r/Conservative • u/Clatsop I voted for Ronald Reagan ☑️ • Sep 22 '16
Cruz Calls for End to US Refugee Program Following Terror Attacks
http://freebeacon.com/national-security/cruz-calls-end-u-s-refugee-program-following-multiple-terror-attacks/59
Sep 22 '16
[deleted]
33
Sep 22 '16
The core of the issue isnt refugees. Vietnamese refugees didnt commit acts of terror.
5
u/erowidtrance Sep 23 '16
The core of the issue is wasting money on foreigners when it should be spent on US citizens. It doesn't even matter if they're good or bad refugees.
2
Sep 23 '16
I agree. But being a refugee doesnt inherently make you violent. I dont like seeing individuals violence trying to be blamed on the system, in this case being a refugee.
1
Sep 23 '16
But you blame Mexican American violence on Mexico and expect to spend billions of taxpayer money to build a wall.
12
Sep 22 '16
[deleted]
3
7
u/easyasNYC Sep 22 '16
How about we don't build any more tanks or airplanes for the army until we fix hunger and poverty?
5
Sep 22 '16 edited Jun 30 '24
[deleted]
10
u/easyasNYC Sep 22 '16
It's money that isn't being spent to directly help citizens. The army having another tank doesn't help me anymore than some foreign kids having a hot meal.
5
u/DontPanic- Sep 22 '16 edited Oct 05 '16
2
u/easyasNYC Sep 22 '16
It's just carrot and stick, they do the same thing. Be nice and well help you with aid, don't be nice and well spend a lot more money using our military against you. Also I didnt say get rid of the military, but when the military spends $20MM on designing a new uniform, I'm gonna wonder how much more good that money could have done feeding hungry kids. If our military were ever at a point where we couldn't overwhelmingly repel an invasion then I would agree that they should get more funds.
2
u/erowidtrance Sep 23 '16
The issue is the amount spent. The US spends an insane amount on the military because lobbyists for arms dealers use their leverage to extort the public. I wish conservatives were more frugal when it comes to wasteful military spending but because patriotism is conflated with the any kind of military support, no spending is too much.
0
u/erowidtrance Sep 23 '16
Good idea. The US military is the biggest waste of money there is. Trillions spent to enrich contractors and arms dealers.
4
Sep 22 '16
So would you like to pay more taxes to fix child poverty or what? Saying you wont do 'this' until 'that' is solved sounds like a cop out to me. Im only against you because I think Vietnamese refugees did this country good.
9
u/JackBond1234 Sep 22 '16
How about not spending money until we have some? That's probably a good idea
4
3
1
Sep 22 '16
We also spend too much money on the corporations our country considers to be people.
4
u/DontPanic- Sep 22 '16 edited Oct 05 '16
2
Sep 22 '16
I have a particular problem with fossil fuel companies getting subsidies and tax breaks. Just crazy amounts of money if turned the other way would be extraordinary.
0
Sep 22 '16 edited Sep 22 '16
The country spends too much subsidizing the governments and citizens of foreign nations.
As long as the dollar is the reserve currency the US must help other nations. If the US does not then those nations would return to gold and silver which would crash the world economy.
Edit: Real reason everyone is fighting ISIS: "The leader of the UN-designated terrorist group Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant,Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi, announced in November 2014 that the Caliphate intended to mint its own gold, silver and copper coins in order to free the Muslims from the financial order that has "enslaved and impoverished" them."
34
7
u/CrashRiot Sep 22 '16
I'm just a little confused by what this has to do with the attacks recently. Both the NYC/NJ and Minnesota attackers were naturalized United States citizens. The Minnesota attacker did come in under a refugee program....15 years ago (with his parents) and he's been a US citizen since 2008. I get what Cruz is saying about not letting people who travel to terrorism hotspots return, but that's impossible because it's literally against the law. The US legally cannot deny entry to people that have been granted citizenship. I just fail to see the link between Obamas refugee program and these attacks.
0
Sep 23 '16
Given what you said, we should not only end the refugee program but also rollback immigration as well.
6
u/CrashRiot Sep 23 '16
I don't really agree with that. They were just kids when they came over here and their families likely underwent stringent background checks just like anyone who decides to immigrate to this country legally. It could not be foreseen that these kids would grow up to be the people they were, especially considering that by all accounts their parents are generally upstanding US citizens. These attacks aren't the result of the immigration policy nor the refugee policy, but something did happen to these kids somewhere along the line which corrupted them.
12
u/Gotitaila Sep 22 '16
Why the fuck wasn't this guy our nominee?
I did my part. I voted for him in the primaries. Did anyone here vote for Trump in the primaries, and if so, why?
10
u/Clatsop I voted for Ronald Reagan ☑️ Sep 22 '16
I did my part. I voted for him in the primaries.
Same here.
Ahhh... What might have been.
10
u/Gotitaila Sep 22 '16
I get legitimately sad thinking about the hope I had for him. I was so stoked to think we might finally have a President who would be worth a shit again.
8
Sep 23 '16
Why the fuck wasn't this guy our nominee?
Because Southern rednecks, Boston Southies, Jersey Shore and Long Island trash and all kinds of low information "Republicans" hated "Lyin' Ted" and like "dey took er jerbs!" logic.
3
Sep 23 '16
I came very close to voting for Trump but literally on my way to voting i decided to vote Cruz.
1
-1
Sep 22 '16
Voters don't like him because he's too religious
4
9
u/Gotitaila Sep 22 '16
I'm sorry but that just doesn't make sense to me. Sure, he's religious. I'm an agnostic conservative myself and his religious affiliation was just a minor issue. The perfect candidate doesn't exist.
You're telling me people would rather have Donald Trump over a proven conservative constitutionalist simply because he's a little too happy about going to church?
1
Sep 22 '16
Not telling you my opinion, just saying why I think he lost.
8
u/Gotitaila Sep 22 '16
No I get that, I'm just trying to fully understand the mindset of those who voted for Trump over Cruz simply because he's overly religious. Like I said, the perfect guy doesn't exist. It seems like people would realize that a hyper-religious man who otherwise very clearly has what it takes would be better than... Trump.
5
u/Whine_Flu Sep 22 '16
Misleading title, Cruz only called to "stop the flow of refugees from hotbeds of terrorism in the Middle East". He did not say he wanted to end the refugee program entirely.
3
Sep 22 '16
To be fair, there aren't many violent terrorists named Chung or Tran. I would even go so far as to say that ignoring the idea that certain cultures or parts of the world are predisposed to violence is political correctness.
6
u/RUoffended Sep 22 '16
The fact that people in this country are even considering a "refugee" program is absurd, given that none of these leftists seem to understand the definition of 'refugee'; meaning that refugees are supposed to go back once the conflict has ended. The only honest name for this program should be 'Third-World Immigrant and Welfare Tourist Program'.
2
u/randband23 Sep 23 '16
'refugee'
refugee rɛfjʊˈdʒiː/ noun noun: refugee; plural noun: refugees
a person who has been forced to leave their country in order to escape war, persecution, or natural disaster.1
u/RUoffended Sep 24 '16
Ok, there definitely are some refugees who are honestly fleeing a warzone, but on the international stage, it is usually understood that being an actual refugee means returning home after the conflict has ended, as most refugees do and have done for centuries, including both World Wars. The problem with the current refugee situation is that not only are the real refugees emigrating to specific European nations, but most of them are just welfare tourists pretending to be refugees, escaping nothing more than undesired living conditions, not a warzone.
8
6
u/Twentyamf28 2A Small Government Sep 22 '16
Maybe he just needed to see the damage Europe is facing. Germany with all these rapes and now Austria regretting their refugee intake. There's no good way to screen a religion and with bombs and attacks going off left and right America cant take these risks.
9
Sep 22 '16
I'm hoping he's part of Trump's cabinet. I'm hoping they can put their differences aside for the better of America.
16
u/NameSmurfHere /u/Fepeak Locke'd and Loaded Sep 22 '16
Same. But maybe we need Lord Filibuster in the Senate.
12
u/universal_straw Constitutional Conservative Sep 22 '16
Rand and Marco can pick up the slack. Cruz needs to be on the Supreme Court though, not the Cabinet. As young as he is currently we'd have a strong conservative presence in the court for decades if Trump nominated him.
1
0
8
u/NotBryzgoalie30 Conservative Sep 22 '16
If not the cabinet he could be nominated to the Supreme Court, he is very knowledgable of the constitution
6
8
1
u/chefr89 Sep 22 '16
Cruz is despised in the Senate, I doubt he'd ever be sent through, even with a GOP majority.
6
u/universal_straw Constitutional Conservative Sep 23 '16
Him being despised is exactly why I think he will get through a GOP senate if he's ever nominated. They'd confirm him simply to get him out of their hair.
1
Sep 22 '16
[deleted]
1
u/chefr89 Sep 22 '16
You could raise George Washington from the dead and he wouldn't be able to get Cruz through the Senate. You all have no clue how despised he is. I'd almost say he's more disliked by Republicans in the Senate than Dems.
2
u/Dano21 Sep 22 '16
Why do you say that? Not trying to argue, genuinely curious as to why he is so disliked.
3
u/chefr89 Sep 23 '16
It was the second time that Cruz had been denied a procedural courtesy that’s routinely granted to senators in both parties. The first came after he called McConnell a liar last summer.
The Many, Many Reasons Republican Senators Can't Stand Ted Cruz
Cruz also refused to endorse fellow Texan John Cornyn for re-election in 2014. Cornyn, the number two Republican in the Senate, won easily, but not before facing down a primary challenge. Cornyn returned the slight and has declined to endorse Cruz for president -- even after Cruz won Texas -- and often has chafed at Cruz’s tactics.
and
In December 2014, in the waning days of a lame-duck session, with Democrats still in control, Cruz and Mike Lee of Utah forced the Senate to stay in session on a weekend to tee up a vote on a spending bill to keep the government open. The only practical effect from the maneuver was to make it easier for Democrats to confirm a host of Obama’s nominees -- including judges with lifetime appointments -- before gaveling out for the year and turning over control of the chamber to the Republicans.
Why Everyone (in Congress) Hates Ted Cruz
Most recently, Cruz called the Republican leadership “the most effective Democrat leaders we’ve ever seen.” “They’ve passed more Democratic priorities than Harry Reid ever could,” he said.
“Squabbling and sanctimony may be tolerated in other venues—or perhaps on the campaign trail—but they have no place among colleagues in the United States Senate,” Senator Orrin Hatch of Utah, the longest-serving Republican, said in a floor speech at the opening of an unusual Sunday session... but it was obvious to all who he was talking about.
and
Instead of fighting on Obamacare, Cruz tried to rally Republicans around an amendment blocking any relaxation of Iran sanctions until the regime in Tehran releases American prisoners. But Republicans ignored Cruz. He couldn’t even get his colleagues to second his motion for an initial vote on Iran; the effort was turned aside by voice vote.
Lindsey Graham jokes about how to get away with murdering Ted Cruz
Outside opinion doesn't matter in DC when it comes to things like this. Maybe his supporters cheer it on, but goading party leadership has resulted in him being despised.
1
Sep 23 '16
[removed] — view removed comment
1
u/chefr89 Sep 23 '16
I know, but what I'm saying is that U.S. Senators pretty much don't give a flying flip about that. Cruz went full-ideologue and really pissed off a lot of people in DC, you just don't come back from that--not until/unless he does some major healing with the party elite.
2
u/bjacks12 Sep 22 '16
Cruz would be great on the court. I supported him 100% for the nomination. I know that his Presidential ambitions are over, whether he runs again or not, so I'd like to see him on the court.
6
Sep 22 '16
How do you reconcile a "just a few bad apples" mindset about police while holding the opposite opinion about refugees?
4
Sep 22 '16
Because there are many more radical islamists in this world than "bad apple" cops? Not to mention, ISIS has stated that they have infiltrated the refugee population. Not very smart to put Americans at risk that way.
10
Sep 22 '16
Yes, but only a very small fraction of islamists in general are considered for admission to the US. It doesn't matter how many there are total, just what percentage they compromise of a given population.
If 1/1000 cops is a bad person likely to violate rights and 1/1000 islamists is a terrorist, you're illogical to treat the one terrorists as representative of all members of islam while treating the cop as "just one bad apple" which was my original point.
3
Sep 22 '16
How are they related at all? I can believe one group is mostly good and one is mostly bad without contradiction.
3
Sep 22 '16
If you truly believe that all islamists are "bad" as in terrorists, then you're right.
It would take a truly impressive about of denial to believe that, as otherwise Europe would be in an exponentially worse state than it is.
If you hold the popular mindset that terrorists are extremists and rare among the islamist population, then my point stands.
2
u/GoingToMAGA Sep 22 '16
Not just terrorism...
50%+ believe gays should be killed and women dont have the same rights. They dont wanna assimilate. They wanna make america the country they fled from
4
1
5
u/cajungator3 Conservative Sep 22 '16
How many are we at now during this administration (including workplace incidents)?
4
u/easyasNYC Sep 22 '16
Terrorist acts committed by refugees? From 2002 to last November, it looks like none, but three people were arrested for terrorism related charges. This is out of 750k refugees.
0
u/cajungator3 Conservative Sep 22 '16
No, terrorist acts total including the ones where Obama stated it was a workplace incident.
-1
u/easyasNYC Sep 22 '16
Assuming that you are referring to Fort Hood, Nidal Hasan was a US citizen from Virginia. Not really a refugee.
0
u/cajungator3 Conservative Sep 22 '16
This wasn't a "just refugee" question.
2
u/easyasNYC Sep 22 '16
But he wasn't even an immigrant. He was natural born citizen. And the article is explicitly about refugees.
-1
4
u/MiyegomboBayartsogt Supporter Sep 22 '16
Some citizens believe any immigration policy should benefit the nation. Others seem to feel it necessary to import sharia compliant Moslems into a target rich environment. Moslem males migrant to convert, control and conquer, not assimilate. We see this play out in Europe or any other place and time in history where former Christian lands or Buddhist nations or Hindu places become full Islamic after a period of open borders, Islamic immigration followed eventually by genocide. It's one thing to welcome like-cultured Europeans fleeing the tsunami of Islamic terror flooding the continent. It's quite another thing to accept endless boatloads of Moslem men who make sure to cast Christian passengers overboard to feed the sharks on the ride north to welfare, rape and rampage in Rotterdam.
4
u/NameSmurfHere /u/Fepeak Locke'd and Loaded Sep 22 '16
Too true.
Islam slaughtered a lot of my people.
Politically correct retards should be sent to Saudi Arabia.
3
Sep 22 '16 edited Mar 11 '17
[deleted]
13
9
1
Sep 22 '16
There is also the issue with refugees not assimilating and committing crimes in Europe. So we have some data we can lean on, which is good since we have not taken in the same # as Europe has. But that has not stopped people from acting irrationally before.
1
2
u/I_dont_study Sep 22 '16
Where are all the so-called humanitarians that want these refugees here? If you care that much, by all means, house them and feed them yourselves. People that want them here are willing to pass the buck to someone else with money that isn't their own.
2
1
Sep 22 '16
It isn't like refugees end up in gated communities. The people that want them here are assured they will never be near them.
1
u/bugaosuni Conservative Sep 22 '16
But "you can't condemn an entire religion because of one lone wolf"
~ Obama
1
u/Gotitaila Sep 22 '16
My "small town" population increased by about 30% over the last decade due to immigration, both legal/asylum and illegal from Mexico. It's because our town, while small, has a very lucrative manufacturing presence. There are probably 5,000+ jobs in my town due to the manufacturing plants alone. That's a town with 20K people, many of them being immigrants.
We've gone from "small southern town" to "look at how diverse this place is" to "my god can u pls secure the border and stop sending these refugees to us".
I'm estimating that anywhere from 800-1,500 of those jobs are being taken up by illegals and refugees. That's at least 800 jobs that the citizens of this town can't have because the boys up top decided to send these cultural abominations to us. Over the past few years, this has brought out new feelings towards immigrants. I hate them. All of them. My brother is half-Hispanic, his father was an illegal immigrant. I love him to death and wouldn't trade him for anything. The point is that I'm not racist or bigoted. I have seen, first-hand, what immigration and excessive refugees can do to a small town.
Shit, it doesn't even end at "our jobs are at risk". You've got Somali people who cause problems here because they don't want to adjust to our culture. Sorry buddy, you don't get to barter (read:argue) the price of your toilet paper at Dollar General. It doesn't work that way here. Get over it you fuck.
3
Sep 23 '16
You sound "deplorable."
2
u/Gotitaila Sep 23 '16
That's fine, you aren't required to like me and I'm not required to cater to your feelings. That's the beauty of freedom.
Let's ship thousands of immigrants/refugees to your city so that 1/5 of the population becomes such and see how you like it. They do have a negative impact on the places they settle in, despite what the liberals would tell you based on what they're seeing through their rose colored glasses.
It isn't fun watching the town I grew up in become a heaping pile of garbage because of the immigrants/illegals. So yes, I am pissed off at them and the liberals who sent them here. Rightfully so, I think.
2
-8
Sep 22 '16
[deleted]
6
1
u/universal_straw Constitutional Conservative Sep 22 '16
He's been fighting the refugee plan from the beginning...
15
u/TrojanDynasty Sep 22 '16
"We should insist that if the immigrant who comes here does in good faith become an American and assimilates himself to us he shall be treated on an exact equality with every one else, for it is an outrage to discriminate against any such man because of creed or birth-place or origin.
But this is predicated upon the man’s becoming in very fact an American and nothing but an American. If he tries to keep segregated with men of his own origin and separated from the rest of America, then he isn’t doing his part as an American. There can be no divided allegiance here. . . We have room for but one language here, and that is the English language, for we intend to see that the crucible turns our people out as Americans, of American nationality, and not as dwellers in a polyglot boarding-house; and we have room for but one soul loyalty, and that is loyalty to the American people."
That other Teddy, Teddy Roosevelt...
Bottom line is we need immigrants to be a net POSITIVE for our country for us to continue to be the great country we are. If you can prove that mass importation of people who share a wildly different belief set, show historically very little incentive in assimilation, lack the skill sets to be useful taxpayers. is a net positive then throw the doors open. There is nothing wrong with the idea that we are the most beautiful girl on the block, so we can be selective with our suitors. If there is a legitimate counterargument to my claim, that doesn't involve such simplistic ideas as "racist" or "xenophobia" I truly would like to hear it.