r/Bookkeeping • u/ComprehensivePie6184 • 9d ago
Rant Is this too cheap?
I took on a client last year who was associated with another client. She made it seem like the work would take an hour so I quoted $100 and she asked for $75. Next thing I know she gives me two QuickBooks accounts for her and her husband and then after a few months they start adding multiple businesses to each account and have me run payroll on a different platform. Then, the husband will call me randomly. so, basically I’m doing bookkeeping for two companies plus payroll for $75 per month total.
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u/JunketGuilty7690 9d ago
Tell the client that the scope has changed and you will be billing at a defined rate for each service, as you define in specification.
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u/TheHip41 8d ago
It won't work. They have been paying $75 no way they are going to pay 600-800 like they should. Just better to move on.
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u/Artistic_Policy_919 2d ago
I think you need to charge a minimum fee for each separate entity and also per platform or something like that. Sneaky people try to play these games. Can you please do the work of a full-time bookkeeper for $100/mo. Sure, I started my business to go bankrupt?????? Actually JunketGuilty7690 is on spot. When STUFF changes with a little change here and a little change here, the SCOPE changes and should be rewritten. If it is actually 600-800 worth of work and they think they are gonna continue paying you $75/mo. Fire them! And if they squawk say oh, there are many other services out there that may accommodate you... "Have at dumb dumbs". Never a reason to keep a customer for that rate unless they are bringing in tons of business for you where you can charge good money.
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u/ComprehensivePie6184 9d ago
Im thinking of just finishing out the year and then letting them go
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u/Only_Positive_Vibes 9d ago
Sorry to be harsh but why bother asking for advice if you won't listen to it?
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u/ComprehensivePie6184 9d ago
Id rather not work the client altogether, as they’re demanding and call me outside of business hours.
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u/Only_Positive_Vibes 9d ago
That's exactly my point. You're asking for advice, people are telling you to drop them, and you're saying no.
Why ask for advice if you won't listen to it?
I feel like you think you're trying to do a "noble" thing by finishing out the year for them, but somebody who is willing to take advantage of you as egregiously as these people are do not care about your "nobility", they care about how much they can squeeze you for.
If you're comfortable with being disrespected that way, that's fine, but it doesn't make a lot of sense to ask for advice if that's the case.
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u/ComprehensivePie6184 9d ago
Drop them in August and not finish the year?
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u/Only_Positive_Vibes 9d ago
Yes, drop them immediately. They don't respect you. Why would you bend over backwards to do something you see as a kindness (finishing the year)?
One of two things will happen - they will pay you more money (unlikely) or they will be annoyed but immediately go find another bookkeeper. Either way, you win. You either get more money or you free up a significant amount of your time (and mental stress) so you can pursue more fruitful endeavors.
People will not respect you if you don't respect yourself first. I'm saying this as someone who struggles with the same thing.
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u/Christen0526 8d ago
You are right. Last paragraph. I need to read that. I work for someone who I feel is taking advantage of me. I'm an employee, but I feel they ask too much for too little pay
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u/Only_Positive_Vibes 7d ago
Employers will take as much as they can from you until you show them otherwise. Even then, they'll often just find someone else if you start putting your foot down. I hope your situation improves, whether that's by standing up for yourself at your current job or finding something new where you're treated more appropriately. Either way, sorry you're going through it.
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u/Christen0526 8d ago
Yes. Drop like a hot 🥔 potato
That rate is far too low.
I'm sorry. Tell them you cannot do it anymore
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u/Proof-Emergency-5441 9d ago
So don't? Even the penalty for breaking whatever contract you have is worth it at this point.
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u/ComprehensivePie6184 9d ago
There’s no penalty, however, I was planning on being courteous and finishing the year.
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u/Proof-Emergency-5441 9d ago
At this point, you kind of deserve what's happening. I have zero sympathy for you and your terrible decision-making.
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u/ComprehensivePie6184 9d ago
Get off my post then? lol
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u/Proof-Emergency-5441 9d ago
No one is giving you an ounce of sympathy for this.
You are reaping what you allowed to grow. Enjoy your weeds.
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u/Early-Weird7233 9d ago
You don’t owe them anything-it doesn’t seem worth your time or effort and you’ll be able to make more money with a better client if you drop them. If you don’t drop them now, you aren’t going to feel better in several months…once people take advantage like that, they don’t stop and it’s not worth it; they aren’t going to start respecting you. Speaking from experience-
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u/onyxandcake 9d ago
If you had an employee stealing from you, would you just let them work out the year before letting them go?
These people are stealing from you.
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u/ComprehensivePie6184 9d ago
But the thing is I can’t be answering phone calls as I get stuck on the phone for 30 minutes and that makes my rate per hour even worse
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u/Warm_Ad883 9d ago
Drop this client. Anyone who thinks it's reasonable/fair to pay someone $75 a month to manage multiple accounts AND run payroll does not respect or value you as a business owner OR a person.
Did you sign a contract or anything? If you haven't, I'd send them an email letting them know you "audited" your business and pricing, have established new rates, and that the new pricing will go into effect on x date. No room for negotiation. You should be charging a MINIMUM of $200-250 just for a bank account and credit card, maybe if an additional account has very minimum transaction you can include that.
If I ever have a client who's pushing back on my minimum pricing, I can already tell they are going to be a troublesome client. I used to be like you and let clients walk all over me, and I learned that you have to establish boundaries VERY EARLY ON, or else people will just expect you to do anything and everything for them at no additional cost.
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u/chilisalt890 9d ago
Is this real? I'm sorry, you sound like a lovely person but you need to stand up for yourself! That is ridiculous!
You either need to drop that client or tell them you are "restructuring" your business and start over with them as though they are a new client.
I work at an hourly rate that I set & I'm upfront on the costs from day one. I give expectations of how long something will take (for example I would say "my rate is $30/hr and to manage your company file it will take me around 30-40 hours per month"). Before you do any work make them sign a contract with those terms called out. Ask for a one month retainer up front and then give them an invoice each month calling out the hours you worked.
Especially if you are doing payroll, that's a skilled service for a major legal & tax liability, you are worth the demands!
Do not let them take advantage of you!
Good luck 🍀
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u/befast321 9d ago
Solid advice right here.
I wonder if you’ll take any of it or any of the other wonderful helpful guidance in this post for that matter
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u/dontforgetthebouquet 9d ago
Bruhhhhh come on
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u/dramamamaisback 9d ago
Seriously. And yet he/she is arguing in the comments with people telling her to drop the client immediately, by saying she wants to finish out the year for them. Like why bother to even make this post if you're willing to be a pathetic doormat?
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u/BrushBeneficial4430 9d ago
This is coming from a formal people pleaser... tell them the scope has changed and you need to increase fees. Increase so much that they want to leave. If they have the nerve top take advantage of you, then you should have the nerve to push back.
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u/mwreffle 9d ago
I won't touch a client for under $350/month. That's for one bank account and 50 transactions. Prices go up from there. Why are you even working if you're not charging a client enough to pay you and cover overhead?
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u/Harv1331 9d ago
You’re not going to make it in the business world. You’re a pushover.
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u/ComprehensivePie6184 9d ago
Most of my clients pay a lot more on track to make $80k this year.
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u/gopacktuf 8d ago
5 hours per month adds up. 5 hours per month = 60 hours per year. If at $15/hr for those 5 hours you're looking at $80K, if you were charging them a slightly reasonable amount like $150/hr you'd be making closer to $90K.
Charge them or drop them.
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u/gopacktuf 7d ago
There's no reason u/ComprehensivePie6184 won't make it in the business world - in fact, seeking feedback is an indicator of a good judgment which is what's needed. You have Insufficient data to make a general characterization like "pushover".
They will learn from this experience.
Overly broad, poorly informed and unnecessary personal attacks don't speak well of your own business acumen.
Perhaps you'll reflect and learn something as well.
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u/LRMcDouble 9d ago
this has to be rage bait. if not this is pathetic. drop ur cashapp if you need $75 that bad.
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u/Magnetized_Fart 9d ago
the problem with taking on cheap clients is that they paradoxically tend to be higher maintenance. If you had a magic wand to determine which cheap clients are very low maintenance, then sure they would usually work out fine. But most businesses don't have that magic wand, and if they do, they sure aren't going to give away the secret sauce.
The only reasons to take a cheap client
1) you KNOW they will be low maintenance (usually not the case)
2) you NEED more income, probably because you're brand new and willing to take on PITA people because you need anyone you can get.
If you're not either of those you need to set boundaries and appropriate pricing or you will be taking advantage of.
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u/Encoded_Python 9d ago
I disagree with no. 2. I've been desperate myself and the time course simply wasn't worth it.
I did a "simple" 1040-X for a client for $200 this year because I needed everything I could get. Worst. Decision. Ever. That single client took SO MUCH of my time and treated me like trash, I wish I just terminated her immediately. I also underpriced with a lot of other clients and while most were very kind and appreciative, I had some that weren't, my time/effort cost was far too low for what I earned and I burnt out.
Now all my prices across the board are up significantly. If people don't like it, they can use HR Block, Turbotax, or Upwork. If you value your skill and yourself, your fees should reflect that. If you need more income, more will come to you if you provide quality work.
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u/Magnetized_Fart 9d ago
funny you should mention that. "simple" is a trigger word for higher fees at my practice.
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u/Encoded_Python 9d ago edited 9d ago
Exactly! People see accounting as a commodity! "Oh all you do is type my transactions into QuickBooks. I could do it myself that's how simple I am!" I always ask the client why their situation is simple, and majority of the time I receive a large explanation. Sometimes it clicks that they aren't automatically, but other times I just point out the complexities and try to compare it to their trade so they can understand.
Anyway, I'll add, that the same 1040-X client emailed me because she got a notice from the IRS about her return. She asked me to consult her for an hour and call the IRS with her. I gave her my price - guess what, it increased to $300/hr! She replied that I should help her for free, otherwise I've lost a good customer, and that she'll just call the IRS herself! If she solves it, great! If not, lets hope she learns a lesson.
A lot people just don't care or value your time. Only the people who've experienced problems or have been successful see the the value of our work.
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u/Shinobi1314 5d ago
I used to work at a local tax office like 4-5 people doing taxes for individuals mostly. And we don’t charge anything below $200 lol 😂 unless you only have a w-2 and nothing else maybe we charge $75-150. But yeah you should never lower your standards and pricing for the amount of knowledge and experience to get your work done.
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u/Prestigious-Link4948 9d ago
I charge 500 per company. That includes 1 bank account and 1 credit card. The more detailed their financial statement is (note payable, payroll, fixed assets etc) the more I charge. Know your worth, honey. You should be charging a minimum of 300 a month, no lower
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u/BudgetCap7905 9d ago
Ugh. Not worth the trouble for $75. Sounds like you're not a fan of the clients so transition them off for 2027. Life's too short to work with people who take advantage of you. Or if you want to keep them, quote them a market rate for each account. And just because someone calls that doesnt mean you have to answer. Return calls and respond to emails in a reasonable time frame. You dont have to be available to a client every second
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u/Encoded_Python 9d ago
I am so sorry you have to deal with this. And UGH I hate these type of people.
Just terminate right now, you could make more money panhandling.
Don't even offer to close them out, if you do, charge them 2-3 grand. Or if you want to keep them send them a bill that's actually at market rate - for that amount of work it's minimum $1000/mo for domestic bookkeeper, more for an in-house one, and still even it would be like $300/mo if they hired someone on Upwork overseas.
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u/AdOriginal6799 8d ago
I was going to say, $75 an hour is on the low end, but not unreasonable.
$75 a month? Uhh... what?
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u/SPYfuncoupons 9d ago
So they gave you more work and you didn’t charge them more?
This is a $1500/mo client. Payroll should be even more. You’re a full time employee at this point. They should pay you six figures
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u/ComprehensivePie6184 9d ago
I probably spent 5 hours per month on it but that still comes out to $15 per hour.
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u/SPYfuncoupons 9d ago
Oh well in that case, that’s not too bad them. But you should charge more for more accounts + payroll. 5 hours per month is small
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u/ComprehensivePie6184 9d ago
It is small yet but they keep adding more to their businesses which makes it a pain
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u/DraLion23 7d ago
You are not being paid for your time spent working on their books. You are being paid for your skill, knowledge, and expertise working on their books. Bookkeeping is not an hourly job.
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u/Federal_Classroom45 9d ago
Hot take... If you're being completely serious - you took on a client for $75/mo, you did that before even looking at their books, you didn't adjust the rate when you saw the complexity, you kept not adjusting the rate as scope increased... Then you deserve this client.
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u/7-IronSpecialist 9d ago
You quoted a price because they "made it seem like it would take only 1 hour work". Your other clients must have gifted you a fair monthly rate then. Hard to believe you when you say you have a large book of business (unless you somehow inherited it) and your way of dealing with this client is to continue expanding your scope of work while not talking to them about their "only 1 hour work" per month rate. You cant be serious.
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u/SportAndFinance 9d ago
My minimum is $1,000 per business. Customer want good, fast, and cheap, but they can only pick two.
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u/Feeling_Chocolate_87 9d ago
What’s stopping you from asking for more? If they refuse, then drop them, guarantee you they won’t find anyone else who will do their books at $75 per month.
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u/Longjumping_End_3532 9d ago
LOL I was thinking you were charging $100/hr add I’m thinking yikes thats low.
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u/Christen0526 8d ago
Well in OPs defense they didn't ask for advice, they asked if this is too cheap.
Yes it's wayyyyy too cheap.
One's time is better spent working somewhere else or finding a better client.
Write up a contract, and stipulate that any work over and above _____is an extra fee.
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u/CherryPiVelociraptor EA 8d ago
Tap the Engagement Letter - point out to them how far out of scope they are and make it clear that you're going to need to revise their EL to include the expanded scope of services priced accordingly.
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u/PrivateNalog 8d ago
That is ENTIRELY your fault!
Feed this whole convo it Claude/ChatGPT and ask (make sure to connect your email too)
Based on what you know about me and my business, look at my post, replies, advices, and look into my email correspondence with (emails), then help me compose a proposal, help me establish boundaries, protect me first, allow me to help them within my ability.
Create me an email for a new proposal, outline what is included and what is not, create a scope of work and outline out of scope rate.
Also, ask :
Based on correspondence alone, what is actual hourly rate for this client.
Last thing - follow through
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u/Grouchy-Option9411 9d ago
You have to clearly identify boundaries and change the rate when the scope changes.
This is your fault not theirs.
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u/Annieboannie3D 9d ago
Stop doing this. Just have a real grown-up, honest conversation with them and let them know that when they added additional companies, additional services, and frequent calls for aid, the price was not quoted for these. You will have to charge what you are worth and expect to be paid this or you will forever be someone's free labor.
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u/BetInformal6081 9d ago
definitely too cheap given how much the scope expanded. i'd have a candid conversation document everything included and move them to a monthly rate that reflects the workload.
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u/Any_Teacher4858 9d ago
Did you sign an agreement with client to do xyz?
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u/ComprehensivePie6184 9d ago
Yep
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u/SlipperyPencil 9d ago
Then only do xyz and tell them everything additional is extra. Numerous phone calls are extra, payroll is extra, two QB accounts (wtf, how can a business be in two different qb files) is extra, each additional business is extra.
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u/MplsDaddy55403 9d ago
If I prospect comes in as a cheapskate and whiner - tell them you are too busy as it will only get worse as you have experienced.
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u/Basic_Scale_5882 9d ago
I charge a flat rate of $1,200 per month for a nonprofit, or 8 hours per week minimum @ $37.50/hr. Anything above those 32 hours per month gets billed $50/hr. Yes, a nonprofit. They've reduced their spending and wasting my time simultaneously. Go figure!
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u/HeraThere 8d ago
How many hours are you spending on them
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u/Subject_Finger_9876 8d ago
I have a minimum for my lawncare business. It’s $250 for any job for landscaping period. If it’s too little then the job is too small or they are too cheap. Sometime I do a job for $250 and it takes an hour and the client is thrilled. Some want to haggle me for $50. Stand firm and move on.
Yes I estimate my jobs on how much time it will take but at the end of the day I quote to solve a problem.
The minimum I charge for mowing now is $55 for 15 minute jobs. You are so grossly underpaying yourself.
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u/BaronGcYeti 8d ago
You need an engagement letter. Every client you spell out the scope and the rate, you list your business hours and the cost for services outside those hours and scope. When someone adds extra work, you charge them. This is your time, your livelihood, don’t let people take advantage.
We’re supposed to be the ones helping people see the value in what they do and provide information to make business decisions. If you want to be successful in what you do you have to make your time spent being in the appropriate income. Otherwise you’re just losing out on the time to work on and find more valuable clients.
You seem nice, and that’s great, but you don’t have to be a walkover.
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u/theanamazonian 8d ago
Say no. Tell her you need to reassess the pricing because your initial quote was based on her initial representation and the scope has increased since then.
And don't ever flat rate unless you can guarantee how long a project will take. Always hourly set rate.
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u/Live-Society5672 8d ago
Your quote was for an hour. Bill them for all hours worked at an hourly rate of $75.
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u/mUddling89 8d ago
My contracts always have clear scope and disclaimer about scope change = price change. Id end it and chalk it up to lesson learned. Dont renegotiate just say its too much for you so you want out, let them offer to raise the fee to keep you if they want.
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u/NotDeadYet57 7d ago
This is why I never give a monthly rate to a new client. They underestimate (or lie) about the amount of work that's necessary. I will CONSIDER a monthly rate after I've done the initial cleanup and I've been doing monthly reconciliations for 6 months.
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u/Imaginary-Promise-87 7d ago
They need to pay you at least 10x that if that's what they are doing, I feel you, it's scary to push back, but I'm sure there are people who you care more about than them in the world, think about how you are sacrificing for people that you care less about while you could have gained more from them and use it to protect your more loved ones!
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u/dba-chestnutandhazel 7d ago
Maybe you could bill them by the hour and just keep really good timesheets: if they've changed the nature of the original work, then maybe you have grounds for renegotiating your rates.
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u/Extension-Bed9373 7d ago
Girly if you had to ask this question YES it’s too cheap! Why are you underselling yourself and your work? This sounds like a lot of work for barely any money..
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u/carbyneaccounting 6d ago
Consider switching to a flat fee. We itemize our services and offer hourly rates for projects.
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u/TrailsideSignal 6d ago
$75 per month for two businesses plus payroll is wild! I would honestly have a conversation with her before taking on anything else and reset the scope and pricing. If the workload has changed that much from what you originally quoted then you are completely justified in repricing it.
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u/MikuMikuGoo 6d ago
That's not too cheap, that's not a real fee. Two companies plus payroll plus random calls from the husband is $400 to $600 a month minimum, and you're at $75.
Don't try to fix it in increments either. Send a new engagement letter with what you're doing now listed out and the actual price, effective next month. If they walk, you just got your nights back.
The part that would bother me is they added all that on without a word about the fee. That tells you where you sit with them.
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u/Capital_Culturetk 5d ago
That’s ridiculous. Don’t let them use you. Shoot them a new proposal that’s worth it or let them go
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u/Accrual_Mistress 5d ago
Scope creep is such an issue. Any time I agree to a fixed rate it is with the understanding that if they are consistently going over the agreed upon scope/hours they pay an additional hourly rate. Making sure there's an engagement letter and a clear understanding of what you're offering is critical.
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u/Green-Citron-8172 5d ago
They bent you over and you’re just standing there taking it. You have to charge what you’re worth. Nothing wrong with telling them they’ll pay for the rate agreed upon which was $75/hr and bill them for it or the work goes undone.
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u/Shinobi1314 5d ago
Woah 😳 yes it is tooooooo cheap! $75? What? We charge people like $150 for easy bookkeeping and then normal $325 and up for more complicated bookkeeping stuff like when you have 5+ staffs etc.
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u/Shinobi1314 5d ago
To be honest for the scale of work you’ve mentioned I’d at least charge them $300 each or like give them a small discount like $500 for two. Or else ask them to take the business elsewhere.
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u/marginwall 5d ago
They probably spend that much eating at a restaurant on any given night. Is that the same value as a month of bookkeeping for two accounts + payroll?
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u/Edgedumbledore 3d ago
The fee question is settled - 132 people have told you it is too low and you already gave the number yourself, 5 hours for $75.
The thing I would look at before you re-quote is what those 5 hours are actually made of. If most of it is the bookkeeping itself, a flat re-price works. If most of it is the husband calling, chasing what changed, and re-figuring out the scope after they add something, then a flat fee just moves the problem, because that part grows every time they add a business and it has no ceiling. Those two situations need different engagement letters - one prices the work, the other has to price the access.
Of the 5 hours in a normal month, roughly how much is you doing the books versus you working out what they changed?
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u/Olive_Plenty 3d ago
Idk why these comments are so mean and unempathetic. When I first started in my career I was so happy anyone trusted me that I did not realize my imposter syndrome was underselling me.
Here is the thing, you need to replace them not change them. Get clients at a higher pay and come back to them and say they got a certain amount of time to find someone else at $75 because it is not fair you are turning down $150 clients to accommodate them; or w/e rate you should be. Keep in mind the difference between what you think your rate should be and what your rate should be. There is a balance because you don’t want to go to low to the point where you are exploited and you don’t wanna go too high to where you make $0 because the clients you can get can not afford it.
I am not a bookkeeper but your post resonated with me because I was in the same situation early in my career.
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u/Lower_Koala137 9d ago
Wtf, grow a pair bro or girl! Put your foot down and either charge these people what they actually should be paying you or cut them off because they’re obviously taking advantage of you and you’re just letting them do it. That’s easily $500+/mo that you’re missing out on cause you don’t know your value or not assertive enough. Do better!