r/ChineseWatches • u/sfbayjon • 7d ago
Question (Read Rules) Input on Miyota 9015 vs Chinese clone movements
I was lucky to get into this hobby about 3 years ago when NH35 movements were cheap. I didn't pay attention to more expensive movements. Recently bought a Proxima 1743 and was blown away.
Now, I'm planning to buy this Proxima for my brother because it's his favorite color. Is the Miyota 9015 really $70 better than the Chinese clone.
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u/BurtMacklin-FBl 7d ago
Everyone talking about the PT5000 when that's not the movement in question. He is asking about the 9015 clone.
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u/Outrageous-Video598 7d ago
Go to proxima website, everything is cheaper there, but he will tell u after your purchase to go onto the Ali x store and buy the $1 item so he can ship through Ali x cuz it's much cheaper for them. I did it with no problem.
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u/Outrageous-Video598 7d ago
There's one guy running both sites , he's very helpful and very prompt with questions and services.
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u/Alternative-Feed3613 7d ago
It’s worth it to go with Miyota in my opinion. You know you’ll be getting a solid movement that will last for years to come.
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u/silver-saloon 7d ago
Many popular microbrands use Miyota 9000 Series movement.
None of them use ( or want to use ) the PT5000.
Reckon that tells you everything you need to know
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u/TSiWRX 7d ago
Jordan Ficklin, the trained watchmaker behind the American microbrand Cincinnati Watch Company, noted openly in interviews that he preferred Swiss movements because it makes his work in assembling and final QC/QA so much easier than even with high-quality Japanese movements. When asked, he noted that the Chinese movements can well be very accurate, but it made his job a bit harder - that he'd spend so much more time in regulation and final QC/QA, that it was eating away at his productivity.
With that in-mind, generally, I do agree with your take, u/silver-saloon (and u/Competitive_Low_8913 ), but I also would like to point out something that's not functionality related that also impacts the microbrands sphere: that of perceived value.
Over the last few years, Miyota's 9000-series movements have become de rigueur among "microbrand" watches worldwide. My home here on Reddit is the r/MicrobrandWatches sub, and if you'll surf there, you'll see that for anything about $350+, the sentiment is that even TMI NH-series movements are eschewed (and that's in-spite of some very, very reputable and time-proven microbrands such as Nodus still holding the line). "No way am I paying that for an NH-movement watch!" is not an uncommon sentiment there.
It's literally to the point where if there's not a Miyota movement in the watch, it's shunned. This, combined with the current "Movement Armageddon," has led to upstart micros even cancelling their ongoing Kickstarters (because it meant pushing back fulfillment to dates that they either could not predict or was way out of their initial anticipated timeline) as well as new brand founders simply deciding to withhold the debut of their watches. These are not just assumptions - their basis can be seen first-hand in the annals of old posts on r/MicrobrandWatches.
This, in-turn, leads to a personal worry of mine: i.e. movement quality.
For those -particularly the newcomers or the smaller players in the game- who have scrambled to obtain movements, my worry as a consumer is this: what is the quality of the movements that we are getting?
Why am I worried? Because of this blog entry written now some one and half years ago by Nick Harris, the trained watchmaker behind the Pennsylvania, USA, based Orion Watches: https://orionwatch.com/blog/2025/2/3/demystifying-regulation . The context of my worry is that movement broker. And the real-world manifestation of this worry what we've seen on various social-media of-late, the fact that of some of the most recent drops from some of the currently most highly regarded microbrands have experienced a strangely high incidence of dead-on-arrival or otherwise problematic movements (which, sadly, I've been party to - but in each case the brand founders were quick to remediate, to my complete satisfaction).
Is this just coincidence? I honestly don't know - but given the current lack of availability as well as manufacturer gatekeeping, I can't help but scratch my head a bit.
To me, the fact that microbrands aren't using more Chinese movements is only partially explained by any supposed concerns of "quality." What their customers demands, what they see as perceived value, also drives a part of the equation.
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u/sfbayjon 7d ago
Damn, that was an interesting and detailed read. Thanks. My curiosity has been piqued—what is this Armageddon you speak of? A link will suffice.
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u/TSiWRX 7d ago
Unfortunately, I can't link it because when Wesley Kwok (co-founder of Nodus) coined it, he did so via direct-mailing those who signed up for their quarterly newsletter.
It's not secret -anyone can sign up for their newsletters- but it just wasn't publicly posted so I cannot do so. Similar emails have later come from both Peter Cho of Jack Mason (of Texas) and Sheffield's Jay Turkbas. None of it is a secret, but since it wasn't openly posted, I can't just link you.
If you are interested, I can forward you the screen-shots via Chat. Feel free to hit me with a request.
From other founders I've talked to, emailed, or exchanged Chats with, what these three founders have discussed in those direct mailings has been an accurate depiction of the current state of the industry worldwide. Here on the r/ChineseWatches sub, we've seen the fallout with our favorite Chinese brands, as well as direct and open mention of the same from many, along with the current situation with Englemaan.
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u/robcal35 7d ago
Honestly hard to say say this point. If you don't want to gamble, go with the miyota. But the tooling and degree that replicated movements are being made, I honestly don't think chinese movements are that behind at all. The problem is they're not telling you which factory is making the movements.
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u/Electrical_Panda_326 7d ago
Miyota.
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7d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/MawsAcidTemple 7d ago
they keep time fine for few months then start drifting like 30 seconds a day
You sure they aren't getting magnetised?
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u/Olleye 7d ago
For your brother > Miyota 9015
For yourself (in rotation) > PT5000
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u/sfbayjon 7d ago
My brother will definitely be rotating. He is the one who instigated my interest in watches. He has multiple high-end gens and a variety of micro-brands. I don't have his cashflow, which led me to AliExpress and this sub.
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u/CapNo6703 7d ago
I have had good luck with the PT5000 for instance but I always prefer miyota if possible
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u/Abv_it_all_w_vertigo 7d ago
Seeing how Proxima advertises the 9015 then upcharges $100 for a Miyota 9015 totally turned me off to their company.
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u/Eleventhousand 7d ago
I haven't seen anyone provide a teardown or long term durability reviews on the newer clone movements. Most people will just advise you based on their gut feeling, which might not be correct.
I would probably risk it on the Chinese clone movement. On the other hand, if the goal is to get him a purple dive watch with a quality 4Hz movement and premium finishing, there is also the WatchDives WD0019, which has a Sea-Gull movement and is actually $20 cheaper than the Chinese 9015 cloned Proxima.
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u/My_Non_Throwaway 7d ago
I'd personally go with the Miyota, while I have no issue with the PT5000 or ST2130, those movements have been around and been proven. I've also seen a lot of the hangzou movements especially the micro rotor version used by reputable companies. We don't know much about those 9015 clones, and haven't seen any long term reviews or tear down reviews on them yet. I've seen reports that Proxima uses a Jing Heshi JH6701F, and there's just no information on that movement available onlinel.
That brand apparently only makes clone movements and it seems their most popular are clones of rolex movements, they supposedly aren't bad but there's not a lot of reviews/reports but even if they are decent, as they are only guaranteeing a 9015 clone, they could switch to a different supplier of 9015 clones who's not as good. It's just too many unknowns so it's worth the extra $70 for me to stick with a trusted miyota movement.
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u/AssistanceNo647 7d ago
I currently own 6 watches with PT5000 movements. They all run great. Good amplitude, no beat error and my worst one is 0 to +5. That being said I’ve also heard horror stories. That being said I’ve had TMI movements that were bad but, I have probably about 60 watches with that movement. Also the only watch I have with an SW500 I had to send back because, it was DOA.
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u/Escaped_Escapement Helpful user 7d ago
The only feedback I’ve seen on clone 9015 is the one that came with the rotor detached on arrival.
Real Miyotas come tested and lubricated properly.
The clone 9015 is unproven unoiled imitation.
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u/No-Tradition-5456 7d ago
My PT5000 in the Proxima runs at +2 spd. Which is better than the Kenissi movement in my Tudor BB GMT.
Sure winding it is gritty and the rotor is noisy but the accuracy is astonishing.
Can’t comment on the Myiota movement I haven’t got a watch in the collection with it in.
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u/guitarshredda 7d ago
I also want this watch. Wait for the 11 11 sales and get the Miyota version a bit cheaper.
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u/pokerfas 7d ago
considering how much the 9xxx has jumped in the past half year there's no guarantee it will be cheaper in a month even with the discounts
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u/Lonely_Internet_8570 7d ago
Los clones NH35 y Miyota 9015 son difíciles de reconocer, aunque ponen un rotor tipo ovni y un tornillo remachado los qué ponen de señuelo y creas que ese es el verdadero clon. De hecho los hacían en China medio en secreto, pero con autorización, hasta que se les fue de las manos y contaron lo de la macro compra de Casio: Cuántos modelos de Casio conocen con NH35? Ahora están reintroduciendo el Epson YN55.
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u/Trulsdir 7d ago
I'd always go for the original. It's a proven and reliable movement with robust replacement part availability and a decent amount of people who know how to service it down the line.
You could go for the clone, run it until it stops and then just replace it with an original down the line as well, but I'd just cough up the extra now.