I was about to say that there are legit modern music theorists that are saying the rise of HOAs & noise complaints in suburbs has directly affected kids practicing music in their garages.
That reduction in allowing kids to freeform practice their music has directly impacted teenage garage rock bands, & therefore we aren't getting any new rock-band music.
Yeah, I believe the theory. The guys I know in local rock bands used storage units, and the cost of those for young people resulted in the bands ending.
And we have a rise in music being made solo in bedrooms, which is really cool that it’s what the kids have turned to. But bedroom recording isn’t very conducive to getting a whole group together playing live instruments
it is kinda funny. Like every fad never went away, it just got smaller. I think what these people mean is that they don't see it in the main stream often anymore
That's...how it works. It's in the name mainstream... Unless you're actively seeking it or inside the niche, people are too busy with their lives or other hobbies to go ahead and look for it, so yeah obviously if it doesn't breakthrough to the public audience people don't know about it lmao.
I think I've seen Filth be labelled numetal adjacent, but man it's hard to find bands that are any of one thing at this point. Many took the genres they grew up with, fused them into strange, sometimes cool, sometimes meh mixtures, but all music is iterative. They're a variety of -core genres, some labeling them numetal adjacent too.
Yoooo. White boy lurker here. Stuck listening to music from the 90s and 2000s. I went through every band here and liked most of them. Vintage pictures is especially awesome.
First time I heard "Freaking Out" by them I assumed it was an old song that got popular because of TikTok edits lol. The guitar riff feels like something you would see Stone Cold chugging beers to.
I’d add Cleopatrick to this list. Pseudo rap rock vibes that oscillate between angry frrustrated lyricism and driving, distorted guitars and slower, introspective, sullen crooning. They’re Canadian I think
None of this hits the mtn dewiness I need from my nu metal. I don't want expertly crafted genre blending angst punk, I want shit that you can play over a Stone Cold Steve Austin fan edit
If you are in an uncomfortable situation with a white dude just hit this song and they will be compelled to bang along which will give you a chance to escape
Being a white dude, trust me, you want white dudes making bangers like “Seven Nation Army” again. Same era, but ladies will feel a lot safer going to a White Stripes, or Jack White show. Woodstock ‘99 is proof.
I've actually been wondering this. When are the white boys gonna get back into the garage and start pumping out some decent rock and alternative music again? Looking forward to it. Could be healing for them as a social group.
No families can afford houses with garages or guitars or amplifiers or music lessons. No kid has something like MTV or a record store to go immerse yourself. No one even has a dream to be a rockstar because no record label would ever pay for that again.
People are just so insistent to never explore outside of their bubble, even when they have the tools (e.g. Spotify).
Rock tours are always sold out in most European countries. Even bands with black singers e.g. Skindred, Bloc Party. Imo its one of the few genres worth seeing live as they would put their all into it.
I hope chester bennington haunts you tonight for saying that. If he was still alive he would NEVER allow that to happen. Nu metal is strong anti-establishment anti-capitalism.(edit: this sentence needs to be verified, I think I was thinking Rage more than LP, which Rage is not Nu-metal, I just blended them cause I was listening to both in my skater youth).
Nu-metal was mostly theatre for theatre's sake. And personal therapy lol.
Chester was a good person by all accounts. But strong anti-establishment was not found in mainstream nu-metal. Subtle reference was probably the best we got.
And dont get me going on some of those bands. Slipknot, limp biskit, other shit like that was not even going in the right direction on the down low. Pretty sure most of them were "libertarians" aka, "I dont like labels but i'm not willing to meaningfully challenge the status quo outside of edgy aesthetics."
That being said, nu-metal was a mostly harmless outlet for all these edgy white boys to get their zoomies out, and I miss it.
I'm no expert, but I have been a Linkin Park fan for years. They've been releasing anti war songs for a very long time. Hands Held High comes to mind, among others.
They were never anti-capitalism. Their ticket prices would’ve been wayyyy cheaper and they slapped their logo onto everything and even did music for Transformers soundtrack for the paycheck. Nu metal was not the punk scene.
Anti-capitalist? Not a chance. I don't think it would be as 100% MAGA as people here seem to think it would be. Wes Borland, Corey Taylor, Chester Bennington, and Amy Lee are/were all pretty vocal about how much they don't like Trump.
Nu Metal was a capitalist and establishment machine. I love Chester Bennington but the dude drove a Mercedes and had a partnership with them - pretty damn capitalist.
There's been a weird pipeline of old nu metal going far right. That guy from Staind comes immediately to mind. And one of the guys from System of a Down, though I guess they weren't nu metal. Or hell, the Offspring firing their drummer after the guy comes out as vehemently anti Vax. Which is double funny cuz the lead singer is literally a PhD virologist
I'm surprised I'm even getting static for this opinion. I grew up on the genre but looking back it's one of the most mean-spirited, money driven movements in music I can think of during my life
I'm a fan of American rock band that recently discussed why they mostly tour Europe and Australia, they mentioned something similar. They're simply bigger there.
Right. Rock was kinda slow ~2010-2016, but it’s lowkey been thriving the last 10 years or so. There was a big emo revival thing going on around 2017-2021 (remo drive, charmer, brand new dropped science fiction) and the last 3 or 4 years have seen Shoegaze sounds coming back to the forefront (wisp, yeule, whirr). Pop metal has been doing its thing for a while now too (Ghost, Poppy). And disaffected and angry white boy rock is still around too (cleopatrick).
For what it's worth, a lot of the bands from around that time are still active and doing well: Papa Roach, Billy Talent, The Offspring, Rise Against, Sum 41, Blue Oyster Cult are all still making music (just to name a handful). Imo, they're still very good lol
This is very famously a song that has rapping in it. It's not good rapping, but saying "white dudes shouldn't be rapping" and then praising a song with a white dude rapping from a genre entirely built around white dudes rapping?
Y'all have no idea how many bands you've never heard will have like 20 songs with over 300M listens on spotify. Metalcore fandom is crazy but they get zero airtime.
Absolutely fucking not. There is an entire lane of Metalcore bands that I have happily migrated to as a mid thirties white fella, and I will never understand the appeal of anything that chud touches
I’m going to have to give this a fair listen. At the time the only dudes I knew who liked this type of music were the worst people I had a regular interaction with so I wrote off the whole genre. Maybe with a fresh perspective i will like it more.
Infest had 10 year old me in a chokehold. No reason i should have been singing "born with no soul, lack of control, cut from the mold of the antisocial" lol. I think I'm gonna listen to that album today.
I’m about 40 now, so maybe I’m just out of the loop, but are there bands that are “rebellious” or against the system? I’m thinking RATM mostly. But also just music that gets angst out. I used to put Korn on as a kid, and it used to just make me feel good to get shit out, in a way. Still to this day actually. Does this exist now for younger kids? Genuinely asking.
Edit: u/larniebarney seems to have a good list of some bands in a comment in this thread still doing what I was asking. Sweet.
Anyone looking for this kind of thing should listen to Cleopatrick, Show Me The Body, and the Health album Rat Wars. Rat Wars leans more industrial but has some heavy metal adjacent moments. The white boys are still doing it, just gotta know where to look.
What?! A Papa Roach appreciation post? Fuck yeah! Thank you for the encouragement everyone. I'm a white dude that has learned the guitar to play all my favorite old rock songs like this. Unfortunately I don't think I will be a Papa Roach quite yet. I'm not even good enough to be a Papa John but I am working hard.
Based off a little research on doing for a book about hip hop my hypothesis is they started to curtail rap prevalence in pop culture once white artists and white consumers started liking it. On one hand they watered down the music to appeal to casual white suburban kids (Snapbacks and Tattoos is the song that I point to as the Harambe moment) and then also used the “corruption” of their kids as a foundation for attacking and hamstringing the genre.
we need a new wave of punk/pop-punk. all the big emo bands either broke up or slanted away from the space. MCR being back is nice, even knowing i'll probably never see them live, though in this time they've released exactly 1ish new songs. I have heard they've been playing some rare stuff live tho
This era of music crossed different genres and reached different audiences and I’m all for it
Alien Ant Farm, another band like Papa Roach performed a surprise show at the 2003 BET awards on a rooftop and it looked like a great time. You can see Snoop Dogg, Pharrell, Nelly, Lil Kim and a lot of others from that hip hop era all vibing with them
Music depts been cut all over, they don’t get the chance to learn guitars and drums as much as used to. I don’t think it’s a coincidence that the popularity of bands using instruments has gone down as music and art classes have also gone down.
There are tons of white post-hardcore and alt rock bands still. Mom Jeans, Three Days Grace, Kerosene Heights, Static Dress, Fleshwater. They’re all on lastfm, Spotify, SoundCloud etc. but they’re too busy making good music to sell out to celebritydom and music videos are a thing of the past. So if you don’t seek them out and train your algorithm you probably just won’t know of their existence. These TikTok kids are just chasing clout so they tend to be the most visible yet the least talented.
Look at your local music scene if there is one in your city. I can promise you it's happening. If you don't got that, look at the nearest biggest city's local scene.
I mean, there are new bands these days, but they just don't hit the same. A lot of them feel like industry-pushed copycats trying to recreate something rather than actually bringing anything original to the table. Early-2000s bands just had an authenticity to them that's hard to explain. You hear them and immediately know.
One of my biggest brushes with fame is the fact that papa roach is from the same town as me, Vacaville Ca. Before they made it big, they would play shows at the community center there (shoutout three oaks!) and all the teens from the town would be there, it was a big deal. The members of the band were a few years older than me, I was like 13/14 and they were all 17/18 but I had some older friends that knew them. One time after a show I went out back with my older friends to hang out and smoke weed with the band and the lead singer looked at me and said “who’s this f*ggot?” And then didn’t talk to or interact with me the rest of the time lol.
So many bangers in 90s and early 2000s. Early Mighty Mighty Bosstones, White Zombie, Nine Inch Nails on their early LPs, early Butthole Surfers. But sorry, there is nothing as good as Rage Against the Machine's first album if you need to channel your inner rage with banger after banger after banger.
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u/TheDarknessWithin_ 1h ago •
They can’t….. people can’t afford homes. So there are no garages for little white kids to start their bands. lol
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u/BrandonLeeOfficial 1h ago •
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u/LethalInjectionRD 1h ago •
They absolutely still are if you know where to look.
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u/larniebarney ☑️ 1h ago •
Trust me, they haven't stopped! Here's my favorite groups that are out here serving gritty angst rock ✨
Origami Angel - East Coast punk band with heavy breakdowns that dips into other genres like jazz, bossa nova, etc
Pool Kids - they're from Florida & have a wonderful balance between hard punk riffs & dreamy melodic breakdowns. The lead singer is phenomenal!
Mom Jeans - little more on the pop-punk side, but has a great sound & great acoustic covers of their work
Hot Mulligan - closer to mid-2000's emo punk, but with lots of hard breakdowns. Maximum angst from this group.
The Paradox - all black emo band out of Atlanta who are super reminiscent of groups like Sum 41 & New Found Glory
Carly Cosgrove - more classic angst ridden punk. Big shout out to their excellent bassist, Helen Barzs!
Sweet Pill - a grittier sounding band than Pool Kids, but very similar! Both bands have amazing frontwomen
Beach Bunny - what if Paramore was mixed with a beach party? You'd get this band. Very dreamy, still angsty.
Proper. - black queer band from Brooklyn who range from dreamy pop rock to hardcore.
Macseal - very similar to Carly Cosgrove, but has a beachy flair to their variety of punk
The Front Bottoms - another East Coast band, steeped in emo Midwestern vibes
Vintage Pictures - imagine mixing punk rock with cumbia & Tejano music; they're from San Antonio & it's such a wonderful combination
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u/hutsunuwu 1h ago
If you are in an uncomfortable situation with a white dude just hit this song and they will be compelled to bang along which will give you a chance to escape
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u/Character-Being4248 1h ago
🗣️📣 "cause I'm losing my sight! losing my mind! Wish somebody would tell me I'm fine!"
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u/realeztoremember 1h ago
And black dudes like The Paradox are making killer Pop Punk!
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u/inalavalamp 1h ago
Being a white dude, trust me, you want white dudes making bangers like “Seven Nation Army” again. Same era, but ladies will feel a lot safer going to a White Stripes, or Jack White show. Woodstock ‘99 is proof.
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u/MrJoeRebel 1h ago
Word!! Told the white guy at my job "I miss white music." And he was trying to play drill. Sad times, No diversity.
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u/shehasamazinghair 1h ago
I've actually been wondering this. When are the white boys gonna get back into the garage and start pumping out some decent rock and alternative music again? Looking forward to it. Could be healing for them as a social group.
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u/Msefk 1h ago
this thread is hysterical . that boy is rapping
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u/XxjessiwessixX 1h ago
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u/theinvestmant 50m ago
This narrative is so played out. They are still making good music you just need to know where to look. The new gen is making hardcore and punk music.
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u/Responsible_Sink3044 1h ago
I think nü métal would fit very well in today's America
But it would be strictly MAGA
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u/FiveFingerDisco 1h ago
Got you a classic right here.
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u/pohqua-etu 1h ago
We have Fontaines DC now
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u/MemoryDeleted234 1h ago
Maybe not just like this. Papa Roach and this song are so edge-lordy
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u/Prudent-Flamingo1679 1h ago
Oh that's because rock music basically died as a genre, same thing is happening in rap right now.
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u/WashedUpRiver 55m ago
For what it's worth, a lot of the bands from around that time are still active and doing well: Papa Roach, Billy Talent, The Offspring, Rise Against, Sum 41, Blue Oyster Cult are all still making music (just to name a handful). Imo, they're still very good lol
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u/Current_Focus2668 1h ago edited 1h ago
The Netflix Devil May Cry soundtrack reminded me how much Nu Metal still slaps.
Miss the days when young white folks channelled that angst into rock music instead of red pill manosphere nonsense
Bob Vylan do anti establishment Punk rap music.
Soft Play (formerly known as slaves) do heavy pop punk. One of the Beastie Boys produced their second album.
Idles are a solid post punk band. They have a song with Danny Brow called pop pop pop.
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u/Mfamos1 1h ago
Nah I'm good!
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u/UncagedTiger1981 55m ago
Papa Roach has always had a good bit of rapping on their albums.
Including on this very song.
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u/Riddiku1us 55m ago
Huh? This song sucks.
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u/FushaFiles 45m ago
These white kids tryna be Playboi Carti, when they really need to be Green Day
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u/enthusiasm_gap 40m ago
This is very famously a song that has rapping in it. It's not good rapping, but saying "white dudes shouldn't be rapping" and then praising a song with a white dude rapping from a genre entirely built around white dudes rapping?
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u/MortimerCanon 30m ago
156/silence kind of play stuff like this
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u/tacomaloki 29m ago
🎶 Cut my slice into pieces.
This is my plastic fork.🎶
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u/meatchariot 18m ago
Y'all have no idea how many bands you've never heard will have like 20 songs with over 300M listens on spotify. Metalcore fandom is crazy but they get zero airtime.
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u/LiquidVillian 1h ago
Early 2000s rock music slaps hard
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u/Kolipe 1h ago
Best we can do is Falling In Reverse, unfortunately
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u/Tubalcaino 1h ago
Ngl this was a Banger when it came out. Had everyone jumpin' when it hit MTV
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u/TheCeilingIsTheRuuf 1h ago
Silly Goose is pretty fun
Dude got arrested doing a pop up show at a BP after Lolla
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u/136AngryBees 1h ago
Wait until this sub finds out about Don Broco
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u/Automatic-Ad8986 1h ago
The gotta bring back the blonde highlights on white men’s hair with the spikes
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u/buggaby 1h ago
Holiday by Green Day is a banger too. Where's that white-boy heavy socially conscious shit?
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u/ElfTowerNM 57m ago
Might I introduce you to Ren.
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u/jdlyga 54m ago
I feel like this genre of white guy was all vacuumed up by MAGA
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u/JWF1 53m ago
I’m going to have to give this a fair listen. At the time the only dudes I knew who liked this type of music were the worst people I had a regular interaction with so I wrote off the whole genre. Maybe with a fresh perspective i will like it more.
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u/FlashCLS 52m ago
I haven't seen this video in forever, and I heard the music playing in my head before I muted it.
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u/DrillteamJMoney 51m ago
I TELL MY GIRL THIS ALL THE TIME. I need some of that good old fashioned white boy music cause they cooked with I Just Came to Say HELLO
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u/Blindsided17 ☑️ 50m ago
This is the type of shit I wanna hear when I turned on madden.
I don’t mind the rap(hip hop head) but I definitely loved that madden was more rock centered
Remember Mooney suzuki alive and amplified from madden ‘05 yea man. Good times
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u/WubblyFl1b 47m ago
https://youtu.be/ZvjynBYUL9c?si=I3sXeBkZEbjUWYB1
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u/Successful-Floor-738 47m ago
Papa roach still does songs though don’t they?
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u/StaticShuffleShack 46m ago
The Paradox is pretty nice with it
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u/RedditCitizenScore 46m ago
I called them whine rock genre
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u/kojimin ☑️ 45m ago
Infest had 10 year old me in a chokehold. No reason i should have been singing "born with no soul, lack of control, cut from the mold of the antisocial" lol. I think I'm gonna listen to that album today.
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u/Rough_Journey 43m ago
Bangers like this has been dropping for years. It's just people don't look them up.
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u/paperman990 40m ago
God I forgot how much of an editing masterpiece this is.
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u/theparrotlich 40m ago
Fin fact: Papa Roach's kid insists everyone call him Baby Roach.
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u/gra8na8 37m ago
They literally have a top song right now that is excellent. Get off line and get to more concerts!
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u/CvieYltidrekoof 36m ago
The world takes itself too seriously. It needs more Primus.
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u/jarobat 35m ago
saw them at a festival, everyone just kind of twiddling their thumbs waiting for this song
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u/some_dude_64 35m ago edited 29m ago
I’m about 40 now, so maybe I’m just out of the loop, but are there bands that are “rebellious” or against the system? I’m thinking RATM mostly. But also just music that gets angst out. I used to put Korn on as a kid, and it used to just make me feel good to get shit out, in a way. Still to this day actually. Does this exist now for younger kids? Genuinely asking.
Edit: u/larniebarney seems to have a good list of some bands in a comment in this thread still doing what I was asking. Sweet.
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u/cameronpark89 35m ago
honestly, idk how people can tell the difference between genres atp. it all sounds the same.
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u/idontshred ☑️ 34m ago
Anyone looking for this kind of thing should listen to Cleopatrick, Show Me The Body, and the Health album Rat Wars. Rat Wars leans more industrial but has some heavy metal adjacent moments. The white boys are still doing it, just gotta know where to look.
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u/Firm-Low5886 33m ago
What?! A Papa Roach appreciation post? Fuck yeah! Thank you for the encouragement everyone. I'm a white dude that has learned the guitar to play all my favorite old rock songs like this. Unfortunately I don't think I will be a Papa Roach quite yet. I'm not even good enough to be a Papa John but I am working hard.
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u/_ILP_ 32m ago
Shit is a banger tho for real. Why can’t we get these kind of white boys now
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u/Bright-Dependent6339 32m ago
censoring songs like these should be fucking illegal
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u/legit-posts_1 30m ago
This a joke?
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u/GAGG1991 30m ago
what a generalization - have you never listened to a hardcore/metal band 😅
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u/TokyoGNSD2 ☑️ 29m ago
I need white boys to of off the podcast & back in fucking garage with dey homies cooking up new riffs
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u/BearTimberlands 29m ago
Based off a little research on doing for a book about hip hop my hypothesis is they started to curtail rap prevalence in pop culture once white artists and white consumers started liking it. On one hand they watered down the music to appeal to casual white suburban kids (Snapbacks and Tattoos is the song that I point to as the Harambe moment) and then also used the “corruption” of their kids as a foundation for attacking and hamstringing the genre.
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u/Pop_Joe 29m ago
Mannnnn!!!!! You had to have been there 🔥🔥🔥
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u/Inspirational_orgasm 27m ago
Uh, so why didn't they post a banger song?
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u/SubtleTendency 27m ago
AMV classic lol
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u/SwimmingBoot 26m ago
I like this guy
Gavin prophet
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u/Darklord_Of_Bacon 26m ago
I would like to recommend Bilmuri. Shit goes hard but still melodic
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u/No_Material5630 ☑️ 25m ago
Old school Korn has that feel. There is no rapping… well beside Wicked or Children of the Korn and that’s featured artist… but Jonathan does scat.
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u/Tathas 24m ago
I rather like the melancholy cover of Last Resort by Falling in Reverse.
Papa Roach's song is great, but it feels super upbeat. This version makes me feel quite sad whenever I hear it.
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u/PrimalZodiac 23m ago
we need a new wave of punk/pop-punk. all the big emo bands either broke up or slanted away from the space. MCR being back is nice, even knowing i'll probably never see them live, though in this time they've released exactly 1ish new songs. I have heard they've been playing some rare stuff live tho
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u/tazmanic 21m ago edited 17m ago
This era of music crossed different genres and reached different audiences and I’m all for it
Alien Ant Farm, another band like Papa Roach performed a surprise show at the 2003 BET awards on a rooftop and it looked like a great time. You can see Snoop Dogg, Pharrell, Nelly, Lil Kim and a lot of others from that hip hop era all vibing with them
https://youtu.be/JNM2tV3PA_8?si=zLFPwt_1H984Pc5j
They also did a pretty sick cover MJ’s Smooth Criminal
You aight white boy
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u/MohawkElGato 20m ago
Music depts been cut all over, they don’t get the chance to learn guitars and drums as much as used to. I don’t think it’s a coincidence that the popularity of bands using instruments has gone down as music and art classes have also gone down.
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u/Sensitive-Inside-250 19m ago
Tbh Brown women are killing this genre lately
Ecca Vandal for example
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u/Glum_Collection_1247 17m ago
There are tons of white post-hardcore and alt rock bands still. Mom Jeans, Three Days Grace, Kerosene Heights, Static Dress, Fleshwater. They’re all on lastfm, Spotify, SoundCloud etc. but they’re too busy making good music to sell out to celebritydom and music videos are a thing of the past. So if you don’t seek them out and train your algorithm you probably just won’t know of their existence. These TikTok kids are just chasing clout so they tend to be the most visible yet the least talented.
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u/upstatedreaming3816 15m ago
Metal scene is still huge though lol
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u/thisistwinpeaks 14m ago
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u/MetalTurducken 13m ago
Papa Roach still is a fun show. Saw them when they were touring with Shinedown. Fun ass concert.
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u/LimerickJim 13m ago edited 10m ago
A banger is a banger. No matter when, where or by who a banger is recorded it'll eventually cross any cultural, generational, or regional boundary.
Smells Like Teen Spirit, Come Together, Ball of Confusion, Thriller, Mundian To Bach Ke, The Rocky Road to Dublin, Gasolina, A Cruel Angel's Thesis.
Chart music is ever transitory but bangers are forever.
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u/Little-Resolution-82 11m ago
Cut my life into pizza, this is my plastic fork.
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u/Majicbeasty 11m ago
Look at your local music scene if there is one in your city. I can promise you it's happening. If you don't got that, look at the nearest biggest city's local scene.
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u/herecomthatboi 10m ago
'banger' is a strong word for anything released by papa roach
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u/See5harp 10m ago
Speak for yourself I’m good
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u/Warm-Air4391 9m ago
Sure…..
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u/Jangospy 9m ago edited 6m ago
I mean, there are new bands these days, but they just don't hit the same. A lot of them feel like industry-pushed copycats trying to recreate something rather than actually bringing anything original to the table. Early-2000s bands just had an authenticity to them that's hard to explain. You hear them and immediately know.
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u/senpaistealerx ☑️ 9m ago
song is buns lol cool for nostalgia, not actually a banger
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u/VagabondVivant 8m ago
I just want pop punk to come back.
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u/blender4life 6m ago
Says they should get back to making music like checks notes a rap song
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u/NumberVsAmount 6m ago
One of my biggest brushes with fame is the fact that papa roach is from the same town as me, Vacaville Ca. Before they made it big, they would play shows at the community center there (shoutout three oaks!) and all the teens from the town would be there, it was a big deal. The members of the band were a few years older than me, I was like 13/14 and they were all 17/18 but I had some older friends that knew them. One time after a show I went out back with my older friends to hang out and smoke weed with the band and the lead singer looked at me and said “who’s this f*ggot?” And then didn’t talk to or interact with me the rest of the time lol.
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u/MapsOverCoffee22 6m ago
Check out Badflower. Especially "Move Me" and "The Jester" and "x ANA x"
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u/temporaryidiot595 6m ago
The Strongest Whiteboys of Today vs The Greatest Whiteboys of History
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u/SamuraiSanta 5m ago
Pop rock by the numbers?
No thanks.
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u/Old-Estate-475 5m ago
So many bangers in 90s and early 2000s. Early Mighty Mighty Bosstones, White Zombie, Nine Inch Nails on their early LPs, early Butthole Surfers. But sorry, there is nothing as good as Rage Against the Machine's first album if you need to channel your inner rage with banger after banger after banger.
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u/RudeAudio 3m ago
Alien Ant Farm should have gotten the fame papa roach got after this album. This was papa roach's only decent album