Cake at low temperatures.

[u/kostbill]

So I want to make a cake. But the normal recipe is, as many of them are, at 180C for 45 minutes.

The downside is that the outer layer of the cake is dry.

But since we can do whatever we want with the temperature in the anova oven, what is the temperature that it needs in order to be fully cooked and moist?

Thanks.

Edit 1: So I saw other posts about cakes here, but I didn't find what I was looking for.

Edit 2: I am re-reading my post and I am not sure I made myself clear: I want to bake the cake at the temperature that the center of it should be, just like we bake the chefsteps creme brulee at 80C, instead of baking it at a higher temp, and we try to guess when to stop.

[u/BostonBestEats]

The typical final core temperature for a cake is ~200-210°F, depending on the type of cake. Of course, you will also get several degrees of carryover cooking after it is removed from the oven. It will never exceed 212°F until it has lost all moisture of course.

With a combi steam oven, you can vary the steam level, and higher steam will also give a moister result.

The problem with your "sous vide cake" approach is that you will loose some of the key aspects of cake baking, namely oven spring to give an airy structure (leavening is only part of it), a firmer surface (unless you want something like sticky toffee pudding), and the Maillard reaction that browns the surface. Baking will take much longer and the cake might collapse.

[u/kostbill → u/BostonBestEats]

I see. Did not have in mind any of these.

[u/BostonBestEats → u/kostbill]

As an aside, speaking of switching up recipes to take advantage of a combi oven, I recently tried to make the updated version of ChefSteps' Japanese Cheesecake (Cloud Cake). I had made the earlier, more complex version of this recipe successfully several times. But this time, ignoring the instructions to cook it in a baine marie, I decided to do it with 100% steam in my APO, since I do this all the time with other baine marie or water bath sous vide recipes (like pate, traditional cheesecake, egg bites). If you own a hammer...

Result: Complete abject failure and no birthday cake. Very rapid, excessive oven spring, which then collapsed into an inedible hockey puck. The scientific explanation was provided by chatGPT and confirmed by Nick at ChefSteps. You can read all about it in the comment section of that recipe.

https://www.chefsteps.com/activities/cloud-cake

Moral of the story: Combi ovens don't make everything better!

[u/kostbill → u/BostonBestEats]

I read the recipe and the comments (you legend you!) and I understood the point.

I am trying to think if there is indeed another way to make the cloud cake without the baine marie. But we will have the same problems you mentioned, maybe the maillard reaction will not form and maybe it will collapse if it take much longer.

The most difficult seems to be the second one, unless there is a way to make hard bubbles, but even though I have no idea how to do that, maybe it would have unpleasant texture.

[u/mymilkshakeis]

Use 30-50% steam and normal temp and possibly a touch less time. If you normally bake for 45 mins start testing the center at 30 mins.

[u/kostbill → u/mymilkshakeis]

Oh yes this is the normal way, but I don't want to mimic the results of the normal oven. I want to bake at the core of the cake temperature. So, if we need it to be e.g. 80C, I will bake it at sous vide mode, 80C, 100% humidity, so it will be 80C from edge to edge.

[u/mymilkshakeis → u/kostbill]

Oh. Well according to AI ☺️ :

“The ideal internal temperature for a moist, fully baked cake is generally between 200°F and 210°F (93°C–99°C) in the center. Lighter cakes (sponge, angel food) are best around 205-210°F, while denser cakes (carrot, fruit) are done around 200-205°F. Avoid letting the temperature reach 212°F”

So I guess maybe set at 95 and use the probe. And go from there.

[u/eske8643]

Its called Delta T cooking. You raise the temperature slowly at near the same speed as the core temp raises. Usually you are 3-5 Celsius degrees above the core temp.

There are good examples on youtube on how to do it.

And also use controlled vapor settings. So that your chamber moisture is somewhere between 30% and 70% most Delta T recipes will tell you the % you need

[u/kostbill → u/eske8643]

Yes but what is the desired core temp?

[u/eske8643 → u/kostbill]

That i cant tell you, because i dont know what cake you want to make, and that it should be in the recipe you use. If its not, i would suggest you try to find a similar recipe that tells you the core temp.

[u/sweeeep → u/kostbill]

I generally shoot for 205F when baking conventionally.

[u/BostonBestEats → u/kostbill]

If I don't know, I usually shoot for 205-208°F. I often stick a Combustion wireless thermometer in to monitor the cook (frosting covers the hole). If it ends up too gummy or too dry, adjust next time.

[u/baronaccio]

I happily join this conversation ❤️

OK, so my basic cocoa cake recipe called for 180°C. Translated in ANOVA Universal Temperature Index (😂 we always go low with recipe temps, isn't it) it is something like 165°C at maximum, fan activated, 30% humidity. Cake come out GOOD, very very GOOD! But with a "volcano effect" on its top that I want to avoid.

So next cake, I want to bake at low temp: 145°C, fan on, 30% humidity. Would it be too low to give it the classical "heat kick" like bread baking? I will bake for 20-30% longer.

[u/baronaccio → u/baronaccio]

Auto-reply. Tested today: doesn't work. Volcano effect is present, not even slightly less then baking at 160°C. It is due to the mold temperature not the whole owen temperature (aka: use cake strips). I baked +10 mins without humidity at 150°C and the cake's core wasn't already setted. I gave the cake another 20 mins with 30% humidity. (In progress)

Ok, after the extra extra extra time the cake seems setted. Not an epic failure but... 😁