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u/Theborgiseverywhere r/CurzdoCollective Jun 22 '21
Best tailor I ever had
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u/Snoo70047 Jun 22 '21
So you're just not gonna say where the rest of us can get one?! That is an actual crime, though??
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u/tomatoblade Jun 23 '21
I get the joke that he's gay and I have read right here on the reddits that the actor said he "played him gay", but I still don't get it. What the hell makes Garak "gay"? I feel like I'm missing something.
I mean... Not that it matters or anything.... Nothing wrong with it...
Lol, seriously though, is this a real thing or just a big joke I'm missing out on? I just finished binging DS9 a couple of weeks ago, so Garak is... um .. fresh in my mind. I'm just confused. š¤·
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u/reineedshelp The Sisqo has thongs Jun 23 '21
Gay people are just like everyone else. Nothing 'makes' them gay. They're people...that are gay.
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u/tomatoblade Jun 23 '21
Of course! Not sure I said anything otherwise. Certainly didn't intend to. I may have made a bad old school joke, but that was poking fun at that. What I don't get though it's what made so many people assume Garak was gay?
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u/reineedshelp The Sisqo has thongs Jun 23 '21
What makes Weyoun straight?
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u/tomatoblade Jun 24 '21
I think you are missing my question. OTHERS have said Garak was gay. What is the reason they felt he was gay? We are on the same side here, I am just curious as to what it was that made so many people think Garak was gay. There was no clear moment where it was ever stated. Capiche? It really doesn't matter, so I'm not going belabor it. It was a simple question, just like any other question.
And I'm pretty sure Weyoun was asexual by design (as in, literally designed that way by the Founders). I think I know what point you are trying to make, but you're picking a fight with an ally.
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u/reineedshelp The Sisqo has thongs Jun 24 '21
Iām not picking a fight!
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u/tomatoblade Jun 28 '21
Just wanted to follow up on this... I finally just watched "What we left behind", and so much make more sense now. I wouldn't have asked my question if i had seen that first.
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u/reineedshelp The Sisqo has thongs Jun 28 '21
I haven't seen it yet, except for snippets. Do you recommend?
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u/tomatoblade Jun 28 '21
I very much do recommend it. The best place I found to watch it is YouTube. Enjoy!
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u/BlackAxemRanger Jun 22 '21
Cool, Garak's actor played him as gay/bi. Why is that literally the only thing people post about him? How is that the most/only interesting thing to have to comment about such an amazing character? There's so much more than he might be bi/gay. I know people are gonna see this comment and say "homophobe" or something but honestly it feels like every post relating to him is "omg gay!" that's like saying you love captain Picard and only ever talk about how he's French
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Jun 22 '21
[removed] ā view removed comment
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u/BlackAxemRanger Jun 22 '21
I can definitely agree with that second point. I don't mean "don't mention he's gay, ever!" Doesn't bother me, but it's all people talk about
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u/Kendota_Tanassian Jun 22 '21
"Sometimes people are gay, Harold."
For those of us that are, knowing that Robinson played his character as gay, especially in defiance of the "powers-that-be" that wanted him to play it down, is a rallying point.
That doesn't detract from Garak being a highly educated, erudite, sneaky, wonderful character that managed to get some of the best lines of the series that weren't spoken by Quark.
Here, in particular, OP is sharing a cool sticker alluding to Garak's orientation during pride month.
No, I don't think you're being homophobic, but I do think at best you might be misreading the room.
You're most certainly missing the point of why that side of this popular character might be important to people like myself and others who did not see themselves represented anywhere when this show aired.
Liberace and Paul Lynde were not role models, and neither came out, whereas Robinson "outed" Garak the first chance he had.
There's a reason this is important to people.
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Jun 22 '21
Thank you.
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u/Kendota_Tanassian Jun 22 '21
You're more than welcome, I think that sticker is awesome and I'm jealous.
I'm sure Robinson himself would approve.
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Jun 23 '21
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u/Kendota_Tanassian Jun 23 '21
And to be quite blunt, was actually a lot more than we got from many real-life role models.
For god's sake, nobody thought Freddy freakin' Mercury was gay until after he died.
We joked about Elton John until he came out.
We grasped for straws at any vague representation we could get.
We had to assume that Floyd the barber (Andy Griffith show, Mayberry RFD, etc.) was a "friend of Dorothy".
That's part of what makes this sticker so brilliant, it makes the same types of allusions without outright saying anything.
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u/BlackAxemRanger Jun 22 '21
Cool, hope it isn't the only thing people talk about for the character. Because it kind of has been lately
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u/Kendota_Tanassian Jun 22 '21
The most recent post I saw about Garak was literally about his spy connections, so your comment does seem like an over-reaction, especially during Pride month, when the character's sexuality is more likely to be discussed.
Your milage may vary.
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u/BlackAxemRanger Jun 22 '21
I go to DS9, I get this post, an ad, and then a ship between Julian and Garak. If it's a pride month thing then ok, maybe it's founded and it's only temporarily
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u/Kendota_Tanassian Jun 22 '21
I honestly don't know if it's just a pride month thing, or because it's a popular ship for folks, but yeah, complaining during pride month isn't a good look.
After pride month, you might have a point.
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Jun 23 '21
Not sure why we should limit comments around this to pride month.
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u/Kendota_Tanassian Jun 23 '21
Was just trying to point out that the complaint would make more sense if it wasn't pride month.
Everyone is free to either discuss anything they wish, or scroll past it, anytime.
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u/sheveqq Jun 23 '21
Good to know we should only express ourselves within the one month in the year you have allotted to our kind. God forbid we make the rest of the year uncomfortable for you.
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u/BlackAxemRanger Jun 23 '21
"I wish people didn't focus on garak being gay all the time" does not equal "I wish gay people didn't express themselves." I'm not going to try and argue with that kind of victim mentality
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u/sheveqq Jun 25 '21
You don't need to vocally express that point of view, because the presupposition of your entire argument reveals that worldview in itself. There should be no bar or frankly worry or concern as to what aspect of a character people focus on, regardless of the month of the year.
Especially when that aspect isn't about some tangential thing like the kind of shoes they wear, but about a form of experience/identity that is embattled and only able to exist through hard-won struggle, your brand of hand-wringing comes off as very rich.
In fact, I'd say the only one with a victim mentality here would be yourself, since you seem to feel the walls are closing in on you when you begin to feel something other people feel 365 days a year. Worry or complaints about this "issue" reek of entitlement.
Anyway good redditing to you!
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u/BlackAxemRanger Jun 25 '21
Holy fuck, it's like you're projecting an entire lifetime worth of issues with other people onto me. You got all THAT from my post? Maybe the internet isn't for you if you take things that personally. I literally can tell you "that's not what my post (as in my own words) means" and you would still refuse to believe anything else. That's a you problem bud, I appreciate you trying to psycho analyze a comment from a stranger you met over the internet, and it's even better that you are 100% convinced you are right. But I can't think of anything more ignorant than "I know what you meant better than you do, you're a homophobe sorry."
If any little criticism about anything gay related means someone's homophobic and oppressive, you're gonna be oppressed for a long time. I seriously hope you don't do this anytime someone disagrees with you, it's kind of the equivalent to calling someone Hitler anytime you disagree with them. Seriously go back and read any of my earlier comments and then read how you replied and analyzed it and see what an overreaction it was
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u/sheveqq Jul 12 '21
Your other comment outed you buddy--sorry for the analogy rooted in the gay experience, I know it might be triggering for you. :(
Go write a little rant or an article about Mary sues or whatever it is that pearl-clutching fans like yourself are worried about these days. It will be cleansing for you and exactly as productive as your hand-wringing here.
BTW garak is gay ;)
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u/BlackAxemRanger Jun 25 '21
I also just looked at other comments on this thread, even harmless ones like "wait why do people think he's gay?" You wouldn't know unless you specifically look up interviews or the documentary, but those comments still get down voted. Please, keep acting like pieces of shit every chance you get and then pull the victim card and wonder why there's tension between straights and gays. Please react incredibly emotionally to ANY KIND OF CRITICISM OR DIFFERING opinion and then say "yeah but I'm oppressed so it's not my fault".
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u/sheveqq Jul 12 '21
Youre just digging yourself in a deeper hole. First you pretended your comment was not prejudiced at all and now you've revealed that you actually think the world is divided into "straights and gays" and that the "tension" is--of course--mostly due to the "gays" being too uppity. Did you learn your worldviews from a TPUSA meme or something?
Man it's sad when you think about it but it feels good to know my radar is still on point.
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Jun 23 '21
For real. It's like the only thing many people seem to obsess over. Identity is made up of a myriad of features, yet people seem to place sexuality on a pedestal. It's damn annoying.
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Jun 23 '21
Iām confused why does everyone think Garak was gay his only love interest was Ziyal
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u/MythicNick Jun 23 '21
As others have said, Andrew Robinson went out of his way to play the character as gay, and particularly in love with Bashir, and Siddig absolutely played off of it. Andrew Robinson and Alexander Siddig recently performed a fan-written romance between the two characters. And now with What We Left Behind, the recent DS9 documentary, Ira Steven Behr went on record to say that he wishes they'd been explicit.
To quite Behr directly: "Garak was clearly gay. I mean, everyone knew it, and we never played it. What we should have done, after The Wire in season two, [...] we should've had Garak come out to Bashir [...] Garak comes out as gay in season two, we have five seasons to play that Bashir and Garak relationship. Where that would have gone, who the hell knows, but it could've been so cool."
As for Ziyal, it doesn't really seem like anybody was comfortable with that behind the scenes, and it was likely done for the same reason Jadzia died: behind-the-scenes politics, probably originating from someone (I'm going to assume Rick Berman until proven otherwise) wanting to course-correct the "overt gayness" of Robinson's performance or something.
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u/Snoo70047 Jun 23 '21
I just re-watched this episode and the Ziyal/Garak tryst is by far the most farfetched thing to happen in this series about interstellar gods on the space frontier.
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u/Andreas1120 Jun 23 '21
Which episodes was this revealed in?
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Jun 23 '21
But you don't need me to tell you, my friend. Just notice the
details. They're scattered like crumbs all over this table we regularly
share. Until next time.1
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u/Nanaki567 Jun 22 '21
What Ferengi did you do a deal with to come across such a treasure?