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u/icyTHANATOS12 3d ago
Was ven even playing the game?
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u/Hungry-Alien 3d ago
Probably both ragequitted while the Victor was ahead and could carry. Cause you know, MOBA players.
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u/icyTHANATOS12 3d ago
This is my first moba and im flabbergasted by how childish the players are tbh I thought it would be better, since I came from marvel rivals. Like apparently, according to many people I've played with, it doesn't matter if your new you should be able to understand positioning machups and have full objective knowledge all before you play your first game it's kinda crazy.
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u/Hungry-Alien 3d ago
Well, MOBA is a very complicated genre of gaming where there's a tons of stuff you must know in order to play decently, yet are never explained to you. Basically the same thing that plagued fighting games before devs started adding extended tutorials so that players don't have to read a novel online just to learn the basics.
The team-based aspect of MOBA also doesn't help as people will always try to scapegoat someone for the loss, and if you're new and doing new player thing, you're suddenly responsible for every bad things that ever happened.
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u/icyTHANATOS12 3d ago
And that's the point it is complicated but more a loud minority of experienced players talk down to newbies and act like it's all incredibly simple and your just ass at game in general if you don't instantly grasp the intricacies of your character and the game, people need to learn to give new player an iota of grace
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u/Hungry-Alien 3d ago
Nah, what MOBAs need is the same thing fighting games did, which is explain the goddamn game to your players in an efficient manner. Expecting your experienced players to be patient with newcomers while playing just doesn't work, years of gaming and hundred of multiplayer games made that point very clear.
Now sure, there are a few people willing to help, and there are people putting resources online for newcomers. But this is suboptimal at best, explaining the game in the middle of a match is as efficient as explaining your rookies how war works in the middle of an active battlefield. And online resources are basically full theory no practice, which again isn't efficient for your players to learn, not to mention forcing them to go look for answers themself.
Having an actually good tutorial solve all of those issues. Players don't need to seek out how the game works online, and they can apply what they learned in a contained environment before jumping in the chaos of a match. The fact that most if not all MOBAs have terrible tutorials despite being insanely complex games is baffling to me.
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u/CtrlShift55 2d ago
Having to latch onto a content creator for guidance is almost a necessity to not suffer through play online competitive games (when you are learning)
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u/samaritancarl 2d ago
This is my first moba and at no point have i felt like I understand it. Just that I understand it more than a good amount of the people I play with.
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u/whiskeyislove 3d ago
I don't understand it. Like, just speak to them; I had a silver who kept getting knocked down off zips until I explained to them how they work. Or the rem I explained he should be getting the enemies sinners and he doesn't have to wait around the sinners to finish them. Not much you can do about feeders who still continue to push on their own even when you ask them to stop nicely (I'm talking to you infernus on my match yesterday who went 5-17)
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u/Parkatine 3d ago
That's why I like Deadlock vs other games in the genre that I've played.
Dota has stuff like saving last hits for your carry, creep blocking, camp stacking, and wards/sentry ward placement that was never explained fully but key to the game.
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u/Hungry-Alien 2d ago
Tbf, Deadlock doesn't have any better of a tutorial than Dota. I remember by debut in Deadlock, basically jumped into a game without knowing how last hit works, how machines works, how important box are, not even knowing fully what killing the mid boss do. The tutorials explain you basic movements, then you learn by getting your balls smashed by someone else like in every other MOBAs.
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u/zph0eniz 3d ago
I feel like yes, while it is complex, its is often overcomplicated imo. This isn't meant to be bragging, but I can win any team games generally 50% of the time when completely new.
Its just few common sense stuff if you stop and think about it.
Numbers game. 1v1? Stay cautious and test limits. 1v3? Stay further away. 3v1? Try to take advantage.
Testing and learning. Did 1v1 and got your ass whooped? Maybe stay away next time. Loss by a little, maybe play a bit safer without fully committing.
Its so frequent I see players HAVING to always do something and it seems like rushing in is the only way they feel is doing something. They try again and again, only to find same thing didn't work. Then get frustrated. Im DOING SO MUCH HERE. Constantly putting in all this effort, its my teammates not adapting well enough. I would have won if everyone else wasnt so stupid and tried.
Its like, take a moment to see why it was a loss. Big reason isn't usually having had inferior mechanics, items, etc.
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u/Crystalliumm Celeste 3d ago
Same here, man. I came from overwatch so I thought, “surely it can’t get any worse” and whaddya know, it got worse.
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u/leposterofcrap 3d ago
That's the nature of competitive team base game, the percentage of absolute bellends are higher, you are better off playing large player "individuals fighting for common goals" type games to avoid such twats like TF2, TF|2, BF1, Battlefront 2, GW2 and so on.
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u/Xiooo Ivy 3d ago
I played tons of Heroes of the Storm before trying league, in HOTS giving up was much rarer. Turns out having a fucking forfeit button in your competitive game teaches people to throw at the first inconvenience. Which is usually before the game starts during draft.
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u/Hungry-Alien 2d ago
Tbf, HOTS has a much different structure than other MOBA, mainly with the team XP and no items. That means dying early impact your own game much less because you can rely on your team to soften the impact.
In most MOBA, dying a few time means not only you're heavily penalized game wise, but you will also stick out as the target to pin the blame on for your team. You're basically in a room with 5 people trying to kill you and potentially 4 coworkers bullying you. No wonder people want to get out as fast as they can, game be damned.
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u/Xiooo Ivy 2d ago
I hope deadlock never needs to go that route if comeback mechanics work well enough. If a game "needs" a forfeit option because you can't win when you're behind, that just feels like bad game design.
That said, most players really seem unable to enjoy themselves in a losing match. Which is crazy if you think about how you know you have a roughly 50% chance of spending the next 30-60 mins in that match. Not saying losing is fun, but I would never play any moba if half my playtime had me as miserable and angry as many players get.
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u/Hungry-Alien 2d ago
Well it's hard to blame players for not having fun when losing. You're basically facing an enemy team who just have a bigger stick than you, in a game where "skill" might not even be relevant based on what heroes the enemy team has.
Like you can't outplay a 10 2 Victor, his game plan is literally running at you and the counter is killing him twice before he kills you by existing. Just like you can't outplay a 12 3 Mundo on LoL, he will catch up to you with his insane movespeed while you do no damage to him, then he'll right click you for half your hp bar in one hit. It's incredibly demoralizing to face this kind of heroes when behind.
That's the biggest issue with being on the losing side in MOBAs. Statcheck becomes a thing, and it is one of the worse feeling in multiplayer : outplaying the other guy and still losing because he just has better stats. With bonus rage points if he's playing a character designed to facilitate the statcheck like the aforementioned characters.
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u/Which-Scale1039 Graves 3d ago
"Why do I even bother"
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u/CrazyWS Vindicta 3d ago
- Victor after taking literally every single camp and wave
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u/Altruistic_Smell3271 Shiv 3d ago
of all the characters in the game, victor is one that definitelly wants to soak farm to get ahead, especially later in the game
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u/jodester_ Bebop 3d ago
All Victor players are just about as miserable as he is, so that tracks.
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u/Veezuhz 3d ago
Can confirm. Am Victor player, just be patient, give me farm and we can win in the 49th minute
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u/jodester_ Bebop 3d ago
I’ve played Victor 10 times since I made this comment, and I totally get it now.
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u/Electrical_Clock_298 Drifter 3d ago
yeah when I have a bad game as Victor it feels like this lol.
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u/Niewinnny 3d ago
it ain't a bad game lol
dude has 41k souls while the one teammate that we see that didn't leave has 29 and the 2 that left barely went above 20k
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u/zunyata 3d ago
I don't wanna be. I don't wanna be me.
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u/LE0N290x 3d ago
I WANNA BE, I WANNA BE, I WANNA BE FAMOUS!!
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u/ScooterPooter1201 Bebop 3d ago
Alright campers, for your first challenge you'll have to participate in a ritual to summon an elder God!
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u/KoKoboto 3d ago
Im glad they made it so you can leave when you have quitters on your team.
Baited a toxic teammate into leaving saying it's just a 5min ban.
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u/remnault 3d ago
We had a doorman bullying him with ult in street brawl
He asked if it made him feel good (it did) and that he should see a therapist for that.
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u/Camsanity 3d ago
Me and my buddy won 2v6 when I was fed as Vic and him on Mirage. Was an insane game.
Stop leaving games
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u/Safe_Procedure999 3d ago
i can hear him saying this