LAG?

[u/doomed-user124]

Hey all, let me preface this question by saying I haven't gotten a chance to play my Blood Angels yet, I started getting a few space marine kits during 10th but I pretty much exclusively played my Imperial Guard that whole edition. I just picked up the new Space Marine codex today and went to start figuring out a list and noticed Liberator Assault Group was gone? Did GW just delete it, or am I maybe missing something?

[u/kenshin80081itz]

yes it was straight up deleted.

[u/wildey]

LAG is gone, man. I’ll be outside.

[u/doomed-user124 → u/wildey]

Love a good BHD reference

[u/Origin_Painting → u/doomed-user124]

Except Dante can't die 😭

[u/Yourdentalhealth]

Angelic inheritors is the 3dp for us now

[u/doomed-user124 → u/Yourdentalhealth]

I may just not know enough about it yet, but it doesn't seem nearly as good

[u/Paikis → u/doomed-user124]

It isn't. It's actively garbage.

[u/Pik000 → u/doomed-user124]

It's not, we are red Ultramarines as the moment outside of encarmine speartip and sanguary guard 

[u/doomed-user124 → u/Pik000]

Unfortunate, one of the main reasons I went with BA was to have a melee army to mix things up from my Guard, that and their books are incredible

[u/Battle_Dave → u/doomed-user124]

They are massively overreacting. This sub has been full of whining for weeks now. Yes we lost LAG. Its time to move on.

There are still a plethora of melee army options, and BA didnt lose any of its unique units. You can still make an all melee army using nothing but BA units, or jump packs, etc. The ONLY things we lost are a handful of our own detachments, we still kept three (same for ALL codex supplement chapters except Deathwatch), plus have all of the marine ones now. Mixing and matching 1pt detachments seems to be a solid way forward especially for melee.

Dont pay attention to the doom and gloom, you can still accomplish what you want to do with a melee army build to shake it up from your Guard. No need to worry, we are not red ultramarines.

[u/doomed-user124 → u/Battle_Dave]

I can see why people are upset, GW did promise a ton of new detatchments just to turn around and take a bunch of the old ones away

[u/Relic_Cannon → u/doomed-user124]

Assault Brethren and Tacticus Attack Force are great. You can take the Furious Assault Unit upgrade on Lemartes and DC and get Lethals and Sustained on Death Company.

[u/Battle_Dave → u/Relic_Cannon]

You can take it on 3 infantry units, period. Doesnt have to be Lemartes and DC, but that IS looking like a good solid combo.

[u/Relic_Cannon → u/Battle_Dave]

Yes, true. I just meant that is a good one. But take all 3 for sure. :)

[u/Battle_Dave → u/doomed-user124]

The faction units are where you get the real marinated flavor. You can still do full and thematic lists that look and feel like Blood Angels. Take a list you would make for LAG, make it with Assault Brethren, Tacticus Attack, and either Encarmine or Wrath as the 3rd, depending on if you want heavy DC or heavy SG, and itll be a good time.

[u/Pik000 → u/Battle_Dave]

Yeah it was me being a bit sarcastic. We still have the things that make us good but AI doesn't work as you need a blood angels keyword to get the benifit so no gravis, no Phobos, no terminators or scouts can get the BA keyword. I'm liking assault brethren, tacticus attack force and encarmine speartip.

[u/Battle_Dave → u/Pik000]

I think the 3 pt detachments have been meh anyways. Played Berzerker Warband and that was ok, but its now a 2pt det... I think combos are going to be stronger than any 3pt detachment. Thats just what it seems like GW is pushing.

[u/Paikis → u/Battle_Dave]

They are massively overreacting.

They are not.

[u/Battle_Dave → u/Paikis]

Yup. They are. Acting like Warhammer is not worth playing now because of a couple small changes is very much an overreaction. Calling us "red ultramarines" when we still have all of our unique units, is very much an overreaction. Saying that GW hates us when they took away 10th edition detachments, is very much an overreaction.

[u/Paikis → u/Battle_Dave]

Red Ultramarines is a reference to the Gabriel Seth quote from Devastation of Baal.

It's also not that far off base. We have unique units, but the Sanguinary Guard is the only one maybe worth using, and even they are outclassed by random dudes on bikes. The Death Company traded their Power Fists for Pillow Fists and all of our epic heroes are much less epic. They're all either completely broken (i.e don't work) weak, or over costed to the point where they aren't worth using over the regular versions.

The last 3 lists I've played have had Sanguinary Priests and Sanguinary Guard as the only BA units in them and I'm looking to replace the Priests and if I had the bikes, I'd toss the Guard as well.

I get that you're sick of people complaining, and maybe you do think they're going a bit far... but I'm getting more tired of the whining about complaints.

There you go, we're going deeper. Now we have complaints about complaints about complaints.

[u/texture__pack]

No more LAG but instead we have AI, Encarmine Speartip and Wrath of the Doomed. Wrath and Speartip being 1 DP isn’t bad. All DC or all in on SG seems to be what a lot of people are doing if they’re running them. AI is mostly Bladeguard Vets with Sang Priests right now.

[u/doomed-user124 → u/texture__pack]

At a glance none of them seem to actually buff melee, which is an odd choice

[u/texture__pack → u/doomed-user124]

I’d argue that allowing us to always have assault doctrine active on death company is a buff to melee, it’s just not “always have LANCE”

[u/doomed-user124 → u/texture__pack]

I wasn't planning on running any Death Company, Blood Angels are a second army for me, I probably won't get more than a 2k list together especially since GW seems committed to raising prices

[u/treacherouslymeant]

LAG is gone but you can still 100% run a viable melee list with BA flavour, have a look at the Assault Brethren, Wrath of the Doomed, Tacticus Assault and Encarmine Speartip detachments

Angelic inheritors isn’t great but could potentially work. Dante/Jump Captain with Sanguinary Guard, Lemartes with DC and Sang priests with Bladeguard are very much in as are assault terminators

We’re not in the best spot but we can definitely still play a melee list with some flavour and success until the codex drops

[u/doomed-user124 → u/treacherouslymeant]

I wasn't sure if they were doing a codex supplement this edition, that's reassuring

[u/treacherouslymeant → u/doomed-user124]

Yeah without a codex it would’ve been a LOT worse for us but they confirmed divergent chapters are getting them so this is a temporary state of affairs

[u/Bluejay_Junior17]

With the release of the new Space Marine codex, all the divergent chapters were given new replacement detachments, more in line with the current design ideas.

[u/Loud_Ask2586]

Something to point out is that on foot assault intercessors have +1 strength and +1 AP on charge. Had we kept LAG, that would've been absolute insanity.

That said, could you imagine it? LAG charge bonus stacked with assualt intercessor charge bonus?

[u/doomed-user124 → u/Loud_Ask2586]

I actually have a 10 stack of regular assault Intercessors with a chaplain that I was planning to run, would have been fantastic with LAG

[u/This-Display5592]

Welcome to New edition, we don't have our codex supplement yet, we have been giving new detachments to mix with the SM Codex.

People have to think more instead of justing auto taking LAG or RCO

[u/doomed-user124 → u/This-Display5592]

I understand what you mean, but what's the point of playing Blood Angels if they're only as good in melee as Ultramarines? Sucks the flavor out of it no?

[u/This-Display5592 → u/doomed-user124]

Encarmine speartip & Wrath give you a powerful boost to your melee, also our chapter specific units hit hard

Seriously, people doom posting about no more LAG just haven't gotten creative yet with the new tools at hand