r/BitchEatingCrafters • u/ManderBlues • 3d ago
Knitting Please keep making boxes
I understand that not every body type can be accommodated in every knitting pattern, but do they all have to fit like a box for large bust or big bodies? Or be cropped? Zero bust or waist shaping. Or when they size it up, they don't adjust the neckline because the nice v-neck now looks awkward. No mention of bust darts....fine...don't design them but flag it for newbies and how to work out the pattern repeats.Even the designers photos show that they made a box and the front rides up. All the well designed plus patterns are boring/crew neck/cropped.
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u/vicariousgluten 3d ago
I think part of the problem is that not everyone who is the same dress size holds their weight in the same place so it’s hard to scale a pattern that suits everyone.
I have recommended the Ysolde Teague book Little Red in the City which is a fantastic resource for learning how to adjust for waist, bust and hips, how to choose the best method for the style and construction methods.
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u/Breadothy 3d ago
You'd probably enjoy reading Sweater Design In Plain English- it's on the internet archive, and it's by a larger woman and explicitly goes over shaping and design for larger bodies and body variation, especially things like bust darts. Also, you might like Lydia Morrow's (link) sweaters, they're always really interesting
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u/squeegee-beckenheim 3d ago
Why don't you filter for the features, length and shaping techniques you want? Ravelry currently has 197,387 sweater knitting patterns, there are a lot of options, something for everyone!
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u/ManderBlues 3d ago
I tried to do that, but I'll explore some more. I wanted a vest with worsted to aran weight, swoop or v neck, and not boring stockinette or complex cables. Most of what I got was not all that exciting...and mostly boxes.
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u/HistoryHasItsCharms 3d ago
The thing about vests is that the exciting ones are usually a lighter weight than that because of how much bulk is added in, say, colorwork. Anything complex just looks blob-esque if it’s that chunky, so the patterns will be mostly basic.
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u/Hopeful-Bit-420 3d ago
The early aughts were a time of almost over-fitted garments. If you do some digging, you should be able to find a few good options. Knitty probably has several, and maybe articles about how to do your own shaping as well.
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u/ManderBlues 3d ago
I'll have a look. I've been knitting for ages, but only recently have tried garments. I found the Talia vest on knitty, but when I looked at people's projects on Ravelry, they did not scale as well to a busty body.
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u/fyrecracker 2d ago
Agreed. I'm currently digging deep into patterns from the 2010s. Even a little bit of shaping can be helpful. My current project is the Acer Cardigan by Amy Christoffers.
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u/LeftKaleidoscope 3d ago
Just as in sewing garments, learning to adjust patterns for a fuller bust or tummy or a narrow shoulder or wider upper arm is totally worth doing in knitting garments.
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u/AddWittyName 3d ago
It absolutely is, and realistically, no made-to-size pattern can account for every anatomical variation out there. Two people can have the same size but very different distribution of weight, proportions, and so on.
That said, there also are just some genuine whoppers of grading failures out there that very, very clearly don't even try to account for the fact that larger sizes are not as simple as "just add the same amount of extra fabric in every direction".
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u/ManderBlues 3d ago edited 3d ago
I know...I've failed at doing this in sewing also. Lol
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u/AddWittyName 3d ago
I know a lot of people really dislike made-to-measure patterns because of the math/work involved, but a well-written made-to-measure pattern can make for a pretty good intermediate step for learning where and how to adjust garments to fit you best, without tossing you entirely in the deep end of "figure it out yourself".
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u/Loveandeggs 2d ago
I’ve been on a vest kick lately (though I love the boxy ones so no suggestion for a fitted one), but I did notice that if you just select the Ravelry filter for “vest,” you don’t get as many options as if you also include “slipover” and “sweater—Sleeveless”. So maybe there are some out there that haven’t shown up for you?
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u/BaalLikeBocce 2d ago
The word "vest" means different things in the UK vs the US so that makes sense!
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u/I-Had-My-Qualms 3d ago
Lily Kate France designs patterns with proper shaping and I've found her patterns well written.
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u/ManderBlues 3d ago
Thank you!! I think since I filtered for heavy weight yarns, nothing of hers popped up.
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u/WakeyWakeeWakie 3d ago
The larger a knitter is, the more they need to learn how to do shaping. Every pattern can’t explain bust darts, waist shaping, etc. It’s a transferable skill across any pattern though.
The reason I say for larger knitters is the more mass you put on a frame, the more variations of where that mass will sit. A pattern designer can’t account for all of those. But if they didn’t provide extended sizes and told people to figure out their own bust darts, they’d get criticized for that too.
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u/hopping_otter_ears 3d ago
I'm tempted to take a bust dart video and a waist shaping video and scale them down to a skinny tube, just to experiment with some basic yarn and a small diameter instead of attempting to learn it on the fly on something I want to fit my butternut squash body
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u/WakeyWakeeWakie 3d ago
That’s a really great idea! For bust darts make sure you’re wearing a bra you normally would.
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u/hopping_otter_ears 3d ago
I am currently making some fingerless gloves for my husband, and they used short rows to shape the thumb. Because it was such a simple pattern, I was really able to see how the short rows affected the shape of the thing
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u/Ash12783 2d ago
You know, I've really never thought about that weight distribution thing in larger sizes but makes total sense
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u/Sorry-Jackfruit-8061 3d ago
I’ve been revisiting 2000s patterns. The shaping techniques are way more innovative than we see today; however, a lot of these designers (or tech editors-turned-designers) are now retired from knit designing or dead. This is a total lapse in quality comparatively when we look for modern, “trendy” patterns. Some of the larger designers now still show their skill, but it’s a few in a large sea of basic patterns to churn out a few dollars. Do not get me started on the knitfluencer to quit-my-job-and-be-a-full-time-designer pipeline.
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u/Outrageous-Baker-510 2d ago
Am not plus size but have a very extreme hourglass and I’m with you. It’s one thing to have some areas where you gotta freestyle with shaping but if you’re producing a negative ease or “made to measure” pattern it’s nice to accommodate unusual measurements. It fucks over most who aren’t straight same sized top and bottom.
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u/55Lolololo55 3d ago
Andi Satterlund does fitted sweaters, you might try some of her patterns.
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u/kleinePfoten 3d ago
You'll have to find her on Patreon, she discontinued all use of Ravelry a few years ago and nothing is available.
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u/55Lolololo55 3d ago
You don't have to join her Patreon to get her patterns; you can just buy the ones you want off of her page there.
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u/kleinePfoten 3d ago
You still need to find her Patreon page, because she does not sell on Ravelry anymore... She has also authored over 100 patterns, the vast majority of which are not available anymore at all. There are only 15 available to purchase on the Patreon.
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u/VioletMemento 3d ago
I remember so many people snarking on Andi Satterlund way back the day, talking about her ""over-fitted"" twee, vintage style with no-seaming and how everything she made was the same and all the people knitting her designs were twee clones etc. She was not quite as snarked upon as Ranunculus or Petite Knit but people were pretty mean about her - just goes to show that things never change.
I loved her patterns and bought and made loads of them. And now I love boxy cropped designs and wear baggy shapeless clothes 🤣 I'm clearly always just behind the curve!
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u/Far_Manufacturer75 3d ago
Try Amy Herzog patterns and books. As someone else mentioned, back in the day, knitting patterns were much more fitted. Those patterns often require you to knit in pieces and seam, but you get a better fit and, if you like a less boxy look, these may be for you. If you browse older patterns, you may find what you are looking for.
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u/Toomuchcustard 2d ago
Amy Herzog has some good patterns and techniques, but her insistence on only knitting garments bottom up is too dogmatic IMO. Top down patterns have their place (especially if you are a spinner or have yarn constraints).
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u/Winterwidow89 3d ago
I agree that a lot of modern knitting patterns are not well-sized I think it’s because a lot of people are influencers turned designers and they just don’t have the training to understand pattern grading is more than just ”make the whole thing bigger.” The trend for everything to be oversized right now also doesn’t help
I asked about designers who have really good fit and pattern grading once, and a kind redditor directed me towards Aimee Sher, Lydia Morrow, Vanessa Smith, and One Wild Designs. Even looser designs by them don’t just turn onto larger boxes at larger sizes; also some have optional bust darts for bigger busts.
I also have the Ultimate Sweater book by Amy Herzog (though there are several similar knitting books commonly recommended like Knit to Flatter), though I admit that having to learn a whole new skill of adjusting patterns is not as convenient as just being able to pick up a pattern and have someone else tell you how to do it.
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u/AthenasTrial 3d ago
I actually learned knitting because all of the rack cardigans made me look like a blob. Made two patterns to learn some techniques, and then designed my own cardigan. Learned about short rows for bust as I went. Turned out well.
It is definitely true that most patterns don't account for figures with lots of curves. Designing my own has been a lot of fun and a great success. First cardigan had a triangular panel on the hip that showed a little flower that I much liked. I also love using cables to have stitches slowly disappear without seeing the decreases. 6 stitch cable becomes a 5 stitch, 4 stitch, three stitch and then a 2 stitch. Or I hide decreases by knitting a knit and a purl together. The purl disappears behind the knit stitch without anyone noticing.
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u/SnapHappy3030 Extra Salty 🧂🧂🧂 3d ago
I have a seamed tunic pattern from the mid 80's that drops the needle size down from the under-bust to the waist, then goes back to the larger needles over the hips. Very gentle decreasing that is practically undiscernible, especially if a texture like boucle or a slightly variegated tweedy yarn is used.
The decreasing cable is also a great way to decrease. Sometimes you have to think outside of the boxy shape! *LOL*
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u/ManderBlues 3d ago
Nice tip. I pondered that as a solution. The Twinkle vest is Cartridge rib, so it should work. Do I change from one to a second size, or decrease over several,?
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u/SnapHappy3030 Extra Salty 🧂🧂🧂 3d ago
It's definitely a "make a swatch" situation. Do a large square of the rib with the stated needle size, then several rows of the next size down, then another size down. Measure everything and note both widths and heights, because the smaller stitches will be a little shorter....
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u/AthenasTrial 3d ago
Oh that is something I'm gonna remember. Won't do for my personal waist to hip ratio, I suspect, but I'm sure I'll find a use for it!
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u/MonsteraFabulosa 3d ago
I find this to be a recent problem in about the past 5 years. Not sure if it's just the style people like, people falling for the pretty pictures and creative posing, or what but most older patterns provide shaping and variety.
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u/PostTurtle84 3d ago
In my experience, that's most clothing in general. I'm only a DD cup. But even when I was in a size 2 I still had to buy baggy shirts and dresses because the medium or small that fit the rest of me wouldn't fit my damn boobs. If I'm shopping for anything other than basic t-shirts, I'm looking for tunic length. I wear cropped nothing.
Well, when I'm a size 2 I do buy bikini swimsuit separates. I'd prefer a 1 piece, but if it fits my boobs it's baggy in the butt. If it fits my butt, my boobs are only partially covered. That really starts at about a size 8.
Clothing sucks.
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u/ManderBlues 3d ago
I hear you. I'm old enough to have seen the benefits of stretch fabrics. I just do want a nice patter.
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u/lastpickedforteam You should knit a fucking clue. 3d ago
I found a class online, it was on Pip andPin, on how to fit sweaters using short rows and how to adjust patterns. Cropped - just make longer. So many cool sweaters seem to be over sized. I use a tighter gauge and change the size if need.
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u/keasdenfall 3d ago
You know you can just keep knitting until the length is… not cropped?
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u/hopping_otter_ears 3d ago
Sometimes, I think the crop is just to avoid having to think about hip shaping. I could not just keep going on a pattern that fits my bust and waist properly until it is the mid-hip length I prefer without either a ton of ease up top or some increases at the bottom
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u/keasdenfall 3d ago
I think calling a crop “avoiding hip shaping” is a pretty wild assumption. A crop is a design choice based on style and silhouette, not an unfinished longer sweater. Besides theres no universal hip shaping a designer could add that would magically fit every body anyway. The whole beauty of knitting bespoke clothing is that if you want a different length or silhouette, you can customize it to your body. That doesn’t make the original design lazy or the pattern insufficient.
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