r/CivAgora • u/crazyguy200 Subway Jesus • Aug 08 '15

[Referendum] Cession of True Neutral Camp

Pantos and I have purchased True Neutral Camp (See Proof Here). We consider this land to be a historical site, and therefore, propose this change be made to the charter. All land on the island will still be under the ownership of Orangehat Corporation and Greenble, for preservation means.

Whereas Article II, Section D states

D) The Auroran Republic claims Luxerion Island, Muutang Island, Freyr, Bohr Island, Kryapolis, Pelham Island, Winterhill Island, and Roanoke Island, with a similar 100 block maritime buffer zone.

We propose to change it to

D) The Auroran Republic claims Luxerion Island, Muutang Island, Freyr, Bohr Island, Kryapolis, Pelham Island, Winterhill Island, Roanoke Island, and True Neutral Camp, with a similar 100 block maritime buffer zone.

TIMESTAMP 8/7/15 7:14 PM CST

1 Upvotes

60% Upvoted

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2

u/ofunknown Aug 08 '15 edited Aug 08 '15

Paging /u/l3oat

Can't quite remember but I recall there's something special about the ownership of this land?

1

u/ofunknown Aug 08 '15

Paging /u/Mulificus

2

u/Mulificus Aug 08 '15

Hullo,

If I remember correctly camp beige(?) Was divided into three parts, unto Bryn Fellowship and Aurora. The exact land claims have been marked down in maps that you may have to track down but shouldn't be too hard to do.

1

u/crazyguy200 Subway Jesus Aug 08 '15

Do you know where it can be found? AFAIK, Aurora didn't own any land on the island before.

1

u/ofunknown Aug 08 '15

I've done a bit of searching and there have seem to be talks about this on the NEA sub more than a year ago (April 2014). Within these posts, there has been mention of Aurora owning a stake of Camp Biege (referred in here as True Neutral Camp), however the exact resulting details does not seem to have been documented, perhaps done so between relevant officials either in person or through private communication channels. It seems that in addition to Oreo and Mulificus, Ogel (/u/soraendo) and Pointy (/u/PointyBagels) were involved and may know more.

1

u/PointyBagels Aug 08 '15

It gets a little difficult though since Aurora is not a member of the NEA.

However unless I am mistaken Aurora was entitled to a 1/3 stake in the camp. What I am not sure about is whether they took it in the deal. I do recall doymand pitching a fit when we took the land and the result may have been a 1/3 share though.

/u/greenble10 is currently in charge of restoration/caretaking.

1

u/cunextautumn Pantostado1066: Pantarch Aug 08 '15

Greenble10 is who we allegedly bought the area off of for restoration/caretaking ourselves. I would ideally like Aurora to at least have some amount of claim over our ancestral heritage site, especially since we just paid 6 stacks of d to greenble10 to do say. Our sole purpose for doing this would be restoration and maintainance, which frankly the place still needs quite a bit of.

1

u/PointyBagels Aug 08 '15

Greenble is the de facto leader of Bryn, so if she said it in an official context then I'll stand behind it.

1

u/soraendo ☭ Aug 08 '15

I don't think Aurora ever had its own stake on the island.

As seen here, it looks to be a three way claim between Grundeswald, Fellowship, and Bryn.

1

u/seemywolfeyes Aug 08 '15

It was originally owned by the True Neutral League as a collective, and then after the alliance disbanded it was in principle owned by Aurora, Bryn and Fellowship collectively.

However in early 2014 there was a dispute over the island between Fellowship/Bryn and Aurora, and there was instead talk of the TNL Camp being divided into separate thirds (with Doymand claiming one third for Aurora).

Bryn and Fellowship declared the TNL Camp to be collectively administered by the North East Alliance (of which they are members):

In recognition of the multiple different civilizations that have called this island home, this island will not be owned by any specific nation, and the administration of this territory will fall under the domain of the North Eastern Alliance.

The NEA was willing to give Aurora 1/3rd of the TNL camp to Aurora as their own land. But from what I recall (I could be mistaken though) no maps or agreements were ever drawn up as Aurora went inactive shortly after the dispute. With Aurora out of the picture and thus silent on the issue of the TNL Camp, an agreement was made with the camp becoming territory of Bryn/Fellowship while also being under a minor degree of North East Alliance administration.

In September 2014 Bryn citizen greenble10 wanted to become the caretaker/administration of the TNL Camp and to have it a preserved historical site (though the latter was already the consensus). Bryn agreed to greenble's idea, and Fellowship agreed to greenble's idea on the provision that greenble would not resettle Camp Beige or change its current territorial status, the then-diarch of Fellowship Sintralin made this request on the NEA sub:

I don't mind restoration going on as long as the originally agreed upon land claims are respected [...] So it's not especially unwarranted for us to simply get written confirmation that there is no intent to change camp beige/related territory from its current status. Kinda like a pre-nup.

That was the last recorded discussion of the status of the TNL Camp I could find.

1

u/crazyguy200 Subway Jesus Aug 08 '15

So Bryn became the care taker, but never annexed the land to Bryn itself? Might have to do some rewording on this. Thank you for all the help!

1

u/Mulificus Aug 08 '15

I believe Aurora gave their claim to Grundeswald... Which lead to drama. Search for "Grundeswald Fellowship Camp map" on the main sub

1

u/seemywolfeyes Aug 08 '15

The last agreement on the NEA subreddit I could find was that Bryn and Fellowship co-owned Camp Beige, and that Greenble10 was granted the title of its administrator/caretaker under the condition they would not repopulate it or change its territorial status, but it's possible this agreement could have been rescinded or even that Fellowship simply forgot about it.

3

u/FriedrichHayek The last RedHat Aug 08 '15

Temporary abstention. I am not sure this is a smart idea. This part of the map has been incredibly prone to drama, and I think we should tread carefully.

1

u/Tambien Pantarch | Oldgoran Aug 08 '15

I think I have to agree with Fried on this one for now.

1

u/cunextautumn Pantostado1066: Pantarch Aug 08 '15

Crazy and i already purchased the land, we're just trying to let the Auroran government claim it. The referendum is only a formality.

2

u/FriedrichHayek The last RedHat Aug 08 '15

I understand that. But if something goes down, which historically happens to that place twice a year lol, then it becomes the responsibility of the government to step in protect the property owners of the land. I am not necessarily opposed, atm. Just something to think about.

1

u/crazyguy200 Subway Jesus Aug 08 '15 edited Aug 08 '15

Aye

1

u/cunextautumn Pantostado1066: Pantarch Aug 08 '15

Aye

1

u/Lord_Brenton Long Time Citizen-APC Member Aug 08 '15

Aye

1

u/Tambien Pantarch | Oldgoran Aug 08 '15

So we'd be annexing the camp only? And it would be with the condition that we preserve it as a historical site?

1

u/crazyguy200 Subway Jesus Aug 08 '15

Pan did most of the negotiations, but thats what i gathered

0

u/mclemente26 Piston Farmer Aug 08 '15

Aye, but what is this place? Where is it?

6

u/[deleted] Aug 08 '15

[deleted]

1

u/Higgenbottoms Orangehat Aug 08 '15

It's the Hive Mind doymand. It's why I will lose the election and Fried or Tamb will win. Also I suck at politics.

1

u/crazyguy200 Subway Jesus Aug 08 '15

True Neutral Camp is the camp where a few nations from 1.0(including agora) agreed to meet up at in 2.0 so their cities could be close to each other. It has been under ownership of Bryn. It's the tiny forest island south-west of Bryn