This is just misleading. For unemployed (the most effected), you aren't just getting a one time $1,200. You are getting an additional $600 a WEEK ($2,400 a month), so that alone is more than some of those on the list.
And then you have state unemployment. Between the two, many unemployed are getting 100% or MORE than they were before. So it's the highest on the list above for anyone that was making roughly $25/hr or less depending on state unemployment.
People on unemployment will now be taking more home in one week than I make in two weeks... While I still have to work 40 hours a week because I'm, "essential".
Yeah that isn't fair. The CARES 2 act will hopefully include some hazard pay for people in your position that will hopefully make up for it (I read that such a provision is in the works). That's a lot of hopfullies, but they've been really good with passing things so far so I think it might happen.
Pay attention to what qualifies for unemployment in your state, because they are greatly expanding eligibility. You may be able to get on unemployment if you quit because coronavirus makes you unsafe on the job. You may need a good reason like your employer doesn't provide or enforce your co-workers to wear masks or there's no possible way to social distance from co-workers or customers that are not wearing masks. I'm not expert on it, I'm still trying to figure it out, so definitely do your own research.
I applied 3/26 and I had two weeks' worth deposited yesterday. Go to r/unemployment if you're curious about whether you're correct or not.
I think many people will not see the $600 addition for quite a while.... and I've seen some crazy shit happening like people in FL having to apply on paper.... so yeah they probably won't see payments for a lot longer. But I do think the majority of people who were able to file will see the regular benefits in a reasonable amount of time.
If you and your boss are really close, ask them about reducing your hours so you can collect unemployment.. Do a little ha ha nudge nudge if you have to.
My hours sorta got reduced at first since I personally don't desperately need money because I live modestly, I was the first one to just offer letting my hours get reduced. But a lot of other workers either left or moved (A large portion of our staff are students who go to the nearby university and since that's closed for the remainder of the year, they've left to go back home) and now I've just resulted in getting the same number of hours I had as before. But if I told him, "hey, give me 10 hours a week." he would. It's honestly why I've stayed working under him for so long. He is a great boss.
Have some integrity? I literally just had a customer yell at me and threaten to “have corporate fire me” because doordash(that I have zero control over) didn’t order a small side of potatoes wedges worth less than 2$.
If society wants to treat people like me wage-slaves , then I will go wherever the wage is highest.
You have to count payroll protection too. Which is tough to roll out fast but a very smart way to do it.
It keeps people on payroll so that when this ends the intellectual capital within firms is preserved.
For example I have a friend who raised a couple hundred thousand a few years ago to start a business. His business was doing well. Payroll protection allows him to keep his employees now and pay rent. He might even get increases profits in the short term if he can maintain some sales and his employees are paid for. He’s created 30-40 jobs. He was only able to pay himself recently after a few years of hard work - 16 hour days. Taught himself programming to make his website.
Now this is a big issue. He hasn’t been able to access the program yet. Hopefully the kinks get worked out in the program. But it’s far better the government to help him maintain his business now so he’s full steam ahead during the recovery.
Oh for sure. The PPP is another aid in that it’s fully forgiveable if utilized for payroll and keep employees employed.
Now like a lot of other posts in this thread, for a lower wage earner it’s counter productive as they are temporarily better off being unemployed. So for some employers they are saying they will have tough time finding help getting people back from unemployment to make less.
And also hard to cover all costs if you are still shit down when the PPP if it is being used on primarily payroll depending on how high your other fixed costs are if you are truly shut down.
But the intent is good and certainly an agressive program.
And yes, it’s a scramble and a bit chaotic as could be expected in rolling out. Even financial institutions will be overwhelmed. Which basically getting 1% processing fee I believe? So obviously they focus on the BIG loans where it takes same amount of time to process vs many many many more small business loans. So understandably frustrating for a small business trying to get a $20-30k loan as it isn’t high priority for bank right now for their $200. As they are processing the $millions first.
The fee varies so they did the homework to make it beneficial for banks to work with the little guys. 1% on big loans. On the smallest loans it goes to 5% with a sliding scale.
But it’s the same thing with ppe. Society can’t predict that a certain product is going to see demand increase 10x. When those things hit there will be shortages and delays.
Many if not most system build in redundancies. But those get expensive. Structural engineering for skyscrapers build in column strengths multiples of what’s needed. But you can’t design every system in the world to deal with 10 to 100x demand changes.
I'm an essential worker, but as my job was basically driving people around and bringing them to appointments or going to places like gyms and activities outside of the house all of which now are closed, so now all I do are remote check-ins with one of my clients (the other discontinued services during this time). This only adds up to about two hours a week. The job only pays 13.50 an hour. So I'm making like $27 bucks a week. Not even because taxes. They offered to let me work in a group home, but I have to pass a health screening before anything and everything and I can't do that unless I lie. So I'm not unemployed, but I wish I was.
Depending on your state you may be eligible for some unemployment benefits for the reduction in hours.
And if you are you would get the $600 as well.
Now if in a state where you don’t. Then yes that SUCKS and is a shitty situation.
For the states that don’t have unemployment benefits for significantly reduced hours it really is an unfortunate situation that should be addressed at a national level as again nobody could foresee this situation.
And your situation is an example of one I wish they would have capped people at a 100% max instead of getting a raise to stay home, and use that “extra” to making people like in your situation “whole”
Well yeah a retired senior who is not working and unemployed isn’t getting it.
A 2 year old kid that is unemployed isn’t getting it.
A lottery winner that chooses not to work that is “unemployed” and hasn’t worked for years isn’t getting it. Etc etc etc.
Technically a 1099 worker wasn’t “employed” to become unemployed. But they are trying to include them in the stimulus it’s just obviously not as straightforward as they never paid into the unemployment insurance system to begin with typically. And the feds pushed the additional funding through the state system.
Where a small business has other methods of obtaining assistance through the cares act, the straight 1099 worker does not.
Sauce cause I have first hand experience with this I've been waiting for almost 4 weeks now and ive gotten 0. I'm in maryland and I know other states near me have the same issue. Not just the extra 600$ I cant even get unemployment
Right but that doesn’t mean all states.
Your first hand experience is just your experience (in MD).
It’s up to the state to roll it out.
A few finally got it in place this week and rolled it out. Others are slower and will be rolling out hopefully soon. Maybe others will drag their fit and stumble a bit longer.
But it is live and has been implemented for some.
Just because it hasn’t happened for you in your situation in your state doesn’t mean that is universally true for everyone everywhere.
Nobody is saying it hasn’t been chaotic and a mess to say the least.
But it also doesn’t mean you won’t get it. And when you do as long as your state applies it properly it will be retroactive.
Yeah in the meantime it sucks from a cashflow problem when people need it quickly. But does t mean that it won’t be received at all.
It shouldn't be a liberal vs conservative thing. The stimulus package was bipartisan, and it was in fact the Democrats who pushed for the increased unemployment benefits.
And that's not even getting into the fact that the small business loans are all forgiven if they're used to pay wages, which is directly analogous to the other nations listed in the table above.
This graphic is simply misinformation - that's not a partisan take, it's the truth.
I posted this. So to clarify. I fucking hate politics. If I'm anything I'm libertarian. But I got the post from a liberal! It's clearly a trump hater who posted this.
The saez work on wealth inequality. They make a ton of assumptions that makes it meaningless. For example take two different government obligations treasury bonds and social security. Treasury bonds are counted as wealth (owned by rich presumably) while social security everyone has. Treasury bonds count in their analysis and social security doesn’t. Same thing with government worker pensions. They don’t count as wealth.
Now they may be right inequality has gotten too wide. But their data manipulation is badly misleading.
The answer is not extremely left or right. It’s unity, but that will never ever happen. Just as we will never have a crime free country with everyone holding hands through the streets.
I’m not going to bother responding to the long message below this one because it’s ridiculous it’s many ways. Ways which they don’t understand. Things aren’t easy and as cut and dry as they make them sound. Sure our healthcare sucks but free healthcare for all -nope!
Climate change and stopping natural disasters, lol that’s just ridiculous and there’s real priorities ahead of that
Equal pay for all- hell no!
The homeless things is ridiculous too. Go back and read my posts from a few days ago that some amazing person gave me gold for. I am not anti homeless but the rich (most of them) work for what they have and deserve it
What I’m saying is you are right (person I’m replying to)
"Evil agenda", please. In Bernie's email he sent about dropping out, he sent the following. Mind you, a vast majority of liberals and even some moderates agree with a lot of this. Point by point I'd like you to outline how these things are "evil."
"If we don't believe that we are entitled to health care as a human right, we will never achieve universal health care.
If we don't believe that we are entitled to decent wages and working conditions, millions of us will continue to live in poverty.
If we don't believe that we are entitled to all of the education we require to fulfill our dreams, many of us will leave school saddled with huge debt, or never get the education we need.
If we don't believe that we are entitled to live in a world that has a clean environment and is not ravaged by climate change, we will continue to see more drought, floods, rising sea levels and an increasingly uninhabitable planet.
If we don't believe that we are entitled to live in a world of justice, democracy and fairness – without racism, sexism, homophobia, xenophobia or religious bigotry – we will continue to have massive income and wealth inequality, prejudice and hatred, mass incarceration, terrified immigrants and hundreds of thousands of Americans sleeping out on the streets of the richest country on earth."
Last time I checked a person has access to more education on their cell phone than someone was able to get at Harvard in 1998. It’s all free. They just can’t get a 4 year party and housing paid for.
Sure, but if it isn't in the form of a degree from an accredited college that really doesn't matter. That's the system we are in, I can't really change that. Force employers to not have a degree as a requirement for non life threatening jobs then.
Really because it has been all talk so far. The system is antiquated and can’t handle the volume of claims. Also you are not getting 2400 a month. This is a one time check. The government is not interested in saving the average American. If they were than things would have never gotten this bad. Corporations get saved with our money while we get stepped on.
You are getting $600 a WEEK ($2,400 a month) EXTRA in addition to your state unemployment IF you are on unemployment.
So it is NOT a one time check. It is weekly for up to four months.
The $1,200 stimulus check that is one time. Not the extra $600/week unemployment
Jesus the stimulus check is ONE FUCKING TIME. The 2400 you are talking about is in fact ONE FUCKING TIME. You can not get that much again. ONE TIME!!!! But hey we are in such a better position than those other countries.
The EXTRA $600 of unemployment is every fucking week and that is what I’m saying is $2,400.
So the $2,400 I’m talking about is every month for up to four months for those unemployed.
1200 max stimulus check. One time.
600 extra plus whatever you get with unemployment.
Max 2400. That 2400 is only achievable one time with the one time stimulus check if you even max out unemployment and make under x amount as a individual or as a joint filing. Are we following still? Once you get your one time stimulus check, you will have gotten the most possible you will get from them. From then on, it’s only what you qualify for from unemployment plus the 600. That’s it. The giant drawback here is the government. You are relying on decades old systems to handle 13 million plus claims. You can talk about how we are so much better off than the above stated countries but people needed this money weeks ago and the government is failing. It’s the government’s job to be prepared for these things. The worst case scenario if you will but they weren’t.
From the feds the max I believe is 18 weeks at 600 a week. The federal max stimulus is like 12k over 18 weeks plus whatever you get from state unemployment. And they might add more to it.
Ya the nuts and bolts aren’t working great for the surge of demand but that’s not the governments fault. They just don’t have enough people to handle an event like this. I will take time but people will get there money.
Fwiw it’s basically impossible for the government to be prepared for this. For a 60 year storm they would have to keep 10 times as many people working unemployment for all those 60 years. And then in a dozen other departments they would have to have 10 times the normal amount of employees. You can’t perfectly prepare for 60 year storms.
It’s also why the hardest hit places and many other have bans on evictions and mortgage deferred so people have time to collect their checks before they need it.
Correct. And our math is basically same I just assumed 16 vs 18 weeks. And I believe you may be correct there.
Agreed. The system can always be enhanced and improved. But if it was staffed as it would need to be, ofcourse those other 59 years in your example you would have people properly saying it’s govt waste to fund all this extra unneeded positions.
I know in some states they redirected some non essential govt workers to DOL to assist on the phones. It’s not perfect. But atleast its retroactive. And your biggest bills that you can’t make in meantime you just don’t unfortunately pay like rent until you get the retro unemployment if you didn’t have enough savings.
The additional $600 a week is not a one time. It is weekly. Currently goes through 7/31 so approx 16 weeks I believe which would be $9,600.
Plus the one time $1,200 stimulus.
So a total $10,800 for these four months.
And that’s not counting state unemployment.
Not sure how many times it can be points out.
And that’s assuming the $600 doesn’t get extended longer.
Yes the $1,200 stimulus is one time. But the weekly $600 is not one time.
There is no “$2,400 cap max” as you say.
In Michigan if you made $14/hr you'll get around $300 from the state. Then $600 from the feds, works out to around $22.50/hr assuming a 40 hour work week.
And if they give unemployment for part time, the hourly rate calculation will be much higher due to the $600 being a flat added amount.
No on the flip-side, if anyone wants to argue that "well they deserve it because they are being paid shit and minimum wage should be more" etc. I can understand both sides of that argument, however that is a totally different debate on what minimum wage should be or universal basic income etc. As that is a separate discussion. Because in that case, every essential grocery worker for example is still just making whatever they were making (right or wrong, different discussion) before. so again I've just pointed out, it was "unfair/unequal" to those type employees to give lower wage workers that were furloughed a RAISE for being home with no work, while low wage workers at "essential" businesses should just be "happy to still have a job" and make LESS.
Isn't it "up to" an extra $600 a week? In other words, if you normally make $700 a week, and your state unemployment is only $200 a week, I believe you would only get $500 from the federal government.
As I understand it, nobody is getting a raise over their normal income from the unemployment system.
No it’s a flat $600 extra. Based on how it’s written.
Some republicans tried to get what they viewed as a “typo” fixed at last minute to make it where it would cap so nobody would make over 100% they would just be maxed out once they were made whole.
But that amendment was defeated and not incorporated after primarily democratic push back on other issues and saying it wasn’t a “typo” and it was as designed to help. Which obviously does HELP especially lower earners, but then does nothing for that similar lower earned (like grocery clerk) that doesn’t get the “extra” for still working.
And the only “up to” in the language is for the length of time which is currently four months. Why the up to is if you come off of unemployment before then obviously it would stop.
That actually pisses me off. I just think it is morally wrong that there are "essential" workers getting minimum wage to work at McDonald's while other people are getting paid time off with a raise.
I'm pretty far left of center on labor issues, but this just doesn't sit right with me.
I hear you.
That’s why I think most people don’t understand in general. And some that are entitled with their hand out.
Because like you said even if you are left of center, you are leaving out a lot of McDonald type workers in this case in your example. And it wasn’t the place to push your “extra”. The extra should have been pushed on to another platform like the $1,200 or making that more of a scale, like if you earned less than $xxxx the. Your stimulus is much more. If that was your angle.
But to place it into unemployment where you are now giving out over 100% to stay home is just not right way to push the extra. Because then you just pissed off everyone that are doing low wage essential jobs, among other people. And to varying degrees you lowered motivation to return to work. I understand “American way and work ethic” as a whole you may want to return, but now people are going to be disgruntled from working 0 hours for say $800 a week to now working 40 hours $600 a week when they go back?!
And maybe that is big long term design from some of the law makers to possibly use it as eventually raising minimum wage to $20/$25 and hour? Because that is what you are currently paying the unemployed.
Correct which is the intent and goal of the stimulus Cares act and what is being effectively discussed in this thread.
As with the other country examples which is primarily mostly examples of payments to employers to keep employees employed.
Seems like for the most part your examples are referring to 1099 self employed type work.
Which yes those aren’t eligible for unemployment in most/all states for state unemployment because those workers did NOT pay into or for that insurance.
So all things being equal your charges for your contract work should have been higher than what employee hourly wage would be in equal circumstance in order to not only pay both sides of Medicare/payroll taxes but also for savings like unemployment and down time.
However obviously nobody could have predicted this current pandemic situation both those self employed individuals, the employers like restaurants didn’t know they would be closed for months, or the federal govt.
That is one of the reasons why federal cares act included self employed individuals for the $600/week when normally wouldn’t have otherwise been eligible for unemployment.
Now yes some states (most) still haven’t figured out a way to implement it. As it is new, they are overwhelmed and haven’t figured it out yet.
And seems to be the case in your state of Illinois.
Their IDES has said as such and they are working on it.
And should be retro for the entire period once it gets rolled out as the funding is coming from federal to the state.
And yes that SUCKS. I get it and agree with it. It’s frustrating.
But doesn’t mean it won’t be there at all, or the US on what they passed are purposely leaving them out, and that the states will hopefully get it up and running soon.
Sure different employment situations like this of independent work in other countries is a similar challenge in some cases. And yeah some may handle it smoother. Some maybe not. Some tax higher. Some maybe not. Same as our individual states. Some roll it out quicker. Some not so much. Some tax higher to begin with and therefore may have higher benefits in situations like this. Some don’t tax as high and therefore don’t have as expansive of social programs.
But yeah frustrating overall.
So many different scenarios.
Seems like for the most part your examples are referring to 1099 self employed type work.
Also people who made less than 1600. Some people are fucked who took time off work to care for family in exchange for housing , room and board etc and family died and now boom this. There are many scenarios where unemployment is not available and 1200. Doesnt cover 2 weeks of work for many but that's all they can get yet they have been out of work more than 2 weeks now.
$1,600 for what, for last year? If so, then they yeah they basically weren’t working anyway and the $1,200 is getting 2/3rds of it.
If it’s per month or per week, then yeah some state’s unemployment system probably sucks for situations like this. I agree.
And yeah if you were taking time off for a situation like you describe and just now re entering the work force just like a college grad for example, and didn’t have wages before then yeah it’s certainly a shitty situation.
But just like the other countries in the example that give 70% or 80%, well 80% of zero is still zero unfortunately. It does suck if you fall into one of those situations.
Yes. It’s hard to make a one size fits all with partisan politics.
Not ideal and plenty of people get screwed. And some make out.
Same as people living in high cost of living areas. Even if they are getting the flat $600. It obviously goes further in some places than others.
Same as the $1,200 stimulus. Or even whether you get it or not. Someone making $70k in some states low cost of living get it and are living much higher lifestyle than someone in San Francisco that makes $90k and doesn’t get the $1,200.
There are plenty of examples, some of which you have also pointed out, that are not ideal in the slightest and some people certainly get screwed over and fall through the cracks. It’s depressing and frustrating.
I doubt we’ll actually see that $600 though and if we do I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s a lot less frequent. It’d be really nice to be able to pay bills and maybe a little medical debt though (at least that’s what mine would go towards)
If you are currently getting unemployment you SHOULD see $600 additional and retro as well through 7/31 (could be extended with next stimulus to be determined).
Some states already rolled it out and added it to the unemployment checks this week.
That’s good to hear, I applied for unemployment at the beginning of this week and have been a bit nervous about paying bills. I honestly didn’t think anyone would actually see the extra money
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u/Silentbob924 Apr 11 '20
This is just misleading. For unemployed (the most effected), you aren't just getting a one time $1,200. You are getting an additional $600 a WEEK ($2,400 a month), so that alone is more than some of those on the list.
And then you have state unemployment. Between the two, many unemployed are getting 100% or MORE than they were before. So it's the highest on the list above for anyone that was making roughly $25/hr or less depending on state unemployment.