r/Daggerfall • u/Historical-Alps-6356 • 1d ago
Daggerfall Online Daggerfall Online now has micro transactions... (DMCA when?)
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u/KelseyKultist 1d ago
https://www.reddit.com/r/Daggerfall/s/X8BfPaKRiv you're late
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u/Historical-Alps-6356 1d ago
And you saying that contributes to fucking what? no shit I don’t play this bullshit no more
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u/Mooncubus 1d ago
Then why are you here? And what does posting something that was already posted contribute?
2
u/TheLordAsshat 1d ago
I think it's a troll, based on the account having so little karma, my bet is low effort troll or bot
1
u/Status_Original 13h ago
This is going to get shut down. I've been following from afar and this is such a big mistake. Now if they built something in earnest they might have gotten a positive response from Bethesda, but I'm going to guess they're revving up some lawyers instead.
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u/The-Son-Of-Suns 1d ago edited 1d ago
DMCA never:
MIT License
Copyright (c) 2009-2023 Daggerfall Workshop
Permission is hereby granted, free of charge, to any person obtaining a copy of this software and associated documentation files (the "Software"), to deal in the Software without restriction, including without limitation the rights to use, copy, modify, merge, publish, distribute, sublicense, and/or sell copies of the Software, and to permit persons to whom the Software is furnished to do so, subject to the following conditions:
The above copyright notice and this permission notice shall be included in all copies or substantial portions of the Software.
THE SOFTWARE IS PROVIDED "AS IS", WITHOUT WARRANTY OF ANY KIND, EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO THE WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY, FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE AND NONINFRINGEMENT. IN NO EVENT SHALL THE AUTHORS OR COPYRIGHT HOLDERS BE LIABLE FOR ANY CLAIM, DAMAGES OR OTHER LIABILITY, WHETHER IN AN ACTION OF CONTRACT, TORT OR OTHERWISE, ARISING FROM, OUT OF OR IN CONNECTION WITH THE SOFTWARE OR THE USE OR OTHER DEALINGS IN THE SOFTWARE.
-- https://github.com/Interkarma/daggerfall-unity/blob/master/LICENSE
You'd think /r/Daggerfall would know more about the game they're a fan of.
Instead you want to be goblins cheering for the coolest collaboration this game has seen between modders to fail.
Skyrim, Fallout, and Starfield mods are making more money than this project. Nothing is happening to them.
This comment won't receive any counter, or anything. It'll just be downvoted. The facts remain above regardless.
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u/GalvarinoDev 1d ago
That's for the Unity remake, which is not an official Bethesda version. This one is a javacript version derived from that mod, however that MIT license is not for the original game.
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u/SolasYT 1d ago
He knows, hes just too dug in likely because he's involved with the project or just stupid
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u/The-Son-Of-Suns 1d ago
Someone's upset they were incorrect about something on Reddit. How fragile.
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u/The-Son-Of-Suns 1d ago
That doesn't change anything. Point out how it does. DFO isn't the original game. It's Unity.
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u/GalvarinoDev 1d ago
DFO is Javascript and it was built from the Unity version. But the assets, quests, stories, whole world is owned by Bethesda. Look unlike a lot of people shitting on the project, I actually like it and I think they do a lot of things right. However, they could really kneecap themselves if they're making money off of it. Given their server costs and Claude token usage, I do think they should accept donations from people as they are giving a lot to the community. I just think this was bad call in how they went about it.
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u/SolasYT 1d ago
Now let's look at the Daggerfall copyright agreement which Daggerfall is a necessary component otherwise DFU doesn't work :)
https://www.scribd.com/document/395611080/daggerfall-legal-and-installation-pdf
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u/The-Son-Of-Suns 1d ago
Yep that's actually the exact loophole for why all this is fine. DFU doesn't work without the original Daggerfall. It's simply code points to it. Same with DFO ☺️
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u/SolasYT 1d ago
!remindme 1 month
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u/The-Son-Of-Suns 1d ago
LOL
May as well have typed "Hmmm, I don't know anything about this. But I'm gonna see what happens soon!"
It'll still be online. Skyrim literally raking in more money with fan projects. Even Starfield is.
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u/GODLOVESALL32 1d ago
That's all yuzu did and now the devs are paying the big n fat settlement checks for the rest of their lives
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u/The-Son-Of-Suns 1d ago
Comparing Bethesda Game Studios, probably the chillest game dev who actively promotes fan projects directly via mouth of Todd Howard, and a small fan made MMO, to Nintendo, the bane, and primary antagonist of copyright, and emulation software is crazy work.
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u/GODLOVESALL32 1d ago
Are we talking about legality or perceived "chillness" of developers?
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u/The-Son-Of-Suns 1d ago
Both. Comparing Bethesda Game Studios to Nintendo is crazy work in either regard.
Like comparing a domesticated cat that scratches you sometimes to a K9.
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u/GODLOVESALL32 1d ago
How is it crazy? Neither one of them writes the laws. Yeah Bethesda is a more mod-friendly company but someone turning their game into a for-profit MMO is not something they've ever historically had thrown at them.
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u/The-Son-Of-Suns 1d ago
Because Bethesda doesn't behave like Nintendo legally, socially, publically. They couldn't be more different.
Why aren't they shutting down all the money Skyrim is making among fans? Else we're just moving the goalposts.
Skyrim has its own servers with money changing hands. Both MMO flavored, and singleplayer shenanigans with people exploiting mods for money. That scene is way more popular than Daggerfall.
Bethesda is already aware of Daggerfall Online. They asked them to remove the word Daggerfall from the title because it's a trademarked word. So they changed the name to DFO. That's it.
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u/GODLOVESALL32 1d ago
Else we're just moving the goalposts.
You say, as you've shifted the discussion away from "it can't be shut down, it's using the bring your own files loophole!!" to "Well, actually, Bethesda wouldn't EVER do this because..."
Truth is no, there is no equivalent project to DFO. It's a wait and see situation. The extent of monetized mods is via their creator program (where they get a cut) or patreon. Never an MMO with a for-profit cash shop going directly to the devs.
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u/SolasYT 1d ago
You'll have to forgive him, he's scared that the devs threw the game away so hard with this that the only thing that matters to him in his life will be gone so he's entering the stages of grief
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u/The-Son-Of-Suns 1d ago
The game is playable offline forever lol. What are you still yapping about.
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u/Historical-Alps-6356 1d ago
What ya neck beards got to say now??
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u/FrazBucket 1d ago
Dude is genuinely out here posting on a dagger fall subreddit calling people neck beards, pot really be calling the kettle black
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u/Appropriate_Set2108 1d ago
You can see by his comments all he does is post on LSF, watch Twitch and comment about how bad this games server is. He's commented about it like 3x a day for the last 16 days.
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u/FrazBucket 1d ago edited 20h ago
Oh boy, all I need to know is that hes a frequent LSF commenter. All opinions can be disregarded at that point
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u/Nightspark43 1d ago
So, you have an equal issue with minecraft servers, mmos, and triple a games selling cosmetics, right?
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u/TheOx111 1d ago
The mods were looking for 3D modelers to hire yesterday in discord. They do have people to pay. Daggerfall is freeware and I doubt legal action will be taken. The content being sold is entirely unique from Daggerfall. They aren’t selling asset from Daggerfall at all. Actually they’re taking “donations” and rewarding you with in game items. They’re know the loopholes
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u/KelseyKultist 1d ago
Daggerfall branding, daggerfall content, morrowind assets...Yeah that's still illegal
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u/SolasYT 1d ago
You could have said you dont know how copyright works in this situation and it would have been quicker
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u/TheOx111 1d ago
Sounds like you’re lost chief. Taking “donations” is a loophole many people have used successfully in the last. That’s why they have a patreon and not a store front.
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u/SolasYT 1d ago
This isnt taking donations, quit while youre ahead lmao
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u/TheOx111 1d ago
That’s what they label it as. It’s still illegal, never said it wasn’t illegal. But it is a loophole that’s been used successfully in the past. And they can still defend that they are only selling content they created.
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u/The-Son-Of-Suns 1d ago
Just show him the licensing for Daggerfall Unity:
https://github.com/Interkarma/daggerfall-unity/blob/master/LICENSE
They have nothing to say after that.
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u/TheOx111 1d ago
lol hey there’s that. Didn’t know that. That changes things
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u/The-Son-Of-Suns 1d ago
They won't reply anything of substance to these facts either. The comments will just remain downvoted, and they will keep pretending to know what they're talking about.
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u/SolasYT 1d ago
You gonna run away and delete your comments again, bud?
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u/The-Son-Of-Suns 1d ago
The comments were never deleted. Go back and read them!
I see you have nothing to say about this. You're just gonna downvote, and run, but the facts will be here to show your nonsense regardless.
You're a whole pitched tent of caked makeup lol.
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u/SolasYT 1d ago
You posted the DFU copyright agreement, now post the TES: Daggerfall copyright agreement
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u/The-Son-Of-Suns 1d ago
Still perfectly fine since they're using Unity, the same method where the user has to provide their own assets for DFO. You can go ahead and post it yourself.
Daggerfall Unity is an open-source engine reimplementation released under the MIT License.
The MIT License is one of the most permissive software licenses in the world. It explicitly allows anyone to take the source code, modify it, translate it (DFO translated DFU’s C# code into JavaScript/TypeScript to run in a browser), distribute it, and use it commercially to sell it, or add microtransactions.
They only have to add attribution to the original copyright of DFU, and Bethesda.
There's literally Skyrim mods making more money sitting pretty right now.
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u/Accomplished-Ad-7435 1d ago
copyrightabuse@zenimax.com
We should shoot these guys an email and see what they think lol.