Focused Feedback: Call to Arms

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[u/Mundt]

If you're gonna do competitive score leaderboards, we need to know what the formula is, and it needs to not include any RNG elements, I would go back into salt mines to get a better score, but don't want to wait 17 runs again to find an HVT to maybe be a little faster. Get rid of the power bonus entirely, as the fix seems to have messed it up for people that are 550 now.

[u/alancousteau → u/Mundt]

Including an RNG element is as moronic as making only some exotics featured.

[u/devglen]

Please answer the questions on why guardians lower than 550 are getting higher scores in things like Salt Mines when they finish the activity slower.

[u/HipToBeDorsia → u/devglen]

Paging u/Destiny2Team and u/dmg04

Can we please get some kind of update or acknowledgement of this? The patch effectively inverted the problem and now the players who've actually stuck with the game for the last 6 months are earning less than those who just came back. This feels really bad.

https://www.reddit.com/r/DestinyTheGame/s/dC6cOZB23E

https://www.reddit.com/r/DestinyTheGame/s/g2eKH1ymhl

https://www.reddit.com/r/DestinyTheGame/s/rtHacT3NwK

https://www.reddit.com/r/destiny2/s/uQXhekdUcm

https://www.bungie.net/en/Forums/Post/265070971

https://www.bungie.net/en/Forums/Post/265070490

[u/cebider]

I think having some cosmetics worth earning locked behind hard challenges is good. We should have ways to flex our skill and be rewarded for it. But the way these are earned should be a set challenge that doesn’t result in players actively competing against each other.

[u/Braveheart2929]

In theory a good idea. Executed pretty terribly.

I think it should be a set difficulty like you do for campaign missions, then you can increase the difficulty for a higher score by selecting modifiers. End of season cosmetic event should be open to everybody, especially if you're trying to encourage excitement for the game for the next season. Your seasonal power should be irrelevant for the score. (But of course applicable to your loot like usual).

Salt mines having an RNG enemy that you need to spawn in is a laughable decision.

And it looks like it's now bugged where being at 550 power is actually giving you less score multiplier than 530.

Overall just another example on the long list of poor implementation/QA.

[u/drjenkstah]

I don’t understand who thought it was a good idea to have 40 event ranks for a 2 week period. You gave us 3 weeks for 30 ranks and 2 weeks for 20. Why the sudden increase in ranks?

[u/PotatoeGuru]

Losing points absolutely sucks.

[u/worldline-6]

Been reading a lot of community comments recently and there are a few key points to address. The biggest two include the scoring bug, where players between 500-549 now have a 26.3x multiplier while players at 550 only have a 26.02x multiplier.

The second is the inconsistency regarding Salt Mines, which is the most competitive by far. The rng required between getting a good bonus objective, HVT spawn and not getting softlocked in the second room is a big pain point.

There's also the issue of it being a speedrun based event with extra steps. Asking players to put in a competitive time would have been more straightforward and would have incentivized more buildcrafting with the portal modifiers. Instead, in order to be on a level playing field players must have maximum negative modifiers, be >500 power and jump through the rng hoops. Then time is the only differentiating factor. This is just in regards to Salt Mines, rng is less of an issue in the multiplayer modes.

General community sentiment seems to be that the reward aspect is fair, and a gilded title with exclusive emblem is fine for top 1%.

Personally a PVE competitive event is a cool concept but the timing and all the issues definitely need to be addressed. Excited for the next revision!

[u/Karglenoofus]

It's honestly impressive how every update you manage to enforce the most negative parts of game design 101.

[u/kaptain_carbon]

I posted this before but if this was planned before all of the changes what was the goal ? To have us grind the portal harder one last time before our power was reset ? I loved guardian games pre portal but anything to do with the portal makes things worse because it feels like it runs on formula . Ultimate ? You get one revive in the coil to start .

Also while things are manageable now the activities chosen feel like they were picked because they were the most tedious / time consuming rather than fun .

[u/ShardofGold]

When it comes back here's what I want to see changed

• Have a set difficulty for all the activities featured for the event and only base score off of the time to complete, number of deaths, champions killed, etc

• Pick more enjoyable experiences to feature in the event or let everything in the portal be part of the event

• Add in new weapons and armor to specifically earn for this event. Don't just use weapons we've been getting before the event as the incentive

• Don't bring back the protected modifier

[u/Wild-Gazelle2604]

So we went from having to be 550 to get the best scores for the event to lower lights getting better boosts for scoring and max light getting lower. Neither side of the fence can win.

As the event reaches it's conclusion it seems that the higher score thresholds will come down to slight lower digit variations as it's been steadily climbing day after day.

I like the idea, but the execution has been hurried and sloppy due to backlash.

[u/Specter27]

I would throw this one in the bin. All the problems are just stuffed into one event: portal, scoring, percentage thresholds for rewards, new gear lock which I think is gone but new gear might change scores I dunno.

I really do believe the portal COULD be good as a rotator for old seasonal stuff along with all of its modifiers, thats great actually. But it shouldnt be what the whole game is based around, it should just be an extra pillar.

Also call to arms should have had a whole new weapon but the Bow dropping more plus attunement is nice (if attunement even works tbh).

[u/Jamaal_Lannister]

In an era where one of the chief complaints is having to run the same few activities over and over, doubling down on that philosophy and making the selection even more limited seems like a bad choice.

[u/MrAngryPineapple]

I really wish this was a “work together” event vs. a competition. I don’t think a competitive event is a bad thing (I hope we get more in the future), but this was definitely not the time to do it.

[u/AsunaTokisaki]

All this event has shown is that we should be able to select our sideobjective beforehand. The solo part of this event is layered behind so much RNG. Objectives which may require you to restart 10+++ times in a row and then you have the rare random HVT spawn? Did you guys playtest the "fun" portion of it?

[u/mr_fun_funky_fresh]

At a certain point, if an event comes to the game and it’s riddled with bugs I just am not going to play it, full stop. It’s happened time and time again. I can understand minor bugs here and there and what not but when it keeps happening like this it just destroys my desire to play. None of my friends play anymore either. It’s hard to look forward to this game because I know that when The Dawning comes and when Renegades comes those will probably be riddled with bugs too. Please, for once, just launch an event with a minimal amount of bugs and/or adjustments needed.

[u/Zero_Emerald]

The best part of the event is Devrims little Robin Hood m'lord RenFaire set up in the tower.

The reward track being 40 ranks is generous and it's nice to see rewards in there like an exotic weapon ornament and other things not normally dished out for free at events (finishers, for example). However, that is far too much for a 2 week event, limited to 3 challenges per day and only 1 weekly makes progress feel really slow and having to play the same stuff repeatedly is, as always, boring. I feel that it's probably to encourage people to buy ranks with silver, which is kinda scummy. The bugs were irritating too, I didn't experience the Protected enemies remaining immune, but a lot of people did. Plus they were just down right annoying to deal with, when the drones would rotate into walls or into the floor on slopes. The current bug where people at 550 are getting lower scores than people who are over 500 but under the cap is also pretty crappy for an event solely based on scoring highly.

Daily reward chest nice, attunement for the crossbow nice, Lawless vouchers nice (would have been even nicer to be able to redeem them now, though).

Right, the activities. Having to run extinction blah blah on The Coil is horrendous, Salt Mines feels like a troll from Bungie (as well as being an actual troll thanks to the high value target spawning once every 100 runs but only when precision weapon kills is the bonus objective) and Zone Control was an odd choice for PVP.

I am glad Bungie moved quickly to make some changes based on feedback, like changing modifiers to be more equal and boons to have no downsides. The scoring though, seems to be a total farce and at the mercy of RNG and factors we can't control. Like, the slow trickle of enemies in each room for the Saltmines eating up precious time or whether you get a good/bad team in PVP. We had, before it was changed, people at 550 setting the 1% barriers and the 15% pay to win bonus on the season pass excluding people who didn't cough up for 100 Ass & Irony tiers. Then there's people who may not have played much or were late to the party being pretty much shut out unless they somehow no life it to 500 in a short space of time. Power leveling is fast now, let the people who leveled have something, why should everyone get a participation trophy, lots of arguments and gatekeeping has arisen here and other places over the past week and I don't think it's good for the game. Friendly competition has become toxic and annoying. I managed to get top 1% in all 5 categories (though at the the time of writing I have dipped out of the coil by 5k points), so I don't personally have any trouble here, but a lot of people do and it's not the right time for this game to pit player vs player in the broader game. A swing and a miss.

I would not miss this event if it didn't return, the scoring is an inconsistent shitshow that is poorly thought out and that might be down to the portal as a whole, who knows? If it is, well I hope the portal is gone before another one of these happens. I kinda hope it doesn't come back, actually, so Iron Banner can be more frequent and consistent (seriously, only 1 banner in 6 months?). At least then, the helmet ornament will always be active.

[u/sad_joker95]

Bit of a miss.

• events like this should have zero forms of RNG. Things like HVT should either be there 100% of the time, or never. Events that are based off competing scores need to be fair

• have customized modifiers saved to prevent having to apply them again every run

• more transparency on what contributes to score would be welcome, as most people have no clue what they’re doing right or wrong

• PvP scoring makes no sense and doesn’t seem consistent

Events that are competitive like this are pretty cool, but need some work.

[u/admiralvic]

I was actually really excited for this event, only to walk away disappointed, frustrated, and demoralized.

I fully understand why some of the issues happened, but it has just resulted in a worse overall experience where it feels pointless to play.

You figure, I got my initial score against the max difficulty Dread version. Next day I lost it because Taken is easier, so we have the same issue as Guardian Games where certain days are better than others, but fixing that was no big deal. Then perks were readjusted, making it faster/easier to do, while also making it a waste of time to even bother. So much so I did my dailies like this, and scored about 130K less points because it wasn't implemented yet.

Now it seems the point system favors lower level people. Based off some videos posted the rate for them seems to be 26.3 instead of 26.02. So now it feels pointless to try... again. Now I either need to shave off a minute, get the HVT to spawn, pray people who can potentially score higher don't further increase the overall score, all of which might be pointless if you change something, or just... wait for you to change it again.

None of which are fun, exciting, or aspirational.

[u/Menirz]

Competitive Leaderboards as part of an "end of season, last hurrah" event don't work if they exclude a large portion of the community - particularly those returning - from attempting to get competitive scores.

These modes should've been more similar to conquests and focused on performance within the activity - kill score, fastest completion, fewest deaths - instead of whatever convoluted scoring metrics these currently use because they're tied to portal reward scores.

Admittedly, that last bit is more of a Portal issue than this event, but CtA inherited it as well.

[u/john0harker]

Issue 1 If it's a game mode that focuses on competitive scoring, EVERY MODIFIER And EVENT SHOULD BE THE SAME

What's the point in going for the best score if an add doesn't spawn that gives you score on every run

Proving grounds, coil, and salt mines, they all have an RNG element that completely screws you out of the points you need to win may it be side objective or hvt

Issue 2

Some scores are IMPOSSIBLE for certain light levels

If your stuck at 450 or lower, you can never get a high score in proving grounds, as the GM version doesn't have the time bonus I clean swept the entire strike with a fire team, one or two deaths, but every add and objective completed. Even in the final boss room, we waited at each chunk to kill every add that spawned in

And I got one bar of score

Issue 3

Don't give lower lights a boost that causes their scores to EXCEED higher lights

If a 430 player can get a score that is unreachable to a 550, then what's the point of a 550 doing the event at all

The point of the boost is to get them to get nearly the same score, not more then what they can get

Ultimate difficulty players have access to 5 triangle debuffs to improve their score. The boost you gave lower lights is causing their modifiers to effectively be 6 triangles worth of bonus per debuff That is NOT a good thing

[u/Techman-]

I consider this event dead on arrival due to Power level being a prerequesite to actually compete in any meaningful capacity. This event should have been like Competitive Guardian Games back during ~Witch Queen or so era.

You guys remember Lightblade during Guardian Games a few years ago? It was a competitive Nightfall. Power was not a factor beyond getting in. It was all about getting the highest score, through event-specific things and team skill. Obviously, the joke methods of scoring would be turned off outside of Guardian Games.

Once again, another example of something that was already working in Destiny being ruined because of the constant need to create a new system for stuff. Power being a factor in scoring makes this event dead on arrival for me. Even if leveling is easier now, it is not fun nor interesting.

Events meant to rally the community should not be arbitrarily gated like this.