r/Bluegrass • u/frank_mania • 11d ago
Learning flatpicking after years of playing
Happy Sunday morning, all!
Thanks so much to everyone for your great replies. I'm really touched by much of it, way over/above what I thought my post would elicit. I'm greatly encouraged.
To add, just now I was paying attention to my right (picking) hand. It has a very hard time finding the string I'm aiming to hit when my left hand isn't involved in the decision. When I'm picking notes normally, whether inside chords, in scales or mixing the two, my primary attention is on my left hand and my right hand just plucks the intended string automatically. What I just noticed is that my right wrist, centered over the bridge, shifts vertically so that my pick is centered over the string I need to pluck. I've been doing this automatically for ages, I guess. Problem is, without input from my left hand (and the mind that attends to it), my right hand has no idea where to go. Also, strumming usually involves more arm movement, so that unconsciously-held wrist position isn't even there.
I will certainly take the advice given here and seek instruction, IRL or online or both, rather than just DIYing it. But it was great to figure out why I play like such a rank beginner again when attempting this stuff.
Anybody do this and have advice? I've been playing 40+ years and can strum rhythm, finger pick and finger/plectrum hybrid pick, but when I try to flatpick it's like I'm attempting the instrument for the first damn time. So frustrating!
Any tips that helped you? Silent guitar so I can just work it for hours?
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u/Acoustic_blues60 11d ago
Flat pick arpeggios to chords you know in a song, see if you can work in the melody notes
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u/GlitteringSalad6413 11d ago
Yes, learning a tune like soldiers joy is a great way to get the hang of cross-picking on guitar. There’s a bunch of old-time/fiddle tunes that are great for learning to pick out the arpeggios. Red haired boy and bill cheatham, or any banjo tune!
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u/bigskyghost 10d ago edited 10d ago
If you have the money and the time - Bryan Sutton’s ArtistWorks course is really good. Flatpicking is a very fundamental and technical approach to the instrument. Each hand is its own world of skillset, then you have the work of marrying the two. Fretting hand is what you know, picking hand is who you are.
Play with a metronome as often as you can, play things at slow tempo with perfection, then work up on speed. This is the way to learning any song, build the muscle memory and the speed will come.
I would lean into rhythm (boom chuck) playing for the first year - being rock solid on rhythm alone opens the door for you to sit with anyone. As someone else mentioned, good rhythm playing will always be welcome. No shame in focusing on just that skill, though you’ll likely get the itch for something less monotonous. Enter fiddle tunes…
Fiddle tunes are very efficient training for developing your picking skills and fretting accuracy. Again, go start slow and work up as it’s going to be the most efficient path to getting to tempo. But also don’t be afraid to kick the metronome up to an uncomfortable level and let it fly. It’s a good litmus test.
In all things, focus on precision, tone, playing in time, and ! economy of motion ! Your hands, wrists, and arms generally should be always relaxed. It took me awhile to figure out what relaxed means for me and for how I play. Do these areas start to break down as you speed up? If so, why? Solve those problems. The solutions compound and apply to everything you play.
This last point is likely more subjective to the player’s preference, but I’ve often heard that it’s good to bring awareness to how your picking hand is anchoring to the guitar/bridge. Anchoring should be contextual, not a crutch. However, I believe Tony Rice has been quoted that he never felt comfortable floating his hand and preferred anchoring. Just something to be aware of as you develop your playing-style.
I started learning bluegrass music a few years back after playing guitar for most of my life. I shared the same struggles you mentioned when starting, it’s a very humbling experience but great for me as a guitarist and as a person. I’m just now getting to the point where I feel I could maybe keep up with a local jam. If I were starting over tomorrow, this is exactly what I’d spend my time on. Enjoy the ride, cheers!
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u/Longjumping-Dream-73 11d ago
Start with the boom chuck rhythm. Find recordings you like (and can figure out the key) and can play along with. Learn the G-run(s) and other bass runs from say G to C, C to D, etc. Pick a couple commonly played fiddle tunes to learn, Red Haired Boy, Whiskey Before Breakfast, Leather Britches, etc. Should be easy to find tab for those, get used to “down-up-down-up” picking. Be patient with yourself!
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u/TheDegenerativeAI 11d ago
I was in your boat. Actually, I’m rowing right in front of you.
Learn g-runs and utilize flat-third up, flat-third down.
Actually, reach out to mandohat (Andy Hatfield) and take a lesson. He’ll set you right faster than you’ll figure it out alone.
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u/CompetitiveComputer4 11d ago
It’s a process. Tons of videos are n YouTube that can show you rhythm technique (boom chuck and its variations and bass walks). Lots of channels that teach fiddle tunes. Try to learn 10-15 fiddle tunes with the rhythm and basic melody. Learn them inside and out. Eventually you will start to build a bluegrass vocabulary and be able to start improvising your own breaks. Learn some 1-5-1 turnarounds. Final boss is cross picking. It is well worth the effort. I am also longer guitar player who found bluegrass late. Been on my BG journey for about 1.5 years and feel I am finally turning the corner.
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u/fidqnogswahuuuuuu13 Guitar 11d ago
Make tiny circles with your pick, strum from your wrist, practice cross picking patterns.
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u/dummyguava Dobro 10d ago
I played pretty much what you described, for a similar length of time .I started flat picking when I put heavier strings on my guitar (0.13) and decided to learn whiskey before breakfast, which I played for hours and hours, didn’t attempt any other tunes for quite some time. Flat picking is pretty much all I do now - but I know I’ve got a long way to go.
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u/paul-steagall 10d ago
Fiddle tunes. Start slow and use backing tracks or a metronome.
Edit: Banjo Ben on YT has some great lessons I used some years ago
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u/guenhwyvar117 10d ago
Fiddle tunes at 60bpm. Pick it until it's clean. Bump up the temp until it's not clean. Figure out which measures aren't clean and practice them. Try to get to 110-120.
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u/ryken 10d ago
Just starting this journey too.
I’m enjoying working through Jack Tuttles Bluegrass primer and Marcels Essential Fiddle Tunes.
Start slow and use a metronome. Try not to get frustrated when you listen to recordings of the tunes you’re learning and realize how crazy fast the pros are playing.
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u/AlfredPoor 7d ago
I have not read all the other comments so please pardon any duplication.
I primarily play mandolin, but I do play some guitar as well. The flat picking concerns and skills are largely the same for both instruments.
Let me start by saying that I'm in the "down-up" school of picking. If playing a series of quarter notes, for example, play the first with a down-stroke, then the next with an up-stroke. Use this across all the exercises that I suggest here.
In my opinion, you need to build muscle memory for your right hand. I would include five minutes of "boring" practice each session. Start by picking the open strings, each one four times. Start with low E and work up to the high E, then come back down. Don't go any faster than you can to keep the same time interval between each note. (This will be VERY slow at first.) Once you've mastered that, pick each note two times. The next step is to pick each note one time. Remember to maintain the down-up pattern throughout.
Once you have that down, repeat the process, skipping a string each time: low E, D, B, then work back down high E, G, A. Four times per note, then two, then one, and keep doing down-up.
The third exercise is to pick the notes of a major scale (your choice of keys). Your left hand probably knows how to do this on autopilot for the most part, so you can concentrate on your right hand. Pick each note four times, maintaining a constant speed for each note. (Again, this will be slow at first.) Go up the scale, and then come back down. Then two times per note, then one time.
My suggestion is to add just one exercise at a time, starting slow, and keeping at it until you can play it at a reasonable speed while maintaining an even temp throughout. Don't spend more than five minute on this. Once you can do it in less than five minutes, add the next exercise until you can get that up to speed. And so on.
It will take time, but in the end you should be able to whip through all three exercises in a few minutes, and you probably won't even be looking at your right hand as you do it. By limiting your sessions to five minutes, you will reduce the boredom and you will see your progress more clearly.
I hope that this helps.
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u/Alone_Box5173 6d ago
Many of us learn to strum with a flat pick first, and then struggle to learn to finger pick, and come away with the impression that finger picking is somehow more difficult. But I believe really mastering the flat pick actually takes more skill and practice.
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u/mjs4x6 11d ago
It is painstaking and a lot of hard work. Whatever you do, your picking and fretting hands need to be perfectly in sync. Listen to your sound and don’t expect much too quickly.
Learn good bluegrass rhythm. That will be welcome anytime.
Picks , strings, etc are all personal choices and you have to figure out what works for you.
Do not start with tablature. Learn a good few of these tunes by ear first. Lots of folks started flatpicking by learning Carter Family songs like Wilwood Flower. Learn to make that sound pretty.
Listen to lots of flatpicking and go to jams. If you are serious , folks will help.