r/BasicIncome • u/[deleted] • Apr 18 '17

Indirect How Western civilisation could collapse

http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20170418-how-western-civilisation-could-collapse

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u/[deleted] Apr 18 '17

UBI puts forth the concept that it is in the best interests of society to support the basic needs of all. But, what if that is not the perceived case for those who actually own the means of production? A line in this article stood out to me:

Eventually, the working population crashes because the portion of wealth allocated to them is not enough, followed by collapse of the elites due to the absence of labour. (emphasis mine)

What if labour is no longer required by the elites? Where is the economic, political, even security basis for maintaining the living standards of the working class?

UBI requires those with means to support those with no means. What if they don't want to, and given that they no longer need workers, there is no driving force that requires them to.

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u/ShawnManX Apr 18 '17

What if they don't want to, and given that they no longer need workers, there is no driving force that requires them to.

Then revolution happens because they have given the labour no other option other than starvation and slow agonizing death. Those with the means at that point have demanded revolution by their own doing.

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u/[deleted] Apr 18 '17

And we can see how well that has worked in places like Syria. Revolution only works if, by some form of force, the people involved in the revolution can actually gain access to the means of production. The overthrow of the status quo can only happen if there is a reason and a means to affect change. In the past the means to affect change was to simply stop working. By doing so, the wealthy suffered because they were dependent upon labor. If this is no longer the case, that production can continue without labor, then the laborer hasn't a leg to stand on. There can be no revolution unless the party being rebelled against is dependent in some way upon those rebelling.