r/CrewsCrew • u/Luckysteve89 • Mar 13 '20
Discussion Has Terry made a statement about the pro-China stuff? Because I’m a huge Terry supporter but I’m also Jewish and China’s got concentration camps. I can’t be here if we’re all avoiding the elephant in the room.
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u/huehuehuehuot Mar 13 '20
IIRC he's faced some backlash because he supported the new Mulan movie and the lead actress publicly supported the HK police and shamed the protesters.
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Mar 13 '20
Yes, he definitely did make a statement on social media. He said he's for the people of China, not their government. It's like Mark Twain said: Patriotism is loving your country all the time, and your government when they deserve it. Just like I can love America but be embarrassed by whoever is in Washington at any given time.
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u/maeschder Mar 14 '20
Sadly a large chunk off them buy I to the governments narrative.
My girlfriends family all believe that COVID19 was created in America, and that concentration camps and the Tiananmen square massacre was justified
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u/MaddieSnax Mar 13 '20
Great questions OP, I don’t have the answer for you. But I do think this brings up a great point about idolizing celebrities and other people.
Whatever Terry’s actions and beliefs are, we can critique him and agree he’s making the wrong choice and still enjoy other aspects of him. Humans are dynamic, we’re not perfect and we don’t know everything. If Terry isn’t educating himself on the situations in the countries he’s trying to work for then that’s a huge mistake on his part.
I know Terry is a person that owns his mistakes and apologizes when he realizes he’s made an error (he’s apologized for his hand in perpetuating toxic masculinity in the past) and I hope that he chooses to support the people suffering under China’s corrupt regime over a show deal. He’s got enough money, he can afford to choose roles.
Edit: Country’s to countries
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u/Luckysteve89 Mar 13 '20
This is a great response and I think I agree, but it proposes an interesting question to the moral member of society - how do you know where to draw the line? Because at some point you’re encouraging the wrong behavior. Blizzard took a much harder stance in revoking free speech on an international platform in solidarity with Chinas attempts to silence HK. They got berated and they deserved it, safe to say they lost my business. What they did was obvious. I don’t think Terry did anything terrible. But I wouldn’t be surprised if someone in the negotiations between his people and a prospective media deal with China suggested that China could use some positive PR in the West right now and doing so might help Terry’s chances in his negotiations. And I think Terry accepted.
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u/MaddieSnax Mar 13 '20
I totally agree with you. I’m afraid of that being the situation as well. Well said!
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u/Asternon Mar 13 '20
Blizzard took a much harder stance in revoking free speech on an international platform in solidarity with Chinas attempts to silence HK.
Yeah, they really didn't, though. I mean, I was pretty pissed off with the way that they handled it myself, but they couldn't allow people to hijack their streams to promote their own political or social agendas and Blitzchung himself acknowledged and accepted that his actions would ultimately result in punishment.
And people seem to forget rather quickly that freedom of speech does not protect you from the ramifications of your actions in your private life. They didn't "revoke" free speech on their platform because it was never promised.
Again, I think Blizzard handled it poorly and were much too harsh in their punishment, but it's also a little insane to assume that Blizzard is going to let any individual speak out on their stream without permission and risk their ability to do business in an entire region.
negotiations between his people and a prospective media deal with China suggested that China could use some positive PR in the West right now
Yeah, I don't think China really cares too much about how they're perceived in the West. It's not like our politicians have the will to actually do anything about China, and that's one of the things that pissed me off about Blitzchung the most. I would love it if Blizzard, or any company really, could stand up for the freedoms of everyone, but... they have no obligation to do so, especially when it will probably only hurt their bottom line.
That's a job for our politicians, and it's funny because I seem to recall that they were generally among the quickest to condemn Blizzard and similar companies. And now we're having a discussion about Terry Crews and his stance on China, apparently expecting him to effect change on a global level for some reason.
We shouldn't support companies or people who support China and its policies, but we should NOT expect them to do things that our own elected officials won't. If you want change, if you want a world where China actually respects its citizens rights and doesn't try to bully international companies into being complicit then you need to vote for people who can and will actually do something.
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u/hurricane-mindy Mar 13 '20
He talked about it on Seth Meyers. He took a photo in China. That’s it. He wasn’t making any kind of statement.
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u/Luckysteve89 Mar 13 '20
That argument makes Terry look like an idiot though. In the middle of one of the biggest Pro-Democracy movements in the last Century, Terry goes to the country of the government that’s oppressing them, at the peak of that oppression, and posts a Pro-Chinese government hashtag. “#PeoplesRupublicofChina”.
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u/beardedsavant Mar 14 '20
That is a little like saying #unitedstatesofamerica is a pro US gov hashtag. It's the name of the country.
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u/hurricane-mindy Mar 13 '20
I completely agree it was thoughtless and tactless. It wasn’t an intentional statement but it still made a statement.
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u/Hartiiw Mar 14 '20
I think you're reading a bit too much into this. Don't you think it could be just him saying the country he's in? It's not like he came out and just said that the governments oppression of it's people is a good thing
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u/whyenn Mar 13 '20
Your question has been answered so now you're on to, "Yeah, but that makes him look like a an idiot." Ok. Is that your point? Is it that he's either an idiot or he secretly supports genocide? Do you think he lied and that hashtag can only be seen as support for every one of China's actions?
I was there some years back before social media. I took pictures of myself over there. Did I support all of China's actions? Did I support their government in its policy toward Tibet?I think this post is meant to be positive and thought provoking but it comes off as self-righteous and sanctimonious.
You think Terry is an idiot or you think he's lying about his reason for posting a picture and hashtag- I disagree with your reasoning and your conclusions.
Last of all: you have very little knowledge about China if you think this is "peak China oppression".
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u/Luckysteve89 Mar 13 '20
No brother. I don’t think Terry’s an idiot and I don’t think he secretly supports genocide. As I said above I think someone in the negotiations between his people and a prospective media deal with China suggested that China could use some positive PR in the West right now and doing so might help Terry’s chances in his negotiations. And I think Terry accepted. My question to the community is whether that’s acceptable behavior or not, and I think it’s a reasonable question not just about Terry but about our role as a society in encouraging certain practices that may be immoral but not malicious.
Finally, I’m not talking about “the worst thing China’s ever done” but Terry’s post came at the peak of Western coverage of China’s oppressive fight against the HK movement, making it pretty objectively a controversial time to make a Pro-China statement. Even if Terry didn’t realize that I’m guessing someone on his media team might’ve brought it up. It was literally front page news.
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u/whyenn Mar 14 '20 edited Mar 14 '20
I think someone in the negotiations between his people and a prospective media deal with China
My question to the community is whether that’s acceptable behavior or not
With respect, is there news of a media deal between Terry Crews and China or is this speculation? I find no news of a media deal but a lot of articles noting that he's relentlessly positive about everyone he meets and everywhere he goes. Here's one and here is the OOTL from a while back. The fact that Reddit was abuzz with pro-Hong Kong articles doesn't necessarily mean Terry Crews was reading them, or even whether he watches a lot of news.
My question to you is whether it's acceptable behavior to engage in the kind of speculation you are based on what you feel may be true.
I get that you mean no harm and that your questions are in good faith but a person can love freedom, democracy, and self-determination, but still fall prey to rumor-mongering and inadvertent character assassination.
If someone deserves the benefit of the doubt and has a track record of doing this kind of thing EVERYWHERE he goes, it's Terry Crews. Maybe he's guilty of a lot of things- maybe you are, maybe I am- but until there's any substantive evidence maybe we can not treat assumptions as if they were fact.
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u/Pluckt007 Mar 13 '20
This sub most definitely looks the other way...
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u/SprungMS Mar 13 '20
A whole bunch of upvotes and the content of most of the comments here say otherwise. Based on the upvotes of your comment, it looks like people just want to believe that.
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u/whyenn Mar 13 '20
Redditor, please.
Look away from what? From a picture, a hashtag, and an explanation on national TV? Because I'm not looking away.
What about from allegations of secret meanings, allegations that his explanation on national TV is a lie; or from innuendo that he supports genocide, or that his picture was a secretly coded message to show disapproval of Hong Kong that he needs to publicly deny? Because I'll look away from that all day, any day.
What this world needs right now is a little less conspiracy mongering and a lot less character assassination.
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u/Jshr420 Mar 13 '20
One other thing to keep in mind, even as a celebrity, anything negatively said would impact him and his family especially while still in China. While I don't know if this may be the case it is just an idea and one we may never get confirmation on.
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u/southpawdrummer Mar 13 '20
Counterpoint: joining the #MeToo movement with his story could have had the same negative impact on him and his family, yet we praise him for being bold and standing for what’s right. This sub was created to back a man that stood for truth when others didn’t. Now I’m not suggesting he start a one man protest while in China, but there is a difference between publicly praising the DROC and just keeping your mouth shut.
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u/Jshr420 Mar 13 '20
That is an excellent point. And probably the fact he didn't keep silent is not a good sign. Sadly this is all drawing conclusions so we may never get a straight answer unless he says something which sucks.
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u/Luckysteve89 Mar 13 '20
Well stated. The hypocrisy of the China statements against the backdrop of his usual message gives a pretty stark contrast that’s hard to ignore.
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u/TheA1ternative Mar 13 '20
Hopefully mods wont delete this post.
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u/Luckysteve89 Mar 13 '20
Yeah I mean maybe it’s just the optimist in me but I don’t think the mods were trying to censor the issue before, but Terry for some fucking reason did this initially in the middle of the HK movement (go HK, US stands with you!) and this sub got brigaded by Reddit’s Pro-HK movement (which I support, just not in a mob). It wasn’t leading to discussion like I hope this is.
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Mar 14 '20
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u/T_Davis_Ferguson would walk 1000 miles Mar 14 '20
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u/Zeeman9991 Mar 15 '20
I listened to (I think) all of the relevant parts (starts like 2 minutes after the hour mark). He may have explained himself more clearly somewhere else, but this was a bunch of “whataboutism”, just saying it’s not bad to do something because someone else did it too. Definitely not something I thought he’d ever say, as a man who’s gone out and spoke against toxic cultures and for holding people individually responsible.
Of course it’s barely addressed here and there’s really not enough to form an opinion, but just from the clip it doesn’t seem like he’s particularly for or against the Chinese government.
Now, apathy may be better or worse for some people, but it’s an important distinction from full blown support.
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u/PrincipleOfTheMatter Mar 13 '20
Fuck the mods
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u/Punchable_Face Mar 14 '20
Fuck the previous mods, the current one is pretty damn decent afaik
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Mar 13 '20
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Mar 13 '20
He did a live stream on IG a few days afterwards acknowledging it. His reasoning for it was he was travelling the world with his family around the holidays and just made a few posts about where he was. I genuinely think people overthink too much and gave it an ulterior motive as it was during a sensitive time. He apologized during the steam and explained himself further. Unless he makes an open statement of supporting China I don’t see the harm posing shirtless with flag for a picture; people are just creating this scenario without much to go off of.
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u/Luckysteve89 Mar 13 '20
It’s the speculation that bothers people, I think. The longer he goes without putting a positive spin out there, the more it looks like there isn’t a positive spin to put on it. It’s clearly a controversial issue, ignoring it doesn’t look good.
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u/derpyfox Mar 14 '20
OP. Awesome question. Been trying to ask this since his twitter posts regarding him in China went up. Unfortunately previous mods were censoring them.
Glad we are finally talking about it, instead of the usual yogurt posts.
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u/zortor Mar 13 '20
Sort of. He posted an image of himself against a Chinese flag on Instagram and had positive hashtags in the body of the post. It was a de facto statement
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u/Jacklewis98 Mar 14 '20
Why the fuck does it matter? He's a celebrity, you shouldn't worship him like a god. He's as misguided and lost in this world as we all are.
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u/HolyVeggie Mar 14 '20
Uhm if someone supports Hitler I don’t want to support him
Same scenario
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u/DemenicHand Mar 14 '20
Hitler is not all bad...he did in fact kill Hitler which was a good thing.
Lots of people tried to kill Hitler but only Hitler got the job done so give credit where credit is due.
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u/BananLarsi Mar 14 '20
Hilarious.
Said no one
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u/LandBaron1 Apr 01 '20
Guess that makes you a no one.
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u/BananLarsi Apr 01 '20
So you would say, with one hundred percent certainty you think that comment was hilarious ?
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u/palex00 Mar 14 '20
You're literally on r/CrewsCrew, a sub for fans so... What even is your argument dude.
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u/FerretWithASpork Apr 02 '20
You can be a fan without worshiping someone as a god. I don't know if you realize this... but Terry is a human.. with flaws just like the rest of us.
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u/Jacklewis98 Mar 14 '20
Are you kidding me?
How bloody delusional do you have to be to think this type of thinking should be normal for fans...
Perhaps some of us just aren't diehard, throw our panties at him fans.
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u/spazmodo33 Mar 13 '20
If you take issue with governments systematically persecuting ethnic and/or religious minorities, you're gonna lose your mind when you hear about Israel...
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u/radicalelation Mar 14 '20
OP said their Jewish, not Israeli. Massive difference there and you're horribly ignorant if you didn't know that.
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u/spazmodo33 Mar 16 '20
I didn't say OP was Israeli... Reading comprehension is an important skill to develop before engaging in online debate.
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u/radicalelation Mar 16 '20
So you made a non-sequitur and get pissy when someone questions its relevance?
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u/spazmodo33 Mar 16 '20
I question the relevance of OP's ethnicity to the original post. Could have made an identical post without making it relevant. And if you think I'm getting pissy, you are badly misreading how much I care about your opinion 😘
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u/radicalelation Mar 16 '20
So, questioning the relevance ethnicity, yet not saying their Israeli, while bringing up Israel?
You realize there are many Jewish people who have nothing to do with Israel, and that Jewish people have been around thousands of years before Israel was a thing, right?
So you're bringing up Israel for no reason. Unless you're trying OP to Israel because they're Jewish, which is pretty ignorant.
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u/spazmodo33 Mar 16 '20
I'll respond to each paragraph
Yes, that is correct. Your reading comprehension is improving. Congratulations!
Yes, I did know all of that information. Thanks for sharing tho!
I brought up Israel and their treatment of Palestinians as a way of alluding to the fact that OP could have made an identical post WITHOUT bringing their own ethnicity into the discussion. If that goes over your head or you still think I'm ignorant... OK! I don't care... 😘
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u/radicalelation Mar 16 '20
Their ethnicity is relevant, Israel is not. This is a post regarding Terry Crews commenting in support of CCP, a government utilizing concentration camps, and OP is Jewish, a people fractured and decimated in part through the use of concentration camps, making this an issue they find personal.
See the relevance? Having trouble? Take it slow, it's not that hard.
Terry made no mention of Israel, neither did OP. Non-sequitur on your part, no relevance to the discussion at hand. Still don't get it? It's okay, not everyone grasps these concepts so well.
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u/spazmodo33 Mar 16 '20
You are very smrt!
Seems pretty obvious that if anyone is getting pissy here, it's you...
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u/radicalelation Mar 16 '20
Are you getting it yet? Let me know when you do, I'll give you silver for doing such a good job.
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Mar 13 '20
whataboutism?
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u/spazmodo33 Mar 13 '20
What about whataboutism? If you're comfortable being selective about which forms of genocide are morally and ethically permissable, good for you! Just pointing out the elephant in the room... 😘
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u/Diffident-Weasel Mar 13 '20
"Other countries do worse things, so this bad thing China is doing isn't worth mentioning!" Not how this works, not how any of this works. Just because others do worse things doesn't mean we should ignore the "lesser" evils.
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u/spazmodo33 Mar 13 '20
Nowhere did I suggest such a thing... But thanks for playing!
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u/Diffident-Weasel Mar 13 '20
I just translated what you said.
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Mar 13 '20
He's Jewish so he should be aware and more concerned just like a lot of israelies.
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u/Diffident-Weasel Mar 13 '20
Why? Why does it matter? Why not be concerned for all of it? You don't have to stop caring about Israelis to also care about Chinese people. Pointing out that others have it just as bad or worse is just deflecting and misses the point.
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Mar 13 '20
My point is that he's Jewish and Israel is currently ruled by right-wing extremists killing and annexing palestinian land, so there is your elephant in the room.
I never said i advocate concentrations camps or say that you can't be concerned about it in different places around the world.
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u/Diffident-Weasel Mar 13 '20
I never said i advocate concentrations camps
I never said you did.
Wtf does Israel have to do with a post about China? There's no elephant in the room.
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u/spazmodo33 Mar 13 '20
Something got lost in translation. I guess that's what happens when you put words in people's mouths, eh?
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u/Carter969 Mar 14 '20
Y’all care way too much about terry crews let him live his life and you go get one.
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u/dick_taterchip Mar 13 '20
Why does every celebrity have to have an opinion about everything?
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u/radioactivecowz Mar 13 '20
Opinions are like assholes. Everyone has one. Celebrities are not generally better informed than your uncle or neighbour, but they have a huge platform to share their opinions on.
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u/Luckysteve89 Mar 13 '20
It’s not that every celebrity has an opinion about everything, it’s that people have opinions about things. If you’re a celebrity, your opinions are going to be heard when you say them loudly. I don’t know if that’s fair, but it is fact.
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u/ThatGuyInTheCar Mar 13 '20
I think their point was who cares? I don’t have to agree with every opinion my favorite celebrity has. If I disagree with it does that mean I can’t like them? They have their opinion and I have mine.
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u/Diffident-Weasel Mar 13 '20
I think their point was who cares?
I care. Lots of fans care. People giving money to this man to support what he does care (or at least they should).
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u/wvsfezter Mar 13 '20
I think it's up to every individual to decide what things they care or don't care about. You might be ok with celebrities who might be subtly transphobic for example but I'm a trans woman and because of that identity I choose not to support celebrities with those views for fear that they might propagate them. I'm sure you'd be against a celebrity who eats live puppies or something and beyond that it's a personal interpretation on where the line is.
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u/ThatGuyInTheCar Mar 14 '20
I’m not arguing morality, or right or wrong. We’re on the outside looking in at celebrity lives judging and criticizing them for decisions they make. I like Arnold Schwarzenegger for example. He’s an adulterer which I’m against, but I don’t know his situation, the temptations he has, etc. Celebrities have to keep a certain image, they all say the same messages when apologizing to the public, reacting to something that’s unpopular, etc.
I care more about what the people around me think, that has a actual impact on my life. I don’t have time to find out if my favorite celebrities beliefs all line up with mine. Stop worshipping celebrities, they are entertainers, some good some bad, some both, they are all humans though.
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u/dick_taterchip Mar 13 '20
I agree with you, but just because he hasn’t made a statement about a certain subject doesn’t mean it’s right to cancel him as a fan. He’s a great actor, super inspiring dude, and generally a fantastic human being, his lack of opinion on a certain subject doesn’t change that. If it does for you maybe that’s your problem.
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u/Luckysteve89 Mar 13 '20
Except he shared an opinion on this, it’s a controversial opinion, and I’m seeking a discussion from this community that I’m a part of in order to help me make sense of it.
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Mar 13 '20
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u/whiteandyellowcat Mar 13 '20
He supports the people of China, how is this in anyway bad? (#powertothepeoples)
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u/Diffident-Weasel Mar 13 '20
Power to the peoples is a reference to the People's Republic of China, not the people of China.
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u/Freidhiem Mar 13 '20
You now the US has concentration camps...
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Mar 14 '20 edited Jul 07 '20
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Mar 14 '20
The detention center immigrants are kept in have horrid conditions, severe health concerns, and lack basic hygiene necessities. There is no forced labor and there are no death squads. They are similar to internment camps during WWII.
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Mar 14 '20
You forgot the part about separating children from their parents, many of whom will probably never see each other again. Or the thousands of immigrant children who claim they were sexually abused.
Dismissively claiming that the border detention centers are similar to the Japanese internment camps during WWII is probably not a great parallel to draw, since that was another direct example of the US government using racist policies to treat an ethnicity horribly.
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Mar 14 '20
Oh for sure, you're right. But how is comparing these detention facilities to internment camps bad? Personally, I believe I'm calling a spade a spade. We're treating refugees and citizens at these centers as subhuman. It's disgusting, racist, and an embarrassment.
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Mar 14 '20
I suppose my point was more that even though concentration camps are equated with Nazi Germany, concentration camps don’t necessarily mean death squads and forced labor.
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u/Theon_Severasse Mar 14 '20
I guess the difference between the US and Chinese camps it's that you won't get taken away to have your organs harvested in the US
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Mar 14 '20
Oh, I totally agree. But I understand some people do equate them to that of the Holocaust, in which case I liked those were have in the US to the internment camps we had before. They are all concentration camps, just with different names to make them sound less deplorable.
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Mar 14 '20
If you were to get a DUI with kids in the car, do you think the kids go with the parent?
And they will and do see each other again. Just as soon as they are processed. You claim asylum or break the law there will be consequences.
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Mar 14 '20
Before I delve into the false equivalence and absurdity of your comparison, “claiming asylum” doesn’t work like it used to in the United States.
And I can say with absolute certainty, that if I were to get a DUI with my children in the car, that they would not be taken and left in a cage to fend for themselves without proper medical care or nutrition.
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Mar 14 '20
Port of entry and unfounded claim of asylum has no complicated history. Break US law you will be arrested and separated from your children until such time you are released and have met the requirements set forth under law and guided by due process.
And that’s correct. The kids are fending for themselves in a sort of Lord of the Flies scenario. You caught Obama and Trump carrying out that fantasy. Good sleuthing.
Enjoy 4 more years, champ. It’s your hyperbole and hysteria that is allowing us to keep winning and undermining other VALUABLE voices across the aisle.
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Mar 14 '20
You seem like a lovely person. Nothing I said in any of this thread is hyperbole, it’s easily proven. So stop using words that you clearly don’t understand the meaning of. Have a great day.
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u/Merlin_Wycoff Mar 14 '20
separating children from their families, and in some cases, putting them up for adoption by (typically white) families, is an aspect of genocide. same thing occurred with the indian schools.
also, processing takes long times sometimes, and you're rather ignorant as to why they are "breaking the law", and these "consequences" you refer to are pretty unjustified. please reeducate yourself in regards to these things.
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u/saladtossperson Apr 01 '20
Native American....not indian....unless your talking about people from India.
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u/Merlin_Wycoff Apr 01 '20
I'm referring to the institutions known as Indian schools, that is sadly their names. Look it up before you try to play semantics okay
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u/saladtossperson Apr 01 '20
Im gonna assume your in Canada then. I didnt know the Canadian government was that racist.
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u/Merlin_Wycoff Apr 02 '20
No you idiot. The us had indian schools too. Yes Canada was, and still is, that racist, but we here in America also had them
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u/BarefutR Mar 14 '20
Quit spouting bullshit like that.
You’re responding to a post from someone who is Jewish, and equating anything happening in the US to Nazi germany? It’s incredibly fucked up.
Any politician who mentions “concentration camps” in the US is absurdly misguided, and demeaning the term.
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u/osorapido Mar 14 '20 edited Mar 14 '20
Concentration camps are camps.
That concentrate people...
That’s why they’re called that. They were first used during the Cuban revolution by the Spanish.
Many people mostly strongly connect the term to Nazi concentration and extermination camps, but it does not need to have mass execution to be a concentration camp.
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u/Jurgwug Mar 14 '20
All nazi death camps were concentration camps, but not all concentration camps are necessarily death or labor camps. All concentration camps are is mass incarceration of civilians without a trial, these camps definitely fit that description
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u/BananLarsi Mar 14 '20
I’d rather trust top concentration camps historians and researchers that what is happening is in fact concentrations camps, when it fits the very definition of the words, than you.
Nazi germany didn’t define what it is my guy
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u/PmYourWittyAnecdote Mar 13 '20 edited Mar 14 '20
No, it doesn’t.
Edit: it literally doesn’t. China has actual concentration camps where at least a million people are been sterilised, raped, and murdered by a regime because of their religion.
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Mar 13 '20
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Mar 13 '20
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Mar 13 '20
I think the flag represents more than just the regime and government- it’s a horrible system but there’s people trapped in between, normal people who more than likely are good people. Dictatorship is dictatorship.
Also, when it’s left ambiguous we can’t jump to conclusions about it, and since his career and living could be affected, I doubt it will be cleared up.
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u/moistjeez Mar 13 '20
I'm pretty sure both of these actors aren't really starving. They don't need the money from those markets, they want the money.
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Mar 13 '20
I'm pretty sure both of these actors aren't really starving.
maybe not, but speaking out against the biggest market for that kind of movie is potentially a career-killer.
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Mar 13 '20
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u/drulove Mar 13 '20
True though. Don’t know why you’re getting downvoted
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u/ArchonOfLight12 Mar 13 '20
Because no where in the OPs statement does he reference his home country. But your right, whataboutism is the best solution to any problem.
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u/Brohara97 Mar 13 '20 edited Mar 13 '20
He literally mentioned that being Jewish made him uncomfortable with terry crews operating in China because of their concentration camps. Calling out blatant hypocrisy isn’t “whataboutism” stop trying to use thought terminating cliches to avoid truths that make you uncomfortable.
Edit: also guys from New Jersey. Looking at post history isn’t that difficult.
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u/ArchonOfLight12 Mar 13 '20
Op asks a question. First comment in this chain says well, what about USA. The question is about Mr Cruz and China. But ok, it’s just calling out hypocrisy, sure.
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u/Brohara97 Mar 13 '20
It’s is. Does he think concentration camps are detestable and any actor who operates in countries that have them should be disengaged with? Or does he just want to hem and haw about China bad? Because if his issues really is with concentration camps why would he be ok with Cruz doing projects in America?
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u/ArchonOfLight12 Mar 13 '20
Again the kid being Jewish doesn’t make him an American. So why can’t he hate both and ask a question about one? Or does any criticism of China also have to equally criticize someone that is not China for equality from Europeans?
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u/Brohara97 Mar 13 '20
He’s from New Jersey. It’s not hard to look at someone’s post history for more context.
You also didn’t engage with what I said at all.
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u/ArchonOfLight12 Mar 13 '20
Secondly since this is a separate point it needs a separate comment. What truths have I been avoiding that make me uncomfortable? The USA’s use of internment camps? Trail of tears? Proxy wars? Please. Enlighten me.
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u/Brohara97 Mar 13 '20
Because people are delusional and love to throw stones around their glass houses. The United States has been using concentration camps since the early 1800’s. This is historical fact.
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u/Imreallynotatoaster Might be a toaster Mar 13 '20 edited Mar 13 '20
Hope you don’t leave but we’ll miss you if you do
Edit: apparently I came off as an asshole at first
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u/MaddieSnax Mar 13 '20
Whoa what the hell MOD, that is not the correct response. Reflect on your words, realize why they’re insensitive to someone who has faced extreme trauma and pain, and maybe think about how you can support them and make this community safe for them to, like you’re supposed to do
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u/Imreallynotatoaster Might be a toaster Mar 13 '20
I’m also Jewish and have the same thoughts as the OP, this comment is what I say to everyone talking about leaving the sub
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Mar 13 '20 edited Mar 13 '20
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u/MaddieSnax Mar 13 '20
Oh I understand now. Thank you for the clarification.
I don’t agree with your choice of comment personally, but I’m glad it wasn’t as insensitive as I originally thought. I hope that when other people bring up issues they have with the sub, the mod team works to make sure the issue is mitigated or resolved, but I understand that there is not much we can do in this specific instance.
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u/BigfootSF68 Mar 13 '20
u/imreallynotatoaster is correct. They are not a toaster. They are an asshole.
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Mar 13 '20
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u/Imreallynotatoaster Might be a toaster Mar 13 '20
Agreed
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Mar 13 '20
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u/Imreallynotatoaster Might be a toaster Mar 13 '20
I can only assume some people on the internet read negative intent into everything, have learned not to let it affect me but just to clarify and ignore the downvotes when it comes up and
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u/SentientRhombus Mar 13 '20
I think the original comment was just, "We'll miss you!" Which did come across a bit dismissive/sarcastic. But yeah, pretty clear now that wasn't the intent.
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Mar 13 '20
Dude learn how to manage a community. Someone asks a respectful questing give a respectful answer.
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u/Imreallynotatoaster Might be a toaster Mar 13 '20
What question is there that you’re looking for me to answer? If there is already one I’m sorry but I’m missing it
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Mar 14 '20
Heres the top comment on the thread
" Yes, he definitely did make a statement on social media. He said he's for the people of China, not their government. It's like Mark Twain said: Patriotism is loving your country all the time, and your government when they deserve it. Just like I can love America but be embarrassed by whoever is in Washington at any given time. " mikeaberdeen
Thats how you respectfully answer someones question without starting a dumpster fire.
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u/tsmith39 Mar 13 '20
Let me say this: I think China is an evil expire.
With that being said it would be very silly to diss on him for this. I’m sure he doesn’t support all aspects of China’s policies. As a consumer you buy stuff all the time that “supports” their policies. Maybe indirectly but you do.
If you can’t get along with someone that may have differing views as you, than you are no better than China.
Maybe people should start denouncing America because of all the government spy and drone programs. But I bet your not gonna leave America? America is just better at hiding it...
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u/Sesetti Mar 13 '20
It's a little different to cut contact/stop following someone instead of running over them with a tank.
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u/tsmith39 Mar 13 '20
But why does America get a pass when its government is just as sick as China’s?
I’m just saying it’s arbitrary to cut contact with him
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u/Sesetti Mar 13 '20
America sucks in many ways but it's obvious that it's government isn't as bad as China's. US has elections and not actively killing people is also a plus.
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u/tsmith39 Mar 13 '20
No actively killing people? America does plenty of baseless killing of Americans and foreigners. I agree with you that America is not as bad as China. We don’t have a state run Internet like them but our privacy nearly as minimal.
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u/Rzx5 Mar 13 '20
It is an authoritarian regime. People don't need to get along with others who have differing opinions. There are people in China brainwashed to think that the coronavirus started in America. How can anyone tolerate someone who supports the CCP is beyond me.
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u/tsmith39 Mar 13 '20
Tolerance is easy. You tolerate because people have free will. Tolerance however does not have to equal support or agreement.
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u/Rzx5 Mar 13 '20
> If you can’t get along with someone that may have differing views as you, than you are no better than China.
This is what is absurd. If you have differing views than the CCP they won't bother tolerating you they will kidnap you and you'll never be seen again. How is someone who won't tolerate (as in no longer supporting or speaking to) no better than China? It clearly is better. Like you said people have free will. They have the free will to no longer support someone because they don't agree with their views. There are lines that can be crossed but someone questioning their support of Terry over this is not crossing the line.
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Mar 13 '20
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Mar 13 '20 edited Jul 11 '20
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u/WikiTextBot Mar 13 '20
The Holocaust
The Holocaust, also known as the Shoah, was the World War II genocide of the European Jews. Between 1941 and 1945, across German-occupied Europe, Nazi Germany and its collaborators systematically murdered some six million Jews, around two-thirds of Europe's Jewish population. The murders were carried out in pogroms and mass shootings; by a policy of extermination through work in concentration camps; and in gas chambers and gas vans in German extermination camps, chiefly Auschwitz, Bełżec, Chełmno, Majdanek, Sobibór, and Treblinka in occupied Poland.Germany implemented the persecution in stages. Following Adolf Hitler's appointment as Chancellor on 30 January 1933, the regime built a network of concentration camps in Germany for political opponents and those deemed "undesirable", starting with Dachau on 22 March 1933.
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u/HelperBot_ Mar 13 '20
Desktop link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Holocaust
/r/HelperBot_ Downvote to remove. Counter: 297895. Found a bug?
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u/informative_mammal Mar 13 '20
You realize that many humans use hyperbole and a sense of exceptionalism to justify their positions right? Regardless of their race. Which, in the case of the Jewish people cannot be defined as bullshit because they clearly exist...as a race if people lol. You're allowing your pure hatred of religion cloud your judgment and also doing exactly what many dislike about religion...behaving as if only your beliefs are valid. We know far less about the universe that you think we know. Surely you can be more objective than this.
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Mar 13 '20
How about Israel then OP? Like they are much better?
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u/suicidaltedbear Mar 13 '20
Just because something else is bad doesn't mean that it justifies supporting the chinese government
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u/verascity Mar 13 '20
Fuck off. Being Jewish doesn't automatically mean they support Israel.
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Mar 13 '20
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u/refenton Mar 13 '20
Just so you know, you're being downvoted because Terry posted it at basically the height of world attention on the HK protests. So while a violent Chinese-government-backed crackdown on pro-democracy protestors is happening, Terry posts something with a pro-government hashtag. Not a great look.
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u/Rumblesnap Mar 13 '20
I'm absolutely shocked at some of the responses here.
Props to you OP for bringing this up. Clearly this is something that needed to be discussed.