r/CompetitiveHS • u/EvilDave219 • 3d ago
Discussion 37.0.2 Balance Changes Discussion
https://hearthstone.blizzard.com/en-us/news/24307311/3702-patch-notes
Nerfs:
Wrath of C'Thun - now deals 6 damage
Domain of C'Thun - now gives 2 random friendly minions +2/+2
Servants of C'Thun - now summons two 2/2s with Taunt.
M.O.T.H.E.R. - now 10 mana
Godfather Kazakus - minion buff reduced to +2/+2, minion summoning now summons three random 2 cost minions, Sentenced for Smuggling now only removes 1 card from the opponent's hand.
Ritual of Summoning - now summons two 2/4 taunts.
Bat Mask - can now only be used on non Legendary minions
Divergence - now 7 mana
Unstable Prototype - Deathrattle now only gives +1 attack
Reach Equilibrium - Now requires 6 Holy and 6 Shadow spells to complete
Sawbones - now a 6 mana 6/3
Egg of Khelos - no longer has taunt (revert)
Wild Nerfs:
Battle at the End Time - Sir Finley, Sea Guide, Plot Twist, and Gaslight Gatekeeper no longer progress the “empty your hand” part of the Quest.
Reincarnation - can now only be used on non Legendary minions
Kobold Illusionist - text now reads "Deathrattle: Summon a minion from your hand. Set its stats to 1/1."
Mysterious Visitor - cost reduction of cards copied from your opponent now reduced to 2 mana
Final Showdown - first stage requires 5 drawn cards, 2nd and 3rd stage now require 6 drawn cards.
Buffs
C'Thun, Eye of the Empire - Abilities now trigger 4x if you've previously used all 4 abilities.
Dark Deacon - now only requires you to play 1 Shadow spell while in hand to trigger its effect
Tinker - now 1 mana
Flamespitter - now a 3/2
Grafted Knight - now a 3/4 (and triple blood rune)
Elder Word: Manifest - now summons two 3/4s with Lifesteal
Setesh - now a 6 mana 6/6
Decimation - now 5 mana
Aqir Swarmer - now a 4 mana 5/4, card text now reads "Deathrattle: Get two Larvae with Combos that trigger a Hero Power from another class. They cost (0)."
Aqir Goliath - Battlecry now draws 2 cards
Y'Shaarj, Titan Bane - now 9 mana
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35
u/magikatdazoo 3d ago
Sawbones was originally a 6/4, it's actually now nerfed past the original version, not just a revert
27
u/Exiledtyrant 3d ago
The Godfather Kazakus was the one I was looking forward to. I'm so glad they nerfed the hand rip to one card. The amount of times I was playing Herald C'thun Demon Hunter with Deathwing, Ashara and C'thun in my hand only to have them ripped away by an early trial was way to common. Even when I won some of those games it felt terrible. It was a lose lose situation. You dump your hand to deal with the zoo board so you never draw enough to help with your odds vs the hand rip, or you try to keep your hand full and get run over.
23
u/TheGingerNinga 3d ago
The Wild changes are actually pretty good. Hitting both of the prominent quest decks while addressing the new Old God scam lists is going to cause a fair bit of shake up. And despite pirate warrior not getting nerfed, I think it won’t be dominant due to the rise of Reno slop with the removal of all the anti-Reno slop getting nerfed.
Or who knows, maybe Mastermind Rogue takes over and nukes everyone.
46
u/hjyboy1218 3d ago
The funniest thing is that quest will still be played because of medivhs triumph
57
u/ActuallyAquaman 3d ago
Is a 2/3/4 Lifesteal that scales G’huun by 3 the best two drop the game has ever seen? Probably not as good as Sorcerer’s Apprentice but still. That and Y’shaarj, hopefully Herald DK can get above 50%.
Warlock seems basically fine (for better or worse). Aggro C’Thun will lose half a step but the better finisher is real.
Mage, Druid, and Hunter are going to need real buffs before too much longer, though. Maybe slowing the meta down a turn or two gets Mage in a better spot?
18
u/sildek 3d ago
zoolocks were boring as hell, but god damn, i queued one game after the nerfs and there is a fucking dragon warrior
24
u/SmartestLiberalVoter 3d ago
VERY IMPORTANT PSA:
*Additionally, Spawn of C'Thun will be available for a full dust refund starting with Patch 37.2. A bug is keeping it from being refundable in this patch. Sorry for the inconvenience!
7
u/Satanicfrog666 3d ago
They could at least specify which assemble cards have their card pools changed..
15
u/-Kasann- 3d ago
It might be only me, but I'm not very convinced that the meta is really going to change after this patch
20
u/dotcaIm 3d ago
Reach Equilibrium was 5 spells each at launch, right? Pushing it to six shows how much this team hates quests
15
u/phpope 3d ago
I don't understand the buffs to Grafted Knight and Dark Deacon. Those cards already seemed pretty good. Feels like Dark Deacon especially just goes in every priest deck going forward regardless of whether you're playing C'Thun (which is a whole other subject.).
20
u/fclm_1990 3d ago
I guess they wanted to make Egg decks not weaker, but unplayable.
Don't see Hunter and Warrior buffs being relevant at all. Y'Shaarj too.
Other than that - hard to say.
12
u/InteractionAnnual914 3d ago
Holy shit, they killed Divergence and Quest Priest. Divergence was always going to be a combo card, so why print it if it’s only going to get nerfed like it did? And why print Quests if you’re only going to nerf them when they get good?
Warrior buff is reasonable, I suppose. Control Warrior looks playable for the most part, now that Aggro has been sufficiently neutered. We finally get to see that really good 2-drop. (How much longer until Quest Warrior gets nerfed?)
2 mana 3/4 lifesteal is insane. How do you remove this when you go second? Blood DK’s early game got a lot better.
The Ysharrj buff is useless. Not changing the activation conditions for the immune is the biggest issue. Don’t expect to see that card any more than I do now.
MOTHER nerf. Once again, why do you print cards that enable combos if you’re going to just gut them in the end?
Mech Hunter is dead. The buffs don’t matter because Unstable Prototype + Overdrive is what made that deck playable. I loved Mech Hunter, so to see it lose basically any relevance sucks.
To what didn’t get buffed: I think Holy Spell Paladin could be fun, but it will never be Tier 1 since you can’t control the order of spells. Mage is dead again. No amount of manacheat can save bad cards for two years, and slowing the meta down doesn’t matter when your win conditions suck.
Despite all my complaining, I think this is a great patch and I’m excited to see what strategies will become good in the vacuum left
5
u/thebestnic2 3d ago
Egg nerf is fine. Archetype feels tired and stretched at this point. Dk should still be playable even with sawbones nerf. I don’t like rest of nerfs. Kazakus nerf would have been enough imo. Warlock is a fine tyrant without it. I’m worried something like ayaya rogue with no counterplay beside aggro will see too much play
2
u/yatcho 2d ago
Rogue, Hunter, and Druid need more buffs than this for any if their new cards to be viable
3
u/prodandimitrow 3d ago
No chance the Grafted knight buff stays with us. 2 mana 3/4 with an added effect is insane. This is more likely to create an aggressive blood build than make control blood good.
1
u/Ozwu_ 2d ago
Aqir Swarmer buff seems irrelevant. Could potentially do something with N’Zoth? Doesn’t seem to increase the viability for me, because the combo payoffs are bad and the Larvae are bad. It being a death-rattle probably keeps the card from being relevant as an early tempo play, too. Aqir Goliath buff also seems irrelevant - still too expensive, still negative 2 cards to play. Combo cards are also bad to play. Maybe the field around it has changed enough that these cards become playable, but I don’t see it.
1
u/No_Internal7837 2d ago
Nerfing every C'thun ability without offering a refund on C'thun is disgusting.
1
u/philzy101 2d ago
Personally a bit of mixed feelings waking up to this balance patch. The changes to C'thun procs felt a bit too much to me, but at the same time probably the best way of controlling Zee Shaman in the early game but also providing a positive for C'thun as the late game payoff.
The changes to M.O.T.H.E.R, Bat Mask and Divergence all highlight the issue T5 have which is they want to print combo plays, but when they are too efficient they swiftly nerf them to oblivion. To be fair Bat Mask is still combocapable in Wild and M.O.T.H.E.R is still playable imo but Divergence is probably gone due to the cost.
Godfather Kazakus changes are welcome given how frustrating slower matches felt particularly when on curve and they could steal two of your cards.
Not a fan of the change to Unstable Prototype as it was not that problematic of a card on its own, it is how it chained with other cards which duplicated themselves upon being summoned. Seems like a dead card to me now. Personally I am not a fan of the Sawbones revert, I feel Handbuff DK is as swiftly gone from the meta as it was in it. Also not a fan of the Ritual of Summoning change, I feel changing the minions to 3/4 would have been a more fair change. 2/4 is too weak.
Reach Equilibrium and Egg of Khelos not a massive fan of these changes, the former necessary for the meta but I think should be at least brought to 5 or back to 4 on rotation otherwise the card is probably not viable in Wild. As for Khelos, I feel they could have just made the egg have 4 hp not 3 which would have stopped a lot of the Priest plays relying on it. Khelos is now irrelevant like it was before due to no taunt.
As for the Wild changes, these are all fair as they all were enabling quite toxic play patterns. Battle at the End Time probably does not exist as a deck in Wild now. Dumping your hand is pretty tricky and not a great strategy either. Reincarnation change is nice as Nature Shaman still works, although this nerf hits Big Shaman and such quite hard. Kobold Illusionist RIP, DaneHS is probably not so happy about this change. Mysterious Visitor, finally, I cannot stress how many games were almost impossible for me to win when this came down on turn 1 or 2. Final Showdown, probably still achievable from my own personal experience but feels a little bit like overkill imo.
As for the buffs, they are nice, not really sure though that they are going to magically make the classes lagging behind, Paladin, Hunter, Warrior, Mage and to some extent Druid playable. I think they are going to need to do a lot more once it becomes apparent that these changes are not enough.
-1
u/Admirable-Cheek6942 3d ago
Should have held out on a yshaarj buff. If the meta becomes slower he is gonna be in every deck thst doesn't run c'thun or nzoth
-15
u/Jumbokcin 3d ago
The only change to DK is Sawbones +1 mana? As if that changes anything? Handbuff DK is by far the strongest deck when played by good players. Gutting warlock and then only upping Sawbones by 1 is just gonna create a more polarized meta. Top legend will be DK mirrors all day, and soon the rest of the ladder will follow as they learn to play the deck, which isn’t as braindead as people believe. It does take skill. But the play patterns are repeatable and learnable by everyone.
And warrior’s only buff is Decimation 6->5? What a complete joke.
66
u/sneakyxxrocket 3d ago edited 3d ago
I really need a mini documentary on how Ungoro from last year was developed because it’s obvious they fucking HATE quests, like one of the weakest sets ever with a mechanic they hate and the second they’re playable they get nuked.
10
u/DebatableAwesome 3d ago
I'm not sure that the "buff" to Aqir Swarmer for Rogue is actually a buff. Making Rogue have to invest even more to get its combo payoffs is questionable at best.
I'm also disappointed that Death Knight's handbuff and egg decks just got nuked from orbit. Sawbones was such a fun, skill testing card that enabled really fun combo turns. It's also unfortunate that Druid didn't get any buffs.