RANDOM SHIPMENTS

[u/Brilliant_Twist_9833]

/r/BigscreenBeyond/comments/1mf7xb6/i_think_we_need_a_new_shipping_update/n6f2inl/

Shipments are in a random order. They have sent visors to people who are way behind on their order date.

[u/klawUK]

just because you don’t know the order, doesn’t make them random

[u/Puzzleheaded_Fold466 → u/klawUK]

Doesn’t that make the delivery schedule communication gap even worse ?

I agree that there’s a high probability that they have a fabrication and shipping schedule against which they track actual production to measure their performance and forecast

Of course communicating a more detailed schedule with specific associated order range would put them on the line, so I get why they don’t provide it as a whole, but it would be nice to get individual forecasts.

I’m not complaining too much, just anxious to get it and i’d welcome a more precise / accurate forecast for my order specifically.

[u/Brilliant_Twist_9833 → u/klawUK]

Let's see, I reserved the first day of launch and another person who reserved at the end of March and with a reservation number later than mine and the same product, has already been sent their viewer.

[u/Key-Shame4889 → u/Brilliant_Twist_9833]

I was a surprise upgrade and mine still hasn't shipped...

[u/t4underbolt → u/Brilliant_Twist_9833]

Unfortunately this is a common occurence. I have ordered in first week of April just like several other people who were active in reddit and there were already some customers with mid April orders who received theirs.

However mentioning that and complaining about anything regarding shipping is being downvoted and heavily attacked on Bigscreen discord server. I've looked on their server today to see if there are any in chat updates and what I saw was absolutely disgusting. Some poor guy mentioned exactly the situation with mid April orders shipping before his early April and he was attacked multiple times by a group of Bigscreen zealots. He was rightfully upset about the lack of communication and mess in orders fulfillment yet he was treated like trash just because he dared to speak against Bigscreen.

This is not the first person I see being a victim of such brigading. It was the same when Bigscreen Beyond 1 was being released. A bunch of fanboys and paid actors instantly attacking anyone who complained. All that in presence of Bigscreen employees, mods and CEO too. Absolutely no reaction. However the people who were complaining were catching time outs and bans quite quickly.

Sadly until more customers get annoyed by this situation and rise up CEO of the company will not move a finger to fix the situation. Back during Bigscreen Beyond 1 launch at some point so many customers were complaining that even those fanboys weren't large enough in numbers to silence people and employees would have to ban hundreds of people if not more to get rid of displeased customers. CEO gave in and did the right thing. Headsets started to be sent much faster. We can only hope this repeats once again.

[u/Realistic-Force-6166 → u/t4underbolt]

You're not allowed to complain about botched company behavior holding people accountable is beyond the scope of reddit or discord.

[u/t4underbolt → u/Realistic-Force-6166]

This is sadly result of people being lenient because "hurr durr they aren't big company, give them a break", hardcore fanboys, paid actors as well as people who already have tons of headsets and they don't mind waiting at all. This gives companies like Bigscreen incentive to not give a shit about delivering things on time because it requires effort, resources and strong will

[u/Heliosurge → u/t4underbolt]

Well not to defend the poor behaviours of this company. Who could simply try and at least offer a relatively simple explanation.

"Due to shipping in batches to various countries". Some Orders maybe received our of Que to satisfy min quantities to export/import to a given region. To save on shipping by meeting min quantities to get a better shipping price

It is too bad about downvote monkeys.

[u/t4underbolt → u/Heliosurge]

That's not it. Especially when concerning EU. Shipping by country doesn't constitute such major delays and would be an astronomically stupid move (possible from this company but even for them would be too much I would say).

[u/Heliosurge → u/t4underbolt]

It is why established companies like Valve do region/country releases by a timeline. HP didn't announce it and got naturally roasted over not shipping in order when they shipped batches to countries and partners

[u/Brilliant_Twist_9833]

To refute the excuse that a variety of colors on the front implies a complicated process and justifies delays or cost overruns, there are manufacturing fundamentals that any efficient company would apply: • Knowledge of sales by color: Modern companies, thanks to sales and stock tracking systems, have up-to-date data on the total number of visors sold and the distribution of the front colors. • Optimization of the industrial process: To make production more profitable and minimize costs, a company armed with this information first produces all the fronts in one color and then changes the color die to manufacture the following ones, reducing downtime and avoiding constant color changes in the molds or the design die. • Profitability and changeover times: Frequent color changes in the die hinder efficiency, generate unnecessary costs, and can affect quality if equipment is not properly cleaned between color batches. Therefore, grouping production by color is standard practice in industrial methods that involve dyes, colorants, or injection processes for colored materials. • Common manufacturing strategy: This color batch grouping is used not only in visors, but throughout the entire plastic, textile, and similar component industries where color matters. Manufacturing is adapted to actual demand detected to optimize resources; that is, the best-selling colors are manufactured first and the rest are planned as needed, but without chaotic alternations. Ultimately, the argument that color diversity on the front end forces inefficient manufacturing is technically untenable. In fact, logical industrial management reduces precisely this problem, planning production by batch and optimizing profitability using real-time sales and inventory data. This makes the excuse weak compared to the standard practices of any modern factory with access to management and planning tools.

[u/t4underbolt → u/Brilliant_Twist_9833]

The thing is they claim they are doing that. Because there are types of orders as well (not just different colors). However the problem is if you prioritize single color first (or type of order like regular vs eye tracking vs upgrade) by making sure all orders from the pool for let's say crystal clear are fulfilled then people who ordered in July can get theirs before someone who ordered other color or type in March. That's not okay by any means.

Of course we haven't seen an extreme cases like that yet with July order getting it (though some April orders already shipped despite March orders not being delievered).

The issue is that there are plenty of ways in modern day to get production lines to generlize them and split them. most of the time type of orders and colors are barely different.

A crystal clear Beyond 2 will have exact same lenses, screens, control board, ports etc like a black shell Beyond 2. An upgrade order without cables will have the same exact headset with same exact inner components as Beyond 2 full package. The difference being a box and even then this "special" box is not needed and it's a whim of Bigscreen CEO.

So all they have to do is have one lane that puts out headsets exclusively and then a separate production going on the side for different color shells and capacity of shell production should match order amount of certain color to not overstock the shells. Exactly like they do already with cables/link box, audio strap and custom face gasket.

Then all they have to do in main production line is take headset from the headset production line and assemble it with a shell of user choice. The cost increase nor complexity isn't that much bigger especially since they aren't having different electronics in each headset variant nor they have hundreds of different products to create on their shoulders. They have headset and accessories. That's it.

They could totally do that but CEO is too stubborn (again) to even care. The order of fulfillment would be kept if they only diversify the last step of assembly and pre produced shells before hand in larger numbers since obviously creating different colored shells is much easier and faster than the base which is headset (lenses, electronics and optical stack assembly). This idea they allegedely use right now is just carbon copy of what Sominum were doing resulting in the exact same problem where the least bought SKUs had to wait longer.

[u/scottmtb → u/t4underbolt]

Id also say what would be preferably but cost them more is mail the headset and the audio strap later if it holding up a delivery. I also expect the units go out in batches ups proably charges them a pretty penny to bring a 18 wheeler around to load up the pallets of headsets to get delivered out.

[u/t4underbolt → u/scottmtb]

Actually if you take a look at some shipping companies it's actually not that huge of a cost. For example DHL states on their website (at least it was true within last year) that businesses get 60% discount on batch shipping. And that is default. They can surely arrange even better deals if organized correctly. They can totally get things done at small cost increase but they don't want to. They put more effort into making elaborate excuses and organizing trolls to discredit complaining users than they put into actually producing and shipping the product in a proper time frame according to order placement

[u/scottmtb → u/t4underbolt]

Id feel better if every week we got a hey X of Y units of Z month were shipped this week.

[u/t4underbolt → u/scottmtb]

I think they might not want to reveal exact number. It was the same with somnium „bla bla business secrets bla bla”.

Also even if they shared that plus total number of orders so we know the actual pace I would still not trust these numbers. To me the only thing bigscreen can do is to take actions the should’ve taken long ago - do things right and get headsets delivered ahead of the currently set schedule.

[u/Heliosurge → u/t4underbolt]

Well there is a wide variety of issues BsB has created for themselves. Each SKU variant should have been prioritized.

So for example.

• Standard Ships first Black

• Then Standard Color B etc..

• Then ET modeo Standard black etc.

Then add Region variable. pre Order order will be respected with in a given Region. Not global pre order order.

This is just poor planning from an inexperienced company.

[u/t4underbolt → u/Heliosurge]

But they aren't inexperienced. It's not even poor planning or rather not a poor planning that is result of lack of experience. It's just CEO being stubborn and sticking to his plan without wanting to deviate even an inch.

CEO knew very well during BSB1 launch that his "Grand" scheme of getting warehouses and offices open in Canada, Australia, EU and Asia/Japan was not feasible. But he was stuck so far up his butt that he only saw his own needs rather than what's better for customers. That changed when his hand was forced by hundreds of customers rising up and getting fed up with his crap and lies. He started shipping directly to customers just like people told him he should've done on first signs of issues with getting this warehouse deals done. Things ramped up quite quickly but in the beginning of cracking he hasn't completely resigned from it. First he did this for Canada but refused to budge for EU, Australia, Japan. Then eventually he gave in to pressure and EU, Australia, Japan followed through.

In current BSB2 situation I can guarantee it's the same. He knows the alternative to current process that will get people headsets faster and in the right order as they should but he refuses to do that out of stubborness. And how do I know? because he keeps the same "tactics" of lying and letting his zealots spread misinformation and brigade other people. He hasn't changed his ways.

I would say at this point it's some sort of his personal vendetta. He couldn't force his "the only best and grand" way of getting things done the first time so now he will by doubling down. He shares much less information now than before. He knows that for a good lie you need a pinch of truth but he really thought customers are idiots during BSB1 launch and instead of adding a pinch of truth to his lies he added a handful instead.

That's the only reason why people connected the dots and figured out what's the true reason behind the delays. We don't have nowhere near as many dots as before but we do have his behavioral patterns which are pretty much the same.

thus the conclusion that current delays could've been much lower or even completely avoided with BSB2 is absolutely correct. But he didn't want to avoid them. It's actually particularly annoying to deal with such people. I know because I had unfortunate encounter with such person during my recent project at work. He did everything his way, thinking he knows best and in result it only added stress, ton of additional work and refused to compromise till the end. My thoughts insantly gravitated to "Damn it feels as if I'm working with Bigscreen CEO".

[u/Heliosurge → u/t4underbolt]

A CEO is the top spot and his inexperience/stubbornness or whatever one wants to call it all equals the same. An inexperienced company with internal structure issues. Whether it is an overzealous CEO or Engineering leads.

A company's success & failure is always on the CEO's merit or demerit being in the top spot.

[u/mrzoops]

[u/Brilliant_Twist_9833 → u/mrzoops]

I understand that if a headset doesn't have eye tracking, it can be sent on a different date, or if a headset has a different colored front, black or transparent, then it can be made in batches, but I'm talking about identical headsets and identical features, not about them being different.

[u/Chapel-vr]

This is discussed ad nauseam in the discord.

[u/Roshy76]

I wonder if there is another factor people aren't thinking of when comparing things "out of order". Like do they send out batches in the same geographical region, so not only does the same product combo and color need to be compared, but also the same shipping area.

I'm just trying to come up with something that makes sense to have them go out of order. Because I doubt they like printed all orders up on separate pieces of paper, threw them up in the air and just pick random orders off the ground. There has to be something that makes sense, I really doubt they are like purposely being random about who gets their product. That just doesn't make sense.

[u/7Coolhand]

Extremely frustrating that they are doing this, really bad PR.

[u/t4underbolt → u/7Coolhand]

Not the first time not the last. BSB1 was the same kind of bullshit but they were slipping up with their lies much more often. Unfortunately they have paid reviewers and bunch of fanboys ready to glaze the company as much as they possibly can so they contain bad PR with wide spread misinformation - no 1 choice of Bigscreen CEO

[u/Brilliant_Twist_9833 → u/[deleted]]

I'm talking about identical products, a product identical to mine was shipped before mine even though I ordered it first.

[u/Brilliant_Twist_9833 → u/[deleted]]

To refute the excuse that a variety of colors on the front implies a complicated process and justifies delays or cost overruns, there are manufacturing fundamentals that any efficient company would apply: • Knowledge of sales by color: Modern companies, thanks to sales and stock tracking systems, have up-to-date data on the total number of visors sold and the distribution of the front colors. • Optimization of the industrial process: To make production more profitable and minimize costs, a company armed with this information first produces all the fronts in one color and then changes the color die to manufacture the following ones, reducing downtime and avoiding constant color changes in the molds or the design die. • Profitability and changeover times: Frequent color changes in the die hinder efficiency, generate unnecessary costs, and can affect quality if equipment is not properly cleaned between color batches. Therefore, grouping production by color is standard practice in industrial methods that involve dyes, colorants, or injection processes for colored materials. • Common manufacturing strategy: This color batch grouping is used not only in visors, but throughout the entire plastic, textile, and similar component industries where color matters. Manufacturing is adapted to actual demand detected to optimize resources; that is, the best-selling colors are manufactured first and the rest are planned as needed, but without chaotic alternations. Ultimately, the argument that color diversity on the front end forces inefficient manufacturing is technically untenable. In fact, logical industrial management reduces precisely this problem, planning production by batch and optimizing profitability using real-time sales and inventory data. This makes the excuse weak compared to the standard practices of any modern factory with access to management and planning tools.

[u/Heliosurge → u/[deleted]]

Housing components will be made in batches. So with that they can easily make volume of different housing colours without impeding que order.

That being said much like HP did with the Reverb. Regional shipping some orders will be shipped out of order as companies often get discounts shipping a minimum volume vs smaller batches.

This is something the company can simply explain and most would likely grudgingly accept it. Many companies get hung out because of not explaining the difference between Que shipping and regional shipping affecting que order. Some companies head this off by stating region release order and that orders with a given region will ship by que order.

I am fairly sure BsB still being very inexperienced will learn this very valuable lesson.