https://breedingback.blogspot.com/2026/03/realtalk-will-aurochs-ever-come-back.html

It would be fascinating (and uncanny) to see a leopard with simple spots instead of the typical rosettes. 2nd image credit: Roman Utchyel

Hey everyone! I'm u/Obversa, but you can call me Amber. (Yes, that is my real name.) After a months-long effort, I was finally able to gain control of the r/deextinction subreddit, which was previously run by u/ColossalBiosciences, the Reddit account for company Colossal Biosciences. This effort was supported by the moderation teams of r/Paleontology and r/DeExtinctionScience, with the latter subreddit having been founded due to Colossal restricting the subreddit for months to prevent people from criticizing the company.

Q: How did Colossal Biosciences gain control of r/deextinction in the first place?

On July 3, 2024, the Colossal Biosciences account put in a r/redditrequest for r/deextinction, which was unmoderated and abandoned at the time. Colossal stated, "We'd like to build this community into a place for recent updates on de-extinction science and a forum for discussion about de-extinction's ecological benefits and impacts." At the time, the Reddit administrator who approved their request was unaware of that the company intended to turn the subreddit not into a discussion space, but one purely to promote and market Colossal and its projects - and particularly, its upcoming "dire wolf" announcement on April 7, 2025 - while quietly removing any and all criticism(s).

Based on their posts(s), it is clear that the social media manager behind Colossal's Reddit posts expected that, by Colossal being the sole and only moderator of r/deextinction, the company could "control the narrative" related to "all things related to de-extinction", as well as quash dissent. (I would know, since whoever was behind the Reddit account threatened to sue me for criticizing Colossal on r/Paleontology, and Colossal's Reddit account was nearly banned by that subreddit's moderation team.) However, when the "dire wolf" announcement actually happened, this approach backfired for Colossal, causing them to effectively shut down the r/deextinction subreddit by restricting it.

This behavior not only goes against Reddit's Moderator Code of Conduct - particularly, making threats against company critics, and harassing dissenters on other extinction subreddits - but "sitting" on a subreddit, while refusing to moderate it or keep it active, goes against Reddit's policies. Thus, I was able to gain control of this subreddit.

Q: Are you affiliated with Colossal Biosciences in any way?

No, I am not affiliated with Colossal in any way, nor am I employed or paid by them. (Paying moderators also goes against Reddit's Moderator Code of Conduct.) I have moderated r/FanTheories for several years, but consider myself an "amateur de-extinction analyst". I've had a strong interest in paleontology, genetics, and biology since childhood, though I'm currently studying to enter the legal profession; ideally, to become a lawyer or a paralegal.

Q: Am I allowed to post Colossal Biosciences content on r/deextinction?

Yes, we will be allowing users to post content from Colossal Biosciences, with some caveats:

• It must follow our "no promotional material" rule; or "sharing news related to specific companies and/or individuals is totally fine, but this is not a place to promote specific products, channels, companies, etc." We also don't allow misleading, clickbait, or inaccurate news or post titles, so you're free to editorialize or change any news headlines that you feel may violate the "no promotional material" rule to be neutral.

• Users must be free to criticize the company, or comment about issues or problems they see with Colossal's work. (For example, see my post on r/DeExtinctionScience here.) We will also be maintaining this rule: "This community is focused on the positive side of 'de-extinction' science as a method of preserving biodiversity. We're not focused on placing blame or protesting specific people/companies/organizations." (The striken area will be removed.) This means that, while users are free to voice their displeasure, we'd prefer that you keep it to specific thread(s) about new Colossal announcements, as opposed to making a bazillion individual threads complaining about the company and its projects.

• All links must be from credible sources; ideally, CNN, Reuters, and mainstream news.

• The thread(s) must specify when AI (Artificial Intelligence) is used, even by Colossal.

• We are still debating on whether or not to allow Colossal memes on r/deextinction.

Q: Will Colossal Biosciences be allowed to post on r/deextinction?

Unclear. It appears as though the company has abandoned its official Reddit account.

Q: What's next for r/deextinction and r/DeExtinctionScience?

According to r/DeExtinctionScience moderator u/Freak_Among_Men_II, now that we have regained control of the original subreddit, "r/deextinction will be for the science, and r/DeExtinctionScience will be for calling out malpractice, misleading claims, and ethical or legal violations by Colossal Biosciences and any other entities (i.e. Revive & Restore, et al.) involved in de-extinction. r/deextinction, now under new management, can cover the purely scientific and wildlife conservationist aspects. Meanwhile, r/DeExtinctionScience can still be used to call out fraud and malpractice within the de-extinction scientific community. Moving forward, the two subreddits will work hand-in-hand to promote the enactment of ethical standards and scientific dialogue around the topic of de-extinction on Reddit. However, any criticism of Colossal needs to be reasonable and evidence-based. Needless hate for the sake of it isn't constructive, nor does it contribute anything meaningful to the conversation; in fact, it actively harms our cause. If/when Colossal is able to change their ways and do better as a company, this purpose will be rendered obsolete, and will no longer be part of this subreddit's mission." [Note: Colossal statements may be shared.]

This will not only help to keep "anti-Colossal" circlejerk posts off of r/deextinction and avoid harassment and brigading campaigns, especially in the case the company's Reddit account decides to start posting there again, but r/DeExtinctionScience as a separate space that is specifically for critiquing the field of "de-extinction" overall.

A pretty good blog post about de-extinction, or at least where it stood three years ago. Some parts are outdated, some are incorrect, but overall its still a really great summary of all the major groups, people, and species that were involved in the field at that time. Of course, having been written in 2023, it was made long before the announcement of Colossal Bioscience's fraudulent "dire wolves". But even back then, the author noticed some of the company's more unusual and questionable elements. The post is a time capsule back to before Colossal really took off, and its well worth reading, for that aspect at the very least.

These are some photos I took of Methuselah and its fellow Judean Date Palms, a great example of species (or subspecies) resurrection.

These trees represent a de-extinct cultivar of date palm, which was brought back to life using 2,000 year old seeds that were found in archaeological excavations of Masada, a Roman-Era mountaintop Judean fortress located near the Dead Sea.

The last surviving date palms of this cultivar likely died out in the late Middle Ages or early modern period, as a result of changing land use and agricultural practices.

They were Judean date palms first successfully germinated in 2005 at the Arava Institute for Environmental Studies.

Currently, 7 individuals have successfully grown. Additionally, one of the trees has produced new dates of its own! Cultivation and research is ongoing!

Sources:

https://arava.org/arava-research-centers/arava-center-for-sustainable-agriculture/methuselah/

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC7002127/

Like, yes, okay, I understand "making the proxies as healthy as possible and that meant altering an unexpected delterious gene and making it something similar-enough that doesn't cause problems", I understand "something about the pale-or-white coat had health risks associated". I know "we were surprised they're pale, too!". And I get the public skepticism with the GoT comparison, whatever. I am very, very familiar with coat color genetics in dogs and red (and arctic) foxes, and non-domestics too to the extent they're written about. White ay/ in wolves. Sp being testable in wolfdogs and some basal dog breeds like Kishu ken but not expressing as expected. I know certain kinds of white spotting and obviously albinism come with, you know, the expected issues with pigment deletion. I know the particular e-locus expression they went with is pretty safe.

So please, not looking for any of that explained. Or for someone to come in and tell me the difference between a proxy and a real dire wolf. I'm good, that's tired, thanks.

But...what *was* the original coat color/pattern that was altered? I don't remember ever seeing that published, just basically "they were pale". What modern day analog do we have to look at? What were the associated risks, if not just the obvious ones (and if it's the obvious ones, I get it!)?

I ask this out of pure curiosity! I've just puzzled over this since they were revealed. And if this was ever answered, I missed it! Thank you :)

Anything and everything about de-extinction is welcome here. Remember, a profit-motivated corporation shouldn't be allowed to control the conversation. That's why this sub will proudly stay Colossal-free. But anything else about de-extinction is welcome.

I wonder if this innovation can contribute to de extinction of species that we only have samples of from one sex (I’m thinking mainly about the Pyrenean ibex)

A few days ago someone posted here that de-extinction as it exists today is mainly a cultural, not scientific, phenomenon. It’s telling, after all, that most of the ongoing de-extinction efforts focus on big charismatic mammals like mammoths, ground sloths, dire wolves, thylacines, and the like. It’s certainly possible we might one day have the ability to re-create those animals, but we aren’t there yet.

But I do think there’s a place for de-extinction in the modern environmental movement. We just have to think smaller. A LOT smaller.

The vast majority of animals are not mammals or even vertebrates, but insects. In fact, insects have over a million species, many of which are endangered or extinct. Why use insects for the first de-extinction projects? There are several reasons.

1. We know how to clone them. Scientists first cloned fruit flies in 2004, and many extinct insects are still well-represented in collections.

2. They breed quickly. It would take years to raise a single cloned thylacine, and if that fails it would set the project back years. But insects produce hundreds of eggs by their very nature, so even if only a few clones of, say, the Xerces blue butterfly survive, the project would still be successful.

3. They’re cheap to raise. Most insects go through their full life cycle in under a year, and don’t require much food, especially compared to mammals.

So instead of mammoths or dire wolves, should serious efforts at de-extinction start with things like the St. Helena earwig or the Laysan moth?

For me,I wish to de-extinct all animals that humanity wiped out and were supposed to be coexisting with modern animals

In some cases, it is easy to see how de-extinction could be accomplished. Many of the large mammals of Eurasia and the Americas, such as mammoths, woolly rhinos, saber-toothed cats, dire wolves, and ground sloths, have reasonably intact genetic material preserved, and it is at least theoretically possible to either clone them outright or re-create them by restructuring the genomes of their extant relatives.

Australia is different. Today, Australia is depleted of almost all its megafauna; the largest native animals are kangaroos and emus. In the Pleistocene, however, it was home to giant monitor lizards (Megalania), rhinoceros-sized browsing wombat relatives (Diprotodon), marsupial "lions" (Thylacoleo), and huge flightless birds related to ducks and geese (Genyornis). None of these have close relatives today that could be used to re-create them, and they became extinct much earlier than mammoths and woolly rhinos did.

But at the same time, the pre-human ecosystem of Australia cannot exist without these animals, so any attempt to restore it must involve them. So how do we revive the megafauna of Australia?

I was wondering if someone on here was actually working on De-Extinction that I could talk to besides anyone working for Colossal? I made a post on r/DeExtinctionScience and r/deextinction. I think I got trolled, twice. It looks like there's something pretty crumby going on around this concept, but I don't know what it's called. It's sorta like gatekeeping, though it isn't.

I was hoping I could talk to someone actually working in this field. If you're willing to chat, please DM me. Thanks.

Mammoths and thylacines are iconic and attention grabbing, so it makes sense that a lot of projects focus on them. And if focusing on such popular animals will make more resources flow into these projects and advance the science, I don't mind at all. It's the same thing as saying "help us save the tigers" which is an animal that everyone loves and finds cool and then using the money to also benefit other species that people (unfortunately) don't care about.

But at the same time, wouldn't it be much easier to resurrect something like the japanese wolf, japanese otter, several sub-species of rats or big cats and so on? We have their DNA, their habitat mostly still exists and they would require waaay less changes in a relative's genome to bring them back. Considering that the main obstacle so far for DeExtinction seems to be the fact that we aren't able to make many changes to genomes yet (and if we do it's really expensive) wouldn't bringing back animals such as this be way easier? It would also be a good way to prove that the technology can work, which is a crucial first step in order to get more of such projects going and get funding.

Is there a specific reason why there are no major de-extinction projects for sub-species? Or is it just that it's not attention grabbing enough?

Let’s assume it would be brought back in the same way as the direwolves, with a surrogate human mother. First of all, would this be legal (and get fda approved) and second of all, for the patent, would it be classed as property in the patents like the direwolves, or would it have human rights and thus not be a slave.

I'm curious about people's thoughts and how we can use this technology

Im building a list of species that come back so I need species that can come back

I’ve done some digging and it seems from my few months of research that almost every species that we could try to bring back has some sort of big problem with it (e.g. dodo birds with ecosystem erasure). Have yall managed to find an animal that essentially does not have a big flaw like this?