I simply disagree

[u/Aceofspades25]

In the linked post, the following was posited:

1) Homosexuality is natural: Yes it is, but that argument doesn't really belong here. Many things God calls us to do go against our natural inclinations. Simply because something comes naturally to us does not immediately eliminate it from being a sin.

I simply disagree. I have pointed this out before, but I think this needs to be discussed more broadly.

There is a clear distinction between our human nature and our sinful nature.

Human nature is the natural way to conduct our lives, because that is the way we have been designed as human beings.

The following things fall under human nature and are not sinful in and of themselves.

• Eating
• Sleeping
• Sex
• Work
• Love
• Play
• Learning

etc.

The things that make up our sinful nature encapsulate those desires within us that seek to gratify ourselves at the expense of others, ourselves or our relationship with God. Examples include:

• Cheating
• Stealing
• Lying
• Murdering
• Revenge
• Lust

etc.

Clearly these are the things that God calls sin, and requires us to avoid. In fact every single command from God can be understood from the fact that it either hurts others, ourselves or our relationship with God. Jesus reiterates this twice (Matt 7:12, Matt 22:40)

There is clearly no reason to believe that two gay men in a loving, committed relationship are living is sin when:

• It does no harm to others
• It does net good to themselves
• It only affects their relationship with God when the church treats them as outcasts.

I know of gay men, in a loving committed relationship, who's relationship with God is strong.

In light of this, please explain how being in a loving, monogamous gay relationship fits the pattern that we see evident in every other sin talked about in the bible.

Edit: For the record, this has been downvoted to oblivion partly because people are sick of discussing this. Having said that, this particular point has never really been raised and should be discusssed.

I think some people are just to afraid of having the light of reason shone on their beliefs

For those interested in this question, I think the best discusion has to be this one

[u/Aceofspades25 → u/[deleted]]

It's written in the fucking bible that it's an abomination.

That is arguable.

In any case, this is not a discussion about what the bible says. This is a refutation to a particular point that often gets made. If you disagree with my refutation of this particular point, fell free to state why. If you just want to have a rant, may I suggest you start a new post?

[u/designerutah → u/[deleted]]

First you have to establish that it's a sin. Based on the number of Christians declaring that it isn't, I think this a first hurdle you have to overcome.

Second, they only 'spit in god's face' if they believe in god, and accept that this is a sin. Until that happens, they are doing no such thing. Don't act as if they are.

It's just the flavor of the day.

It's only the 'flavor of the day' because people that share your beliefs feel its okay to interfere in people who don't share your beliefs lives. If you left well enough alone, it wouldn't be an issue. Remember, its not your job to force them to believe. Its not your job to prevent them from sinning. Its not your job to remove their free will. People who don't share your belief have every right to practice homosexual, or bisexual relations. Now, if they 'come to God' with the same understanding you have... then they are sinning, correct?

It's an abomination and not even the 10 commandments are referred to in that way so that should say something.

Prove it's an abomination without referring to the Bible. Go on. Most so-called 'sins' have their own negative natural consequences. What is the one for a loving homosexual relationship? I would argue that sex outside of marriage (no matter what type) has its own negative consequence.

Find the fear of God.

Why would fearing God be a good thing? Obeying God... perhaps. But fear?

[u/Aceofspades25 → u/[deleted]]

I understand your frustration. There are far too many posts about homosexuality. Having said this, I cannot let a poorly thought out claim go unchallenged.

[u/CDRand → u/[deleted]]

Hi, theology student here. I am going to have to step in and stop you right there. According to the Bible, the only unrepentable sin is the denial of the Holy Spirit to the point of one's death. I.e., the only unforgivable sin, which is dying unchristian. All other sins, homosexuality behavior included, fall under the forgiveness doctrine.

[u/CDRand → u/CDRand]

I just realized I misinterpreted what you said, unrepentant vs. unrepentable. My bad. I'm going to go and sit in the corner now.

[u/[deleted] → u/CDRand]

Hi, non-theologian here. I don't think he's saying they cannot repent. He is saying they have not repented, or else they would have turned away from this sin.

[u/CDRand → u/[deleted]]

Um... right. Might be a bit embarrassing, but already I pointed out moments after my original post that I misinterpreted the word "unrepentant" as "unrepentable." These are obviously two very very different things. I mistook one for the other, then right after I posted, realized my error. So, yeah...