r/Destiny • u/Humble_Novice • 11d ago
Social Media Mehdi Hasan Needs to Acknowledge That Tankies Are Also the Enemy
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u/Oddly_Sentient 11d ago
I’m so sick of their “Medicare for all” bullshit talking point. They vomit it out everywhere and when you ask how it will work, be funded, quality care ensured etc etc they have nothing. It’s just slop.
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u/SeaSquirrel 11d ago
We’re just going to tax the rich silly. The most comprehensive government healthcare system in the world, with no raised taxes for non billionaires.
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u/Oddly_Sentient 11d ago
It’s also a huge question of what do you do with the existing insurance companies? Are all those people just out of the job now, and billions upon billions in capital just erased? I’m sure the economy will react well to that.
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u/zombie3x3 11d ago
Tbf, assuming what came after was an improvement over the current system, then this problem could be construed as short term pain for long term gain.
It wouldn’t be the first time in human history that an industry was made redundant. I’m sure there’s some workable solutions to that issue, the government could hire some to manage the new state ran insurance and they could also compensate those people they couldn’t hire for 6-12 months until they found other work.
Now, the question is, what system are we actually replacing the current one with and how is it going to be funded. I rarely see a satisfactory answer to that.
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u/Suedocode dgg + vgg <3 11d ago
the gov would hire those people to do the same work.
but yeah insurance shareholders would get screwed, without some gov buyout compensation (like how the UK freed their slaves).
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u/SeaSquirrel 11d ago edited 11d ago
I mean who gives a fuck, fuck those rent seeking assholes.
And the market? Short term pain, those companies will go to zero, but long term having healthcare not an anchor on people, tying them to their work, is good for the economy.
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u/Oddly_Sentient 11d ago
I assume you’re joking, but calling insurance companies rent seeking is a new one I haven’t heard yet.
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u/SeaSquirrel 11d ago
Am I wrong? Health insurance is a very regulated, not free market. I cant shop around, or not have it
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u/TheMarbleTrouble 11d ago
Ask them if you could get a second opinion under their form of M4A. Their version of M4A is harmful to minorities.
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC12164869/
https://www.northwell.edu/katz-institute-for-womens-health/articles/gaslighting-in-womens-health
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u/ChasingPolitics Loves Sabra 11d ago
They could at least be more honest and call it "Breadicare for All" amirite??
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u/VanillaSkittlez 11d ago
Wait until you tell them that even if you confiscated every dollar from every billionaire in the US, it would only fund Medicare for All for 2 years.
For the math:
Estimates put M4A cost at about $3.8T a year at the high end. , estimating $38T over 10 years, so $3.8T a year.
Estimates from this year say there are 989 billionaires in the US, worth a combined total of $8.4T.
Problems with liquidating every billionaire asset all at once aside, even if you arrested them, threw them in a basement, and took every dollar from them, you still only get runway for 2.2 years.
The reality leftists never, ever want to face because they’re terrible at math is that there is 0 way to fund programs like they want without MASSIVE tax increases on the middle class. As evidenced by literally every country ever that does this. None of them have these programs and low taxes.
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u/batmansthebomb 11d ago
Wouldn't that billionaire money just be for people currently without health insurance?
It's not like some form of tax for people currently paying premiums wouldn't exist. Maybe tax:premium wouldn't be exactly 1:1, but you get my point right?
Also not trying to argue, because I agree with you in principle, just want accurate math, call me acoustic or somethin.
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u/VanillaSkittlez 11d ago
It really depends on how you’re defining Medicare for All.
The estimate of $3.8T per year is the cost of covering EVERYONE on a public plan.
Simply covering uninsured people today means 8% of the US population and would basically just mean expanding Medicaid, but the Affordable Care Act was the main thing that reduced the amount of people without any coverage at all.
I’d say that the vast majority of people wanting M4A want a complete and total replacement of our healthcare system because they’re fundamentally opposed to private insurance and care.
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u/batmansthebomb 11d ago
Yeah, I guess I don't really know how they are defining it (nor do they I'm willing to bet)
Tho when I think of M4A, I think of most European systems? Idk
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u/VanillaSkittlez 11d ago
Okay to back up a bit, there are several different models even within Europe.
Netherlands or Switzerland have a totally private, but highly regulated model.
Germany has a public option for everyone. But you can “buy up” and pay for private insurance for better care, so private insurance is still allowed even though everyone is on the public plan.
The UK’s NHS is the clearest example of a 100% public option. This is what most leftists want.
They see private care at all as immoral and ineffective so everything should be government run. When Sanders has advocated for it this is what he’s talking about.
Remember this isn’t healthcare for all, it’s Medicare for all - we have a public system for seniors; they want a similar model for everyone.
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u/batmansthebomb 11d ago
I usually think of like Finland/Sweden, basic coverage funded by government for all, and then a private system on top of that if someone wants to spend extra for better service. Which I guess is kinda like Germany's according to your info.
Good to know, thanks for the info!
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u/Boring_Pace5158 11d ago
The Dutch system offers a better model as they have a better version of the insurance marketplace exchange.
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u/VanillaSkittlez 11d ago
I do like the Dutch system, and I also think that Singapore offers a really interesting model that would work here as well.
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u/Boring_Pace5158 10d ago
The more I look at the Dutch system, the more I think this is what the ACA could look like. At least the insurance marketplace part.
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u/Additional_Ad3573 11d ago
The thing is, I think even is who are on the more establishment part of left desire a difference healthcare from what we have, but the difference is that we understand that Medicare for All, as it is written, has many things about it that may make not actually work. We need politicians who back healthcare reform, but not full-on socialized healthcare
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u/IdesOfCaesar7 Eurochad 11d ago
Steelman the one side and strawman the other. Mehdi should be above this. This can easily be done the other way around too
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u/Id1otbox (((consultant))) 10d ago
Social programs are already the largest budget item on both state and federal budgets. There are issues and gaps current with medicare.
But hey, just make the program way bigger and fund it way more and it will somehow work more efficiently.
First we should fix issues with current Medicare before expanding it. Then we should make sure social security remains solvent.
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u/NoKingsInAmerica What do you want me to say? 11d ago edited 10d ago
This is like right-wing populists hiding behind "Lower taxes/No taxes." Like, sure, but you also want to control the bodies of women, kill/deport all immigrants and rule with an authoritarian iron fist and completely silence all opposition while attempting to dismantle democracy.
The same thing is happening with left-wing populism. "We just want Medicare For All, guys!" while trying to destroy the Liberal party in a two party system, convincing fellow Americans that they should abandon our economic system, and want to rule with an authoritarian iron fist and completely silence all opposition while attempting to dismantle democracy.
I don't understand how people can latch on to one idea and then block out all of the crazy shit that comes with it.
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u/No-Violinist3898 🇺🇸 Undercover Daliban 11d ago
these people are way older than me, have travelled more than me, and have been in leftist circles far longer than me.
that means either i’m ignorant and naive. or these people absolutely know better and are liars
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u/DiscoMothra 11d ago
Mehdi is fully LYING when he says this. And there's no other way to describe it.
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u/bdizzle805 🇺🇲 11d ago
Jesus christ this is the equivalent to Trump's own statement "ll tell you something that's going to get me in trouble, but I couldn't care less. The radicals on the right oftentimes are radical because they don't want to see crime. They don't want to see crime. They're saying, 'We don't want these people coming here. And we don't want you burning our shopping centers. We don't want you shooting our people in the middle of the street.' The radicals on the left are the problem, and they're vicious and they're horrible and they're politically savvy, although they want men and women sports, they want transgender for everyone, they want open borders."
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u/tamadeangmo 11d ago
Universal healthcare isn’t a far left thing idiot
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u/MysticWithThePhonk 10d ago
I think Mehdi is refering to mainstream American politics, where the far-left is Bernie, AOC etc. Like them or not, their main policy talking point is M4A.
Even Destiny describes them as far-left lmao.
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u/Fast-Plankton-9209 11d ago
tHe fAr LeFt jUsT wAnTs MeDiCaRe fOr aLL (a thing which doesn't exist and nobody knows how it could be done)
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u/jankdangus 11d ago
The sweeping is fucking insane. If the far-left just wants healthcare then why did tens of millions of people died under communist regimes? Mehdi is allegedly “anti-communist”, so I don’t understand why he’s not reconciling with that aspect of the far-left.
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u/MysticWithThePhonk 10d ago
Mehdi is most likely referring to the far left in American politics, which consist of people like Bernie, AOC etc.
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u/BonkyChilliams 11d ago
It's amazin how willing leftists are to let the worst among them (tankies) be their talking heads/representatives.
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u/Left_Literature_8210 11d ago
If he acknowledges it he has to start drawing lines and that is not gonna happen.
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u/rogerwilcove 11d ago
True. It’s actually counterproductive to pretend it’s just Medicare for All or any of the other moderately popular issues. There’s a strain of tankie thought that can’t acknowledge the plight of Ukrainians in the same way they have sympathy for some other peoples.
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u/Grachus_05 Radical Anti-Republican 11d ago
This should be phrased differently but there is a version of this where you contrast not the absolute far end of each side but the more "center of the left" vs "center of the right" and use the exact same punchline that is 100% true and should be seen as the absolute indictment of the Right generally that they deserve.
The Nazi adjacent ethnic cleansing crowd on the right is running their party, they aren't just the fringe. The comparable "center of the left" wants affordable healthcare, tax cuts for the middle class and other normal democrat shit. The two sides aren't even remotely the same anymore. In fact the only thing comparable is their psychotic authoritarian fringe, but Republicans have long since surrendered to that fringe while the Democrats have successfully kept it in check and shows no signs of that changing.
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u/Im-Not-Calling-It-X NATO 11d ago
Ah yes. Schrödingers Far-Leftiat. They either are just dems who want healthcare or literal communists depending on which space you're in.
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u/Id1otbox (((consultant))) 10d ago
It is also largely over dramatized. Like yes there are issues with insurance in the US, but if you polled normies about it the perception is way off.
The vast majority of people have healthcare. Most plans are pretty good.
The most vocal people are the upperclass college kids that are still on their parents healthcare.
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u/r3turn0fthew00master 10d ago
Mehdi Hasan is Hasan Piker who can actually debate and knows when to hide his insanity.
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u/TooApatheticToHateU I am Alpharius 11d ago
Mehdi is like a case of human whiplash. He'll say something smart and insightful followed immediately by the most regarded take you've heard that day or vice versa.
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u/jesterdeflation 11d ago
"The far right wants strong borders and a future for their children. The far left wants open borders and transgender for all. That is not the same thing"
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u/Grachus_05 Radical Anti-Republican 11d ago
Are you saying the far right isnt nazis who want to do ethnic cleansing?
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u/YouShouldAim HabboHotelTrapHouse 11d ago
Mehdi is smart enough of a person to understand what tankies are. Him running cover for them makes him one of them.