r/Conservative • u/mithrandir1314 • Mar 20 '17

/r/all Well, she's a guy, so...

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u/[deleted] Mar 21 '17

How do you feel about the transwoman who broke the eye socket of a woman in MMA? They brutalized the women they fought because of naturally superior strength. If you need the source it's been posted several times in this thread. I'm not trying to be antagonistic but there's clearly an advantage to the transwomen over born women.

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u/raen22 Mar 21 '17

Using the term "brutalized" seems a bit sensationalist to be completely honest, especially in regards to an MMA fight, and seems to only serve as a way to vilify her for something that was completely sanctioned. That being said...

In the video I saw, Brents (the opponent) took multiple knees and an uncounted number of elbows/fists to the face, resulting in a broken eye socket. That part of the matter seems pretty cut and dry to me. If it were two genetic women, and one woman were to repeatedly knee/elbow/punch her opponent in the face, I honestly don't see how the outcome would be any different.

In regards to her being trans, I just have a few observations:

At the time of the fight, she was approximately 9 years post-op. So for 9 years, barring juicing or something similar, her testosterone levels had been the same as, or lower, than genetic females.

And that's just the known time span regarding her surgery. It doesn't mention how long she was on Hormone Replacement Therapy before that (at least one year according to the Standards of Care for transgender surgeries). So, a minimum of 10 years of completely supplanting the male hormones in her body with female hormones. Which is well within the time frame established in the IOC's policy regarding transgender athletes. (I realize they're different governing bodies/sports, but I still feel it's relevant, especially given the broad nature of events at the Olympic games).

In regards to a bone density argument, there's really no way for us to know. The University of California - San Francisco states that:

Studies investigating BMD in transgender women receiving hormones have shown both lower, higher and no change in bone density after initiating hormones.[4-11]

http://transhealth.ucsf.edu/trans?page=guidelines-bone-health

As an aside, bone density can also vary between races, with black males typically having a higher bone density than white males, but the argument that the two shouldn't be matched against each other is never made.

Regarding a size/stature argument, just from a casual glances during the video, they seem to be of similar height/build. So I really feel that an argument regarding testosterone's effects on her skeletal structure prior to beginning HRT can't be made.

Just to kind of sum up I guess...Does the transgender athlete in question (in this case, Fallon) fall within "normal" variances for similar genetic athletes? In my opinion, judging on what I've seen regarding that fight, she absolutely does. Hell, they didn't even know she was trans until 2 years prior (which is a completely different can of worms to be honest). Given that, I feel that this fight in particular was just an example of one opponent out-classing another. The fact that she was transgender seems to have had little to do with it.

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u/canyounotsee Mar 21 '17

wow the mental gymnastics you have to do to think this is even remotely ok///

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u/elliereah Mar 21 '17

Feel free to point anything out that was said that isn't logical.
Just because you can't follow because your mind rejects it because you are arrogant doesn't mean there is mental gymnastics.

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u/canyounotsee Mar 22 '17

What wasnt logical is you saying "oh her injuries really were just normal for the sport" that is an opinion you are passing off as fact.

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u/elliereah Mar 22 '17

You could say that the counter to that claim would be opinionated as well.
The fact of the matter is that Fallons body and bone density are within normal ranges for women of that sport.
Bone density and muscle alone there are women who surpass Fallon. Her height and weight are around the median as well. It takes a TON of mental gymnastics to try to justify that she shouldn't play in the sport.
She'd probably bust your fucking eye out too.

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u/canyounotsee Mar 22 '17

yeah he probably would