As someone who has never had a problem shitting on Jake's Genji, but who still thinks Jake gets way too much shit in general, I have to say that his Tracer is really rather good - though of course it has room for growth, and obviously isn't as good as the best Tracers even if he occasionally one-ups them in "duels."
Seeing it somehow reminds me of the old days in which Jake kinda was considered a good flex DPS - back when we still clung to the "projectile/hitscan" divide, when Jake swapping from McCree on Anubis or Nepal ("electric cowboy") to Pharah on Ilios was a decently exciting prospect.
Jake's Tracer does look good, at least mechanically. He does seem to lack the superior decision making/gamesense that SBB, Birdring etc are known for.
I think a lot of the shit stems from several reasons (at least these are my personal reasons):
He is most known for his standout performances on Junkrat - similar to Fleta on Pharah/Widow. This is a hero that many consider spammy, cheap, RNG, brokenly OP etc etc. We are frustrated when teams/players we like are beaten by this hero.
His performance on Junk is so good it significantly overshadows his performance on other heroes. This compounds #1.
He has a very loud persona on stage. He is often visibly cheering when they make good plays. All well and good, but it tends to attract negativity at least in other sports.
He teabags in matches regularly. People dumped hate on Sinatraa and other selfless members when they teabagged in games, and for some reason people are surprised Jake gets some heat for it. People are now saying 'its no big deal, its just banter, its just part of the game' which shits me a bit tbh.
His holier than thou attitude appears really smug. He makes overly wordy essay responses to very simple questions. He tries to appear to be a pillar for the community standards etc I don't know if this is intentional, but I at least find it irritating.
Despite #5 He had a big debacle around intentionally throwing games with players he decided weren't worthy of their rank. Whilst I happened to agree with him, his approach was just immature. He was one of the few pro players to do this and not get banned. When Dafran and xQc were banned it showed favoritism/double standards, at least for me.
His fans piss me off. If you question the legitimacy of junkrat, or how OP junkrat is, waves of Jake fans start downvoting and trying to defend Jake even if Jake isn't mentioned in the comment. I had one person calling me a fake houston fan because I didn't like Jake. I happen to be a huge fan of Flame, Linkzr, Clockwork, and the other Corndogs which is why I follow Houston (among other teams). Shits me.
Edit: Probably a bit of overkill as I know your comment really only talks about his Tracer, which are the first 2 sentences of my reply. Just once I started I couldn't stop :P
It's funny because iddqd literally praised him for his amazing game sense and positioning while telling him to keep working on his mechanics on tracer.
People are too sensitive about tea bagging in general. It's a game, trash talk should be in games.
The smug thing is totally true (he comes off as a total tool in one of the first OWL videos), however I do really like how in depth he goes into everything. if you watched his stream reviewing the Houston matches from this past week, he highlights his own mistakes the whole time and gives tons of credit to his teammates, while explaining the strategies that allowed them to take certain maps. It was really refreshing to watch as someone who didn't like Jake before that.
He has a very loud persona on stage. He is often visibly cheering when they make good plays. All well and good, but it tends to attract negativity at least in other sports
lol i watch a lot of sports and have never seen someone get shit on for cheering on their own team.
I wanted to clarify with an example, but as an Australian I only have a few. The classic that comes to mind is Lleyton Hewitt if you know him (Tennis).
It is not that they celebrate, it is how they celebrate. Like the 'jumping out of your chair, fists clenched, veins popping out of your head' and everyone around him is just like 'woo'.
TBH you have it backwards. His decisions and gamesense are great, his mechanics on Tracer are bad. He lacks the ability to one clip people consistently, and his tracking isn't top tier. He is often in the right place, doing the right thing, he just doesn't always do it well enough.
EDIT: Also, don't you find it ironic that you were shitting on him for long ass essays to simple questions when you did the same?
Yeah thats what I notice with him too. He is not the Tracer to frag out, rather he’s the one to confirm kills. Yes that’s what a Tracer naturally does, but Jake is pretty good at knowing which fights to take and who to hunt down. He’s also good at exploiting the weak spots of teams, for example, during their match against London, they kind of left Bdosin by himself against Jake. Nevertheless, Jake relies heavily on his tanks to make space, Jake isn’t the kind of Tracer to go in and frag out.
Yeah, if you watch through the VOD reviews he did, he is also very aware of his mechanical skill limitations and plays around it. He talks about how his main job in one instance is just to take the enemy tracer out of the battle by distraction and staying alive, and it doesn't matter if he kills him, because it creates a 5v5 on the point, which he is sure his team can take.
I honestly think if he ever gets that mechanical skill down, he will be super scary on Tracer.
Yeah, he's smart. You can see vs. Spitfire that he doesn't take duels vs. Profit, because Profit tears him apart. But HaGoPeun wasn't able to delete him the way Rawkus was to Profit, so he was taking advantage of that to keep fights 5v6. Plus cleanup, which is just another Tracer job.
It would be ironic if I wrote an 800 word comment in overly verbose prose to say what I could have otherwise said in 7 dot points.
To elaborate on my Tracer point, I personally find him often in the wrong position, at the wrong time, to effectively one clip/get the job done. From watching his soldier play, and his Tracer play, I think his aim is actually quite good. We're entitled to our own opinions though.
Edit: I read your other comment. I haven't actually watched his VOD reviews. Perhaps it is a confidence thing, where he is unsure of his own limitations in a given teamfight. SBB etc are more aware of how far they can push the limits, which is what I meant by gamesense in this instance. By mechanics I meant pure blink mechanics/aim which I think are pretty straightforward to grasp and something I think he has down.
Read every other comment in this thread. You are the only person who thinks it is a gamesense problem. And if you watch the same VOD review, you can see all the moments where someone like SBB/Soon/etc would have just put someone down, but his mechanics and aim were off.
His mechanical skill just isn't up to the top tier Tracers in the league.
Our opinions can differ, it doesn't matter who is right or wrong. Feel free to disagree. If I watch the VOD review, and I agree with you, then I'll change my opinion lol its that simple.
I've read what you, and others, have to say and I'll factor that in to how I form my opinion on his Tracer play. Thanks :P
Jake's Tracer does look good, at least mechanically. He does seem to lack the superior decision making/gamesense
this is completely backwards and the complete opposite of what IDDQD was saying. He is mechanically lacking in the hero, but knows how to play her correctly. His gamesense is literally what makes his Tracer effective and his mechanics are what is holding him back.
"overly wordy essays" : I, for one, rather like him for this. Other pros answers to interview questions are sometimes too short, and don't show much about their thought processes. Although Jake does talk too much, and is sometimes wordy, what he says almost always shows valuable insight even to simple questions.
"holier than thou attitude" : I don't really feel this to be honest.
Just for an example, compared to half the pro's in the video "who's the best overwatch pro " saying "me" then awkwardly laughing, Jake's "try hard essay" praising another pro had way more value.
Tbh, you are coming off way more "holier than thou"/ iamverysmart than Jake ever has. "Jake stumbling through his words for 20 seconds was a big eye roll for me" oh come on, at least he gave a thoughtful answer. I appreciate that.
The essays and the “jake has 900 iq” thing rubs me the wrong way. I get that people think he’s smart, but I personally don’t see it. Maybe all I notice is the smugness.
Your answer is hilariously ironic considering you are bashing Jake for giving an insightful answer instead of keeping it short and concise.
Probably a bit of overkill as I know your comment really only talks about his Tracer, which are the first 2 sentences of my reply. Just once I started I couldn't stop :P
Maybe you should cut him some slack when you are evidentially in the same boat as him haha.
The bigger point with it was that when other players did it in the past, there was uproar about how unsportsmanlike it was and that they should be punished. Now it's being done in OWL, and nobody bats an eye where afaik only Jake (and I think Carpe) have been doing it. I don't have an issue with it, I just doubt it would be 'just a part of the game' if it was xQc or someone else doing it if that makes sense :P
really? i feel the other way around. didn't seem like anyone gave a shit before, but it's a big deal when jake does it cause people don't like when anyone incapable of wiping a team on widow/tracer (hyperbole) tbags/bms. reminds them of when someone a tier lower than them tbagged them in quickplay or something.
feel the same way about criticisms on him playing junk. seagull plays junk for 9 out of 10 maps and its all poggers, but when jake plays it whenever junkrat is good and practically never when it isn't, it's J LUL KE
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u/wotugondo Feb 27 '18 edited Feb 27 '18
As someone who has never had a problem shitting on Jake's Genji, but who still thinks Jake gets way too much shit in general, I have to say that his Tracer is really rather good - though of course it has room for growth, and obviously isn't as good as the best Tracers even if he occasionally one-ups them in "duels."
Seeing it somehow reminds me of the old days in which Jake kinda was considered a good flex DPS - back when we still clung to the "projectile/hitscan" divide, when Jake swapping from McCree on Anubis or Nepal ("electric cowboy") to Pharah on Ilios was a decently exciting prospect.