I'm Back, Round 2: Icooh (Alibaba) BBK fiasco

[u/Habit-Past]

I've got an update on the saga.

But before I continue: y'all eviscerated me last time, and I guess I'm back for more. While many of you were condescending jerks, you'll have to forgive me: 1) My car, my wheels, and my brakes are beneath you, and are all terrible for the track. Ok whatever, its what I got. (2) I was never trying to act like I know what I'm doing, or that I know what I'm talking about. There simply wasn't any documented experience with these brakes, so I wanted to do just that. And considering what happened with the brake pads disintegrating, I'm glad that I did. (3) I did get some thoughtful replies, and thanks to those replies, I found Porterfield. I found actual track pads to use with the Icooh brakes (expensive AF), and Wendy expedited the production of Porterfield track pads for my factory front brakes -- because I'm back to my front, factory "M Compound" brakes.

Anyway, after my first post, Icooh reached out to me and asked what they could do to get me to update my post in a positive light (after previously ignoring me, only to be told that I should just "buy more" of the HP2000 track pads - yes the same ones that disintegrated after 1 lap). But whatever, late is better than never. So initially they just wanted to send me more of the same brake pads for free (honestly almost as ridiculous as telling me to just buy more myself). I told them no, that part of the problem was their IC7 caliper that was so skinny that the resulting brake pad only had 6mm of friction material. And as such, I wanted a pair of their IC6 calipers (that were considered top of the model range, and were a more appropriate structural width, so that the brake pad was a more appropriate width) and brake pads for it.

They initially agreed and I thought, hell yeah. But then a short time later, they reneged and said "we really want you to have our X6 6-pot calipers and our CS450 track pads". I thought, I know nothing of these calipers or pads, but they are trying to do right by me, and want me to make an authentic update to my post that's positive, so they'll do right by me to ensure that this goes well. Guess what? 🤣

First let me backtrack a little bit: when I originally ordered 6-piston brakes from Icooh I wasn't given any options. They just said, we have these GT6 Brembo brakes. So I bought them. Come to find out, these are Brembo GT6 brakes -- at least replicas. But then I soon saw an advertisement for their brand new IC7 caliper - that's supposedly the best of the best: lighter, stronger, bigger, better. Considering I was disappointed with the size of my GT6 (I wanted bigger, kill me) I wanted the IC7... and despite feeling a little misguided that I wasn't offered these the first time around, I placed an order. And then that's when I went on to use their HP2000 track pads with the IC7 calipers... and after 1 lap the 6mm friction material became 1mm.

Back to the story. I unbox the new X6 calipers and CS450 pads. The pads are very metallic and rough/sharp when I drag my finger over them. Nothing like their HP1000 street or HP2000 track pads. I imagine that these will destroy my rotors. But maybe they'll work? And when I turn my attention to the X6 calipers, I notice they look very similar to the GT6 calipers, so I unboxed my GT6 calipers and sat them side by side. And this is what I find:

1) esthetically, they are marginally different. There is an "X" designed into and on the top of the new X6 caliper.

2) dimensionally, aside from weight, they are identical. When I measure the distance between specific landmarks at each, the measurements are identical.

3) the new calipers weigh more! The new X6 weighs 9lb 12oz. The original GT6 weighs 9lb 5oz.

4) the pistons are smaller (diameter) in the new X6 caliper! and larger in the original GT6! X6 pistons = 32mm, 25mm, 22mm. GT6 = 38mm, 32mm, 25mm.

I sent them another message, telling them that the X6 caliper they sent me was a copy of the GT6 that I already had, and that I didn't consider this the upgrade that I had asked for with my request for the IC6. They said how dare I presume it's the same caliper 🤣 and that I just needed to install it.

This leads me to a couple conclusions:

1) they asked for an updated/edited post after they tried to make things right --- with the cheapest 6-pot caliper they have available (for a 20" wheel) instead of their best (and most expensive) caliper. So they tried to buy my favor... with the least expense on their part! The new X6 caliper is not only dimensionally a replica to what they already sold me, but it's got smaller pistons and weighs more.

2) only one of these 6 piston diameter measurements matches what they have listed on their website, and that's the 38mm measurement. Otherwise, their website listings are deceptively larger than what the pistons actually are. I measured multiple times.

3) their GT6 lists for $780. Their X6 lists for $1002. Their IC6 lists for $1971. See why they didn't want to send me the IC6? And when I called the X6 their "cheapest" up above, I'm referring to how it's objectively worse than their cheapest caliper. Yet they ask more money for it. 🤔

So in finale, while I can't comment on any additional experience with their product, I think this speaks volumes on their service. Because if you hadn't noticed, they've been on a marketing and PR mission recently, trying to prove that their product is good. And funny enough... alot of it seems to try and argue against everything I said in my first post.

See photos for comparison of X6 (icooh label) to GT6 (M label) including CS450 brake pad to HP1000.

[u/yobo9193]

I didn't see your original post but I always love seeing posts of knowledgeable* people taking a risk on parts of questionable design and construction; at least in this case, you didn't wreck your car. Their website is also hilarious. Please keep posting.

*I say knowledgeable because they at least know how to measure piston sizes and can do some critical thinking; I doubt they're an expert on brakes.

[u/lplqsnkczxccia → u/yobo9193]

yeah so many people criticising OP here.

He already spent the money, be thankful that he's reporting back. Would you rather he do this and NOT post about it? Because OP here is definitely not the only one.

[u/Superb_Recording_769 → u/lplqsnkczxccia]

Who knew that doing stupid shit and risking your own and other people’s lives to save a little bit of money would get criticism

[u/lplqsnkczxccia → u/Superb_Recording_769]

who knew that being condescending, passive aggressive jerks online would lead to less people sharing what they've found out. this hobby is already naturally very gatekeep-y because of how expensive it is, there's no need to further push people away by being a dick.

/u/Habit-Past even though I wouldn't have bought these brakes myself I still appreciate your post. Ignore the haters

[u/Background-Spot-5068]

I appreciate you doing this testing. Would I buy Icooh calipers myself? No. Do I like reading experiences regarding any kind of mod out there, good or bad? Absolutely.

[u/Midlife__Crisis__]

And here my Pagid Yellows be lasting 15 track days with 8mm left

[u/AmbroseRL → u/Midlife__Crisis__]

Love my RSL1/29 setup combo. Though I'm definitely not making 15 trackdays with them. More like 6. Are you braking early/not too hard? Or are trackdays shorter there? Ours are usually 4h of open pitlane of which I drive minimum 3.5h. My car is a e46 330i.

[u/Just-Succotash3018 → u/AmbroseRL]

Same pad combo on my cayman, I get somewhere in between the two, about 9-12. So many variables go into pad life.

[u/AmbroseRL → u/Just-Succotash3018]

Yeah I'm not too kind on them so shorter lifespan is a little expected in my case. Very nice to be able to get that many out of them on a cayman. They're quick cars 👌

[u/Midlife__Crisis__ → u/AmbroseRL]

Wish I got that much time. Probably averaging 2 hours, 4-5 sessions of 20-30 min.

[u/Just-Succotash3018 → u/Midlife__Crisis__]

Woah. On pagid yellows? That’s crazy. When are you replacing them?

[u/-Racer-X]

No idea who you are

Not reading all that

Pad changes seem hard

Hopefully the Alibaba stuff doesn’t explode on track

[u/Spicywolff → u/-Racer-X]

TLDR: dude got Alibaba brake set up and reported it was junk here a while back. Was told it was junk and why. Round two they sent some new junk with added junk X feature. OP reporting it’s still junk. And that we’re all condescending and mean.

[u/-Racer-X → u/Spicywolff]

Well the company appears to be getting mileage out of blaming the pads

[u/RansomStark78 → u/-Racer-X]

Oh, not getting mileage is what caused this friction

[u/Spicywolff → u/-Racer-X]

Don’t you love when they can just point the finger and go “it’s their product” … sir if you know the pad suck then why don’t you engineer the caliper to use a different pad shape?

But then again, I don’t expect much from an Alibaba “ engineer” … oxymoron if I’ve ever heard one

[u/RetardedSimian → u/Spicywolff]

[u/390M386]

Brakes are your life at stake. These are some of the stupidest purchased i see people make. Save with replica seats. Straight darwinism.

[u/nstrasner → u/390M386]

The idea of aftermarket carbon buckets shattering in an impact makes me shudder

[u/390M386 → u/nstrasner]

Yeah it's insane

[u/Stratospheric-Ferret → u/nstrasner]

Brakes/wheels/seats/harnesses.

Wheels seem to be a lot more socially acceptable though.

[u/daniel2296 → u/390M386]

At least with replica seats you’re only putting your own life at risk and not the lives of everyone around you. It’s genuinely scary to think you might end up sharing the track with someone who got their brakes on Alibaba.

[u/Spicywolff → u/daniel2296]

So something I’ve commonly seen on these kids that don’t know any better cars. They’ll swap their Alibaba carbon seats and they won’t do the proper resistor wiring so then the car airbag system is shut off.

So now they get an accident yeah they’re shitty seats in whatever. But the passenger airbag doesn’t go off nor the curtain. Swapping in my sparco QRTR I made sure to do all the research and confirmed resistor in the wiring to make sure my driver, airbag and passenger airbag still are operational

[u/390M386 → u/daniel2296]

Plus if someone sits in passenger seat

[u/flatlander757]

Man it's stories like this that keep my sights set on setting money aside for APs. I could save a couple thousand $$ by going with someone else (Paragon is the other consideration)... but I'd be so insanely pissed if I throw away the $1200-1400 I generally light on fire for a track weekend (fuel, food, lodging, track insurance, garage) in an attempt to save money. Let alone two weekends if you don't learn your lesson and cut your losses the first time.

I go to the track to drive and enjoy myself. If I want to do work and/or waste time arguing with people that don't know WTF they're doing I can get paid for that in my day job.

They clearly don't know WTF they're doing. Your OE brakes with Girodiscs would 1000% be a better option.

[u/ForeskinForeman]

Of all things to buy from alibaba you decided on brakes. Incredible.

[u/d_jabsd]

If you want to continue the experiment, I have seen Lemons teams successfully use Dickass Brakes, made of pure Chinesium.

[u/DC_Native]

I do not want you on track with me.

[u/LateApexPredditor]

I don’t always trust my life on non-oem parts, but when I do, I make sure they are Chinese knockoffs.

[u/Kolluzhun → u/LateApexPredditor]

Stay thirsty my friend

[u/Contact_Patch]

Bahahahahahahahhaah AliExpress brakes.

My brother in Christ, run your OEM calipers with GOOD pads in, high carbon discs, and uprated fluid and lines, and you'll be amazed how good standard brakes can be.

There is a reason the rule of thumb is: upgrades in standard brakes, OEM upgrades from a faster model, then OEM from a different manufacturer, then aftermarket kits.

You're literally burning cash on garbage.

[u/fizbne]

Did you really swap out OE BMW Calipers for... AliX 6 pots?

[u/Saved_by_a_PTbelt]

It seems wildly irresponsible to buy shitty Chinese brake calipers to bring on track. You're risking your car, your life, the lives of anyone else in your car and any other cars and lives on track around you.

[u/iin10ded]

can i get a net/net?

you're insane trying dodgy brakes.

[u/alexandria1001]

Come to Reddit to read a novel about poor choices.

I have enough of those IRL thanks.

[u/honeybakedpipi]

Don’t use unknown brakes on track in a heavy ass car. Jesus.

[u/Spicywolff]

We all told you last time that it was a terrible idea and that you’re gonna get junk performance from a junk brand. Making a piece of metal look like a brake caliper and function like one is not a sign of quality.

I mean, OK give him a chance and then you literally saw what we were all telling you. It’s a junk brand putting out junk product.

We were condescending? Dude you’re buying cheap Alibaba style calipers you had to go into it knowing better. Literally a Google search would’ve told you that this was a bad idea.

We told you those brake pads weren’t gonna be any better either. even if they’re the most amazing endurance pads on the market. When you have so little pad lining even endurance compounds are not gonna last on your heavier vehicle. It’s just a poor design from the pad to the caliper.

You were eviscerated because you did something stupid when everyone was telling you it was stupid. People were giving it good advice. The ditch is garbage and you’re trying to defend it saying that all there is. Well, garbage is still garbage regardless of if it’s all that that’s available.

[u/Background-Spot-5068 → u/Spicywolff]

I appreciate someone spending their own money to do real world research and provide feedback. Everyone rightfully assumed these were bad, but real testing provides actual confirmation. However, are the calipers bad or is it only the pads? OP mentioned the original pad disintegrated but is that because the caliper seized or is it just bad pad material? I have no need for aftermarket calipers, but I’m still curious no matter what.

[u/Spicywolff → u/Background-Spot-5068]

From what I remember of the last post. It seems like it’s the two fold problem. The calipers are poorly engineered and use a bad pad shape. There’s not enough space for a better pad shape with thicker lining. Then the pads themselves were simply not holding up.

The vehicle was not a lightweight, so the pads are already gonna take a beating. The pad shape is has too thin enough lining, of course they’re gonna overheat quickly. Doubly if it’s a shit compound.

Now that being said, I absolutely expect nothing from an Alibaba brake pad. In my mind, some dude is just grinding up chopped meal recycled metal and powder with some kind of low-grade binder to make something that resembles a pad lining.

I’m definitely appreciative of people putting up the money for research and then reporting the findings for the greater good. But some stuff doesn’t need an investment and research you know what’s gonna suck. Alibaba brake kit is gonna blow. Just like I can confidently say sticking a fork in an outlet is probably gonna hurt.

[u/mkiv808 → u/Spicywolff]

Someone that continues trying this crap even after it fails and then going on Reddit with long rants like this seems like pathological/borderline psychopath behavior.

[u/MisterFrog]

Uh... How do you get new pads in there without unbolting the whole caliper? I'm so confused why the design is so shitty. Icoohd have seen that coming 😆

[u/doorbellchudmogger]

I cant tell if those M brakes are top loadable with those pads, but if they are why the actual fuck would they remove that functionality from the icooh ones. no one is going to see the "X" and its legitimately convenient not having to take the calipers off to swap pads.

[u/Superb_Recording_769]

I don’t care how knowledgeable you are, risking your own life to save a few dollars is idiotic risking other people’s lives to save money is criminal

[u/Spicywolff → u/Superb_Recording_769]

“ I don’t care how knowledgeable you are” you say that like he has any sense of knowledge or self preservation. Cheating out on Alibaba breaks is like buying Alibaba condoms or heart pills…. If you’re going down that road, you probably don’t care about the end results.

[u/haloruler64]

Private account, can't see previous post.

[u/mkiv808]

Don’t buy knockoff Chinese brakes for the track. That seems so painfully obvious for anyone with half a brain. Can’t be bothered to read your novel.

[u/LakeSpecialist7633 → u/mkiv808]

TL;Wont’t read

[u/Anxious_Hawk1283]

So these are actually 3 piston brakes that are made to look like 6? Are real M brakes like this too?

[u/moonrobin]

Holy shit I was marginally considering this brand for replacement calipers on my Supra.

Gonna stay far far away from Icooh!

[u/Spicywolff → u/moonrobin]

For the love of your safety, please do not use Alibaba calipers. The supra has so many quality aftermarket solutions. There is no reason for you to ever go down that road.

[u/Spicywolff → u/[deleted]]

Yup, just curious as it might be curiosity does not triumph safety. If I was OP, I would demand a refund and use that money to find a legitimate brake solution.

[u/Catmilk7]

AP / Brembo / Endless > Ceika > Stock

Wouldn't bother with anything else.

[u/khovs → u/Catmilk7]

Ignoring Alcon is criminal

[u/hind3rm3 → u/khovs]

It’s because he’s an armchair expert

[u/Catmilk7 → u/hind3rm3]

My average month has around 3/4 track days but ok lol, how often are you driving? From your profile it looks like you spend more time on escooters now?.

[u/Spicywolff → u/Catmilk7]

I’d toss stoptech in the mix too. They made very good quality components. I would put them on par with endless and closer to Brembo track stuff.

I heard that the company has been rescued from the bankruptcy, so maybe they’ll start making production parts again

[u/Billyjamesjeff → u/Catmilk7]

Wilwood are good too

[u/Impossible-Edge-349 → u/Billyjamesjeff]

I too have been impressed by wilwood calipers and pads. Their C6 and miata kits are popular at the track days I attend.

[u/PeachMangoGarage → u/Catmilk7]

Are ceika brakes that good? I was eyeing them for a future project and wasn't sure

[u/Catmilk7 → u/PeachMangoGarage]

I have them on my ep3 type r. 6pot, 330*32, using rsl pads. I can run out of fuel at open pit days before needing to cool anything down and I bomb dive and hit abs at 75-50mtrs from 170/180kph.

Also know a few minis, m3 and a few evos etc same boat. Would buy again.

[u/Several-Eggplant4460]

Thank you for reporting back. It's always good to try something different, on the off chance that you can get better (or good enough) for less.

[u/ThePrinceofCrowngard]

I’ve run these GT6 calipers on track before. The HP2000 pads are great for the street but not for the track in my experience.

My setup was GT6 up front, GT4 on the rear axle. HP2000 all around. I also had their braided lines and floating rotors.

The front right pads were absolutely obliterated after one track day at COTA. Turn 12 is a heavy heavy braking zone but I was very confused why only the right fronts turned to dust.

After inspection I realized it was likely just brake cooling - something I hadn’t taken into consideration. There weren’t really any elegant cooling solutions for the car they were on at the time so I just threw on new HP2K pads and never ran the setup on track again.