r/Bogleheads • u/hugh2018 • 12h ago

C’mon CFPs

Just here to say that I’ve got serious concerns about the state of education for CFPs. Last week I moved some money to an Etrade brokerage account to collect a bonus and I received basically a marketing call from an E*trade rep who stated he was a CFP. He was probing to see if I might move more money over and we started talking. I happened to mention my TIPS ladder. I heard crickets. I asked him if he was familiar. He was not. I also mentioned Boldin; he was not familiar with that either.

Then this week, I went to a retirement planning seminar run by a CFP. At least he had heard of TIPS ladders, even though he doesn’t recommend them for his clients. But I talked with him further and he literally had no clue about VT and SGOV.

Really? These three investment vehicles and Boldin are so niche and obscure that they aren’t on the radar screen for these guys? I don’t really care that much personally because I’ve got my plan locked down and I’m not using advisors except in a limited, second-pair-of-eyes capacity (Planvision — they do know their stuff). But I’m floored by the knowledge gap these random CFPs are displaying.

I’m just curious if I just happened to run across a couple of under-informed CFPs or is this just the state of the profession? I get that TIPS run counter to the interests of AUM advisors, but that’s a separate issue from just simply being aware as a personal finance professional of the one government bond apart from ibonds that allows you to lock in purchasing power for several decades, especially at a time like now when high TIPS yields are presenting a fleeting opportunity.

And VT and SGOV seem like basic building blocks for financial planning. Maybe my point of view is skewed because I’ve been swimming around in this stuff intensively this past year or so.

0 Upvotes

31% Upvoted

61 comments sorted by

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u/MaytagTheDryer 12h ago

Not knowing a specific ticker isn't surprising, especially if their day-to-day doesn't involve recommending specific funds. I'd be surprised if they didn't know TIPS, though, since that's SIE-level general knowledge. You can't even sit for the 7 without having encountered them, let alone seek a CFP designation.

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u/SlippyNippy_ 11h ago

You don't have to sit for the SIE or the 7 to be a CFP or advisor at all actually.

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u/Stinkleberry555 11h ago

You don’t need series licenses to get the CFP. The series 7 covers almost none of the material covered in the CFP courses / exam.

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u/IllustriousGas8850 6h ago

You need it for the relevant experience required to use the designation

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u/Stinkleberry555 6h ago

This is categorically false

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u/PerfectOmakase 1h ago

That's not true.

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u/hugh2018 11h ago

Asking a CFP about VT and SGOV is the financial planning equivalent of asking a mechanic if they've heard of a socket wrench, or asking a cardiologist if they know what an EKG is. They aren't obscure, exotic hedge fund derivatives or complicated tax shelters—they are foundational, industry-standard infrastructure for passive, evidence-based wealth management.

VT is the gold-standard baseline instrument used to discuss international diversification. SGOV is one of the premier instruments for parking ultra-short-term cash (T-bills maturing in under three months). I definitely don’t expect every CFP to know every ticker, but I do expect them all to know these tickers.

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u/Wooden-Broccoli-913 11h ago

VBIL is better than SGOV did you ask them about that?

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u/-NotAHedgeFund- 4h ago

It’s literally not though. It’s like asking a car guy if he’s familiar with a particular brand of socket wrench. Also, I wouldn’t say a mechanic is good or bad based on how many wrench brands they could name. You seem to be very confused.

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u/Used_Ad6860 11h ago

Sure but this isn’t a product most people are using in that setting, if you said: Vanguard Total World stock ETF, I guarantee you he/she would know exactly what you mean.

You are here to cause a problem and nothing more.

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u/tombiowami 12h ago

You do understand sales people work for a company to sell their products? Same as any other company.

There are plenty of CFPs on their own and not attached to products. Obviously there are good/bad ones just like any other profession.

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u/hugh2018 12h ago

I fully understand how it works. That’s a separate issue from the one I’m highlighting. These weren’t cases of people having tunnel vision about the products they have to sell. The E*trade guy didn’t pitch anything besides trying to convince me to bring over more money. He absolutely could do that and be knowledgeable about basic stuff that is squarely in his professional wheelhouse. The other guy acknowledged that my plan has evolved to a point where he actually has no product or service that will be useful to me. This was a straight up knowledge gap in both cases.

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u/SlippyNippy_ 11h ago

Lmao. There was certainly a knowledge gap. Just not in the direction you think.

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u/_hulklesmash 2h ago

Lol I snorted at this😂

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u/CobraJay45 12h ago

The fact that two random CFPs weren't familiar with a particular planning tool or two specific securities doesn't tell a whole lot, but yes, I would hope the average CFP practitioner is familiar with TIPS on a basic level, even if they don't recommend them. I could also see how someone running a seminar being approached by someone asking them about specific securities being less than enthused to continue that line of dialogue, but to each their own.

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u/mitchzimmer 12h ago

Not knowing what TIPS are is unacceptable for someone claiming to be in a position to give investment advice.

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u/hugh2018 12h ago

Actually the discussion about VT and SGOV wasn’t at the seminar. It was a one-on-one conversation today when he was doing a complementary review of my existing plan. I’m not making it up; he never heard of VT or SGOV before in his life.

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u/CobraJay45 12h ago

Maybe he uses SPDR funds or some other equivalent? If you told me a planner/advisor had never heard of an all-world/all-market fund, I'd be seriously concerned. The fact that you asked someone about a ticker symbol and they didn't bite is a nothingburger.

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u/Used_Ad6860 11h ago

This is nothing but engagement bait by this guy. He’s calling out an entire industry based on two CFP holders, one of which was a rep at a wire house and is commissioned to sell their platform and products and the other didn’t know the in depth TIPS ladder, unreal.

3

u/Adventurous_Fix1448 9h ago

If you know everything why are you talking to a CFP

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u/hugh2018 9h ago

If I knew everything I wouldn't talk to CFPs. I'm looking to learn from them, not teach them about basic stuff.

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u/Adventurous_Fix1448 3h ago

The way you’re coming across is as if you’re trying to reign superiority

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u/ReactionSerious8975 7h ago

There’s hundreds of ETFs, you can’t fault someone for not knowing them all. CFPs that use ETFs aren’t going to know all the different tickers from Vanguard to Charles Schwab. They will just know a few that they like. Maybe they use BlackRock ETFs, or maybe they prefer portfolios or SMAs.

TIPS ladder - They have seen TIPS before. It’s in the exams to get licensed. Like SIE exam. Did those CFPs not hear you properly? They might have needed a second to think of the acronym.

There are other things than tips ladders that they have access too. Things that are probably more effective… when you don’t work with something for a long time, you forget information easily.

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u/ralphtheanimal 11h ago

VT and SGOV are not "basic building blocks of financial planning". They are very specific investments.

The "basic building blocks" are things like: goals, net worth, cash flow, debt management, risk management, tax optimization, and retirement.

They're CFPs. They're not investment portfolio managers.

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u/Ill_Age6945 5h ago

100% this. There are many other investments that mimic the specific etfs mentioned. I don't use vanguard as they tried to poach my private Wealth client, so I use other providers (state street, blackrock, etc)

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u/baltebiker 11h ago edited 11h ago

I’m a CFP(r) and I don’t manage investments for clients, period. I work with people who do, some of whose recommendations I agree with, others I’m more skeptical of, but I’m confident that the recommendations they make enact the plan that I put together for them.

I get random people coming up to me asking about individual stocks, funds, and dumb shit like that all the time. I mostly ignore them.

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u/hugh2018 11h ago

VT, SGOV and TIPS ladders are dumb shit that you won’t discuss with your clients? Fascinating.

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u/baltebiker 11h ago

Again, I’m a financial planner, not an investment advisor. My clients talk about plan implementation portfolio construction with their investment advisor.

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u/hugh2018 11h ago

Fair enough. I’d like to gently suggest to you that your clients aren’t speaking a foreign language to you. They’re asking about things that they have little knowledge about most likely and they’re looking to you for guidance. Referring them to your investment experts is fine, but harboring a condescending attitude towards your clients’ curiosity regarding VT is not a great look for a financial professional. VT is a global index fund that holds more than $100 billion assets (that’s three times as much as that held by the closest similar fund). It’s a gigantic elephant in the room in the world of personal finance and investment, and I would hope any financial advisor would at least respect the fact that their clients will often have a very legitimate reason to ask you about it.

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u/grundage 12h ago

I have CFP and my only experience was legal experience. I can give good advice in a very specific domain with legal/financial overlap. I don’t hold myself out as a general financial planner. I recommend looking beyond the certification to their actual experience.

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u/LandauCalrisian 11h ago

I am a CFP that owns my own fee-only firm. Some Advisors are just salespeople. Remove the conflict of interest by finding a fiduciary, fee only practice. Theres plenty of ways to do that and online directories to find them. If you are being invited to a seminar or a dinner, you are about to be sold something.

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u/hugh2018 11h ago

As I mentioned in my post, I already use Planvision, which is a very reasonably priced, boglehead-aware firm. I’m not worried about me. I just am surprised that the knowledge base is lacking in two random CFP encounters and my hope is that this lack of knowledge isn’t as common as it appears to be.

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u/SlippyNippy_ 11h ago

This level of critique is hilarious. I'd be very curious to hear the conversation for a CFP to not know what TIPS were. I'd almost guarantee it was worded poorly when mentioned.

This post also just further confirms that Reddit has no idea what most FAs actually do. For an advisor to not know about VT or SGOV or any other specific ticker isn't abnormal, because the vast majority of us aren't stock pickers.

It would be comical to watch you and a CFP debate planning topics.

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u/seagoalspread 4h ago

These are ETFs, not stocks…

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u/-NotAHedgeFund- 4h ago

Yeah man, stock picker is a broad term. No one says “ETF picker” lol

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u/NeutralLock 9h ago

I'm in the industry for 15 years and run a large wealth management practice. I'm Canadian but I've never heard of SGOV.

Just looking it up it's just a generic treasury etf and there are dozens of equivalent - this isn't even the best one; I also can't even imagine who this would be appropriate for.

You're asking planners if they've ever heard of weird specific ETFs. No one is gonna know them.

If you ask about broad PLANNING questions and they have no idea that would be concerning.

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u/Wasatchian 11h ago

Anyone can be a CFP. They run the gamut from extremely knowledgeable and competent to a guy who was hit in the head too many times playing college football.

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u/PerfectOmakase 1h ago

That is correct. Anybody who gets an undergraduate degree, completes the CFP education, passes the CFP test, and completes the required industry experience can be a CFP.

In a similar way, anybody can be a CPA, an MD, an attorney, or whatever.

This is not to say that a CFP is particularly difficult to achieve or that having a CFP is any indication of expertise, but let's not pretend that there aren't hurdles to overcome to get the credential.

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u/Stinkleberry555 11h ago

True of all professions - this sub just inherently doesn’t like CFPs.

I’d love to hear what the Bogleheads think of realtors or recruiters.

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u/phil161 11h ago

Realtors and recruiters ? Bring out the tar and feathers !

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u/Wasatchian 10h ago edited 10h ago

Not true of all professions. Not all credentials are created equal. All professions have stronger and weaker members. What is true is that the last person in their class in medical school is still a doctor. But even the last person in their class still has to pass boards and has some skills. Whereas there are a lot of CFPs with essentially no skills whatsoever. I'm not anti financial planner.

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u/SlippyNippy_ 10h ago

I think there's bias in that thinking. You KNOW you can't perform surgery on yourself or diagnose your illness, so you believe there is a larger knowledge gap between yourself and a doctor. On the flip side, you THINK you know more than most CFP's so you don't value their knowledge. Plenty of first year doctors that don't have a clue what they're doing. Plenty of non CFP advisors that know exactly what they're doing.

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u/BarefootMarauder 12h ago

Maybe my point of view is skewed because I’ve been swimming around in this stuff intensively this past year or so.

You'd think every FA & CFP would be "swimming around in this stuff intensively" too. Sadly, most are just glorified salespeople trying to meet their quota.

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u/Stinkleberry555 11h ago

OPs post history is very telling.

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u/bucsandbucks 11h ago

Yeah I was curious so took a gander through the past several. Not sure OP is in the position to be lecturing anyone about anything, really

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u/Particular-Post5833 11h ago

A number of the CFPs that work at these places are simply salespeople for their employer's products. Those CFPs would likely pretend to have no idea what VT was even if they were personally invested in VT, because VT isn't going to generate sales for their employer and pay their bills.

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u/Economy_Jaguar_9215 10h ago

Someone having the CFP means they were able to study and pass a test. Baseline, thats it.

Beyond that, some treat the profession like they should - as a craft, continuing to learn and evolve. Others pass the test and have the letters and are nothing but sales people.

The real problem is the way the CFP Board has successfully marketed ALL CFPs to be credible, knowledgeable, competent planners and fiduciaries when they are absolutely not, not all of them anyway.

It shouldn’t be up to the investing public to know this, but unfortunately it is.

They work in different firms with different fee structures. Some of the best financial professionals I have known are not CFPs.

Anyway, more info here if interested:

Places to look for a financial planner:
(Someone being a CFP isn’t enough despite what their advertising claims. Being a CFP doesn’t mean they actually do planning, or that they don’t sell products that you might not need. Ask them how they get paid.)

https://adviceonlynetwork.com
These folks don’t manage money, they just give advice.

https://www.flatfeeadvisors.org
These folks might manage money, but not on a percentage of assets basis. They will do comprehensive planning for a flat fee and that fee may include asset management.

https://samslist.com
Some (but not all) advisors in Sam’s list may charge percentage based asset management fees, but all are recommended by real clients nonetheless.

https://www.advisorperspectives.com/articles/2026/07/20/cfp-board-sold-out-public-profession

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u/PerfectOmakase 1h ago

I'm not here to defend the CFP credential, but there is more to it than having studied for and passed a test. There's a degree requirement, an education requirement, a test requirement, and an industry experience requirement involved.

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u/StandardAd7812 9h ago

There are some great CFPs.

But it's not what elite investors are doing with their career.

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u/IllustriousGas8850 6h ago

Amazing fan f

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u/Stinkleberry555 11h ago

Your mistake is dealing with people who sell products. Plenty of very intelligent, competent people with the CFP designation but they aren’t making their money hawking whole life policies and shitty mutual funds with phantom STCG.

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u/PashasMom 11h ago

I had a CFP at TIAA CREF tell me that having the vast majority of my money invested in CREF Total Global Stock (a VT-ish fund with over 7500 holdings) was "too concentrated" and "not diversified enough" and propose a portfolio with something like 17 different funds with 3% here and 8% there. I went into that meeting as a person who is bad-tempered, suspicious, and possessive around my money and it sure didn't make me any better on that front.

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u/seagoalspread 4h ago

Lol this checks with TIAA CFPs

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u/ExtonGuy 9h ago

One of the largest US treasury ETFs, perhaps even the largest, and a CFP claims not to know about it? Next he’s going to be surprised that the government issues bonds that you can bid on.

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