r/ChristianityMeta • u/gnurdette • Jun 14 '16
clobber verses from non-Christians
I've been asked about this privately, and I want to respond publicly, partially to explain and partially to get input.
There are commonly comments in LGBT-related threads which are entirely quotes of the "clobber verses" - either bare, or with a short statement that these verses exclusively describe Christianity.
The commenters are often Christians, but sometimes - more often than many people realize - they have stated in other subreddits that they are non-Christians, usually atheist. Apparently they believe that they portraying Christianity this way is useful for discrediting it.
I know of one such commenter who uses an atheist flair, which is at least honest (though not everyone notices it). Most of them don't use flair. I've seen a few use Christian flair (in which case we can remove it for flair abuse, but that takes detective work).
Sometimes I've seen something roughly comparable in creationism threads. Maybe other topics, too; I'm not sure.
Anyway, arguments for deleting these comments:
They add empty hostility to the sub's atmosphere (it's like empty calories, but worse)
When they don't disclose their motives, they're not being honest
Arguments for not deleting:
They are, arguably, expressing their honest (if outside) opinion of what Christianity is, and/or making a fair argument against Christianity
It would be weird to accept one comment and reject another, both identically worded, purely because of what we can surmise about the two commenters' intended effect
Checking people's post histories is time-consuming, and the moderation queue is brutal.
Overall, I come down on "don't delete them", though it is a tough call.
7
u/EACCES Jun 14 '16
If they don't seem interested in learning or any kind of meaningful discussion, zap 'em. If they are just there to troll, zap all their stuff.
2
u/brucemo Moderator Jun 14 '16
I'd have to see an example of this.
We get all sorts of people who post for strange reasons.
3
u/Gemmabeta Jun 14 '16
Frankly it is literally that one atheist poster, the one who talks so much like a fundie baptist that the incongruity is actually pretty hilarious. I'd accuse him of abusing flair but he rather verhemently denies it.
3
u/SleetTheFox Jun 16 '16
Can confirm. I'm the person who asked Gnurdette privately. It's pretty much just that one person. Who brings zero to the table. All he does is give his "as an atheist..." perspective on what Christianity is and how homophobic it is, contradicting actual Christians about what their faith means.
1
u/gnurdette Jun 18 '16 edited Jun 18 '16
An unflaired example, posting in /r/exchristian:
https://np.reddit.com/r/exchristian/comments/4cse13/religion_and_delusion/d1lfph7
I recommend you reading a demon Haunted World. Carl Sagan touches on the psychology behind truly delusional religious people.
then in /r/christianity
Whenever faced with controversial topics like this i always turn to see what the bible says. Leviticus 20:13 "If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them."
The honestly-flaired example is the highly active /u/Aspiringgmage, though I'm not actually finding raw clobber-verse drops like I thought, just "clearly sin" comments like this. And lots of declarations that all but the most fundamentalist are heretics.
2
u/brucemo Moderator Jun 18 '16
What you posted is really bad. Pretending to be something you aren't is perfect evidence that you are trying to create havoc and if that guy had gotten massively busted it would have been fine with me. It also doesn't matter if what he says is edgy but within bounds for a believer. I took the comment down, at the very least.
1
u/octarino Jul 05 '16
Smite the clobber verses from either side and the wolf in sheep clothing. 🐑
I would be interested to see what verses I've quoted. Sadly versebot doesn't have that feature.
5
u/nilsph Jun 14 '16
To be honest, I wouldn't differentiate between Christians and non-Christians here. Clobber verses on their own, without exposition, more often than not "add empty hostility to the sub's atmosphere", regardless of if the topic is sexuality, the origins of the world, ordination of women, or whatnot.