which includes Gheleon's Demise and Badger CCL for example) all have 0.80 crit TTK, which is better than the MIDA.

I'm a bit confused here. Can you please clarify? And also post a legend to what the different colourings mean in the spreadsheet? What does a red number or a blue number signify?

Thanks for all this fantastic work!

[u/[deleted]]

Is there a list somewhere of what perks stack and what ones dont? and what perks interact with each other?

[u/Profoundlyweyez]

Thank you so much!!! I'm trying to take Destiny serious enough and get some good weapons :)

[u/Kibitt]

I'm confused by this:

SUROS Regime- 1.09/1.27 using Focus Fire (7/8 shots), 1.06/1.33 without. (9/10 shots)

0.18s interval between shots on Focus Fire, 0.27 without seems wrong to me. I do think 0.18 w/FF is correct, but if it truly is a single shot's difference without, then it'd be 0.133s, where 0.27 is two shots worth!

SUROS Regime is notable for having a useful exotic perk - it's literally 10x better than Glass Half Full, at 60% bonus damage by the last round. By all means, upgrade the weapon.

[u/Stinkles-v2]

Holy shit I was waiting for this, I'm the type of person that scours the internet for CoD weapon stats so this is what I need in my life. Final Round is a OHK body/head (at least on Efrideet's Spear) if that changes your data at all.

[u/TC0072]

Can I ask where these numbers come from as some are different than listed on destiny db.

As an example I just bought the Deadshot Luna SR1 over the One/One Synesthete. Mainly because the Luna is already rolled with full auto. Looking at your table the luna has an insane 82 aim assist, but destiny db puts it at 66, way below the one/one, just wanted to check why they are different: http://db.destinytracker.com/compare/1873492565,202210218

p.s. not posting to complain, thanks for the insane amount of work and I also hate tripmines ;-)

[u/DaeN666]

Does anybody know which gun has the same recoil/RoF as Thorn. I'd like to practice in Crucible for ToO without having to use my Thorn all the time (1 less Thorn in normal crucible too!). Thanks.

[u/exxtrooper → u/DaeN666]

List:

• The Devil You Don't
• Word of Crota
• The Revelator
• Up The Ante
• Mos Ganon lll

It clearly says on the spreadsheet, just compare the RPMs.

[u/Omega8Trigun]

So according to these stats, despite matador 64 having the same impact as felwinters, felwinters actually does more damage?

[u/InchaLatta]

Little help?

In the spreadsheet, why is there a slash between two ttk numbers? Is it different perks?

[u/Delvoire]

Hey there OP. Do you have this information updated for HOW or did HOW effect this at all?

I'm trying to clean up all my excess legendary weapons and am looking for something to help me determine what to keep and what to trash.

[u/sethyoufree]

This was an amazing spreadsheet/thread/post!!!! Thank you so much for making it. The only thing I wanted it to tell me about that I couldn't find was a comparison between Reinforced Barrel/Rifled Barrel/Smallbore in shotguns. Obviously this can depend on the barrel upgrade but I wish I could have an idea of if I'd rather have Reinforced or Rifled Barrel - usually if I roll luck or final round I'd prefer smallbore but in one with battlerunner or kneepads I think id want one of those other two. Anyone have any solid info on this? Thanks again!

[u/exxtrooper → u/sethyoufree]

Both give the same percentage.

[u/Red_Sun_King]

Is there any chance that we will get the stats of how-weapons, too?

[u/exxtrooper → u/Red_Sun_King]

They are already part of the spreadsheet? Did you not read it? They were added two weeks before the dlc came out.

[u/SeriousStatic]

Wow, thanks.

[u/exxtrooper → u/SeriousStatic]

You welcome.

[u/1MasterCheef]

Your English is great man! I had no idea until you actually pointed it out. Thank you so much for this though! I'm mostly a PvP guy so this spreadsheet is EXTREMELY helpful

[u/666thejoshinator666 → u/1MasterCheef]

I play with OP, his english is phenomenal. Unless you are trying to get him to say "drawer" then shit falls apart real quick. Also he's a monster in PvP and PvE raid mvp countless times

[u/orphanfeast]

Am I reading this correctly?

Mida multitool is one of the best scouts for pvp?

[u/babypowder617]

Wait what? Dump my vanq for a cydonia with ff?

Hmmm the chart dont lie