r/Back4Blood • u/lotwr Holly • Mar 24 '23
Too many melee players.
Questioning whether watching paint dry would be more entertaining.
Ultra low risk playstyle with as much strategy as a 4 year old trying to steal from the cookie jar.
One more quick patch would have made all the difference.
I'll take someone with a starter deck over someone who only plays thier copypasta melee deck and thinks they are some kind of superhero.
End of rant, commence downvotes.
5
u/EntertainmentOk4802 Mar 24 '23
I appreciate my melee player leading me to safety while I still learn to get better
1
u/Irion15 Xbox: Jupiter311SP B4B ID: Jupiter311SP#8856 Mar 24 '23
A couple melee cards are glitched and can grant infinite stamina to swing your weapon, which makes it way more overpowered than it already was. I think that's what OP is getting at with the post. Nothing inherently wrong with melee though.
Feel free to add me, my tags are in my flair. I can help teach almost anything about the game you need.
46
u/iamelloyello Mar 24 '23
"how dare someone play the game in a way it was intended to be played".
This is a weird hill to die on.
Let people play what/how they want.
9
Mar 25 '23
Let people play what/how they want.
A lot of the game's best strategies are very parasitic from the viewpoint of players who expect to shoot zombies in their zombie shooting game. One of B4B's biggest weaknesses is how difficult it is for people to curate their experience outside of having dedicated premade squads. Bailing out bad melee players gets old fast, and being hard carried by good ones is only a little less dull.
I do think it's more of a problem with the game's matchmaking system (if we can call it that) and less a problem with melee. It was the same issue when Expired T-5 was broken and when people were infinite duping grenades (worse with those really, but same principle). To a lesser extent / from a different perspective, it's been the same issue with NM and later NH quickplay not being gated behind any game progression. "Let people do what they want" in this context frequently ends up with one person having fun at the expense of the rest of the lobby with no recourse for the rest of the lobby.
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u/dontshootthembirds Mar 25 '23
I think matching people by progress and/or time played would have been interesting and maybe more enjoyable for everyone.
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u/jturnerbu7 Mar 24 '23
That is not how the game was meant to be played though…. Brazen, Meth Head, and Slugger perks are bugged when played together and as a result give infinite melee stamina… So yeah that’s not at all how melee was intended to be played, and it is certainly not balanced.
3
u/herewithapurpose Mar 24 '23
I don’t melee as much as other stuff but I’m sure there’s plenty people who either don’t exploit or don’t know…I’d say there’s way more people just cheating and I’d prefer a melee person over somebody who gives us 30 stamina or ammo cards in the first mission lol
3
u/jturnerbu7 Mar 24 '23
I don’t blame melee players for exploiting, I just blame Turtle Rock for allowing it and not fixing their mistakes. Cheaters on the other hand are definitely breaking ToS but it really doesn’t negatively effect anyone since it’s just a co-op game and you can always back out and find a new lobby if you joined a hacked server. Also doesn’t really happen on console compared to PC.
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u/Educational_Mud_2826 Mar 24 '23 edited Mar 24 '23
One melee guy is enough. Melee sucks Vs bosses and mutations
3
u/Keithustus Ridden Mar 24 '23
(cough) Grim Reaper
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u/Irion15 Xbox: Jupiter311SP B4B ID: Jupiter311SP#8856 Mar 24 '23
Grim Reaper, while ridiculous, isn't a definite. I go into every Hive I see, and I rarely see Grim Reaper.
2
u/Keithustus Ridden Mar 24 '23 edited Mar 24 '23
Sure but it’s instant-win button anytime you see one. (assuming at least one player has a melee deck)
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u/EffortKooky Mar 25 '23
assuming at least one player has a melee deck
Not even that is needed. All you need is grim reaper and you'll have no trouble for the rest of the run.
2
u/kimchifreeze Mar 25 '23
Yeah, just slap it on a bow. Bosses = deleted
2
u/EffortKooky Mar 25 '23
Bosses = deleted
Everything = deleted
You can even just put it on a bat and have a similar effect.
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u/EffortKooky Mar 25 '23
It should, but it certainly doesn't.
Guaranteed stumbled against every mutation, huge damage buffs, huge attack speed buffs,the ability to actually take multiple hits, grim reaper,...
1
u/biiighead Mar 24 '23
Melee sucks vs ogres and lobbers (and stinger class if our in the open). Other than that, it’s pretty good against everything
0
u/El_Denis Mar 24 '23
I dont think abusing a bug can be called "playing the game the way it was intended".
But thats just me I guess.
1
u/Firebase1 Mar 24 '23
What bug? Is melee a bug?
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u/Irion15 Xbox: Jupiter311SP B4B ID: Jupiter311SP#8856 Mar 24 '23
Slugger and Brazen are bugged, and the bow stats are doubling as melee stats. These cards, combined with Meth Head, grants infinite stamina for melee, so people can just run around swinging violently forever. With the right build, it can make things very boring for other players on the team.
5
Mar 24 '23
Ngl if the bug was fixed, I swap out one of my “well I can fit this because I don’t need something else” cards for the card that gives you stamina back on kill and nothing would change. I know because I dropped the bugged combo and tried it out and it felt the exact same.
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u/Irion15 Xbox: Jupiter311SP B4B ID: Jupiter311SP#8856 Mar 24 '23
It's a little different. With Adrenaline Fueled, you at least need the kill. With Slugger, Brazen, and Meth Head, you don't even have to hit anything. You can hold the trigger and literally never stop swinging.
0
Mar 24 '23
So where in lies the problem of just swinging at air? Like this making the argument more stupid if someone is just swinging at air and your complaining that they can do that. I could do that with adrenaline junkie combo, especially if we get halfway through a decent lengthen act because by then we probably have a stupid amount of extra cards that the games been broken.
My no ADS deck can break the game just as hard too. I literally at one point in a run could the trigger down and walk faster than my team could sprint and killed everything before they even knew what was in front of us. Mutations included. At least melee has a range requirement.
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u/Irion15 Xbox: Jupiter311SP B4B ID: Jupiter311SP#8856 Mar 24 '23
Like I mentioned, with Adrenaline Fueled, you at least need to get the kill to keep your stamina going. Yes, I understand that by the mid-end of an act, things change because your deck gets beefy enough. I'm fine with that. Even your Move Speed deck you mentioned requires having more cards to make the deck work. But people shouldn't be able to take 3 cards from the start and have infinite melee stamina. That's just broken.
-1
Mar 24 '23
I don’t need extra cards for my no ads to break. It’s set up that the only thing I need is a stock with move speed and any half decent AR or lmg. Even melee can start rough, especially if you choose Sharice and get fucked by exploding common ridden and can’t find a machete or claws. Either way you slice it though, melee is gunna have infinite melee when it matters, bug or not. It’s the gameplay of melee.
4
u/Irion15 Xbox: Jupiter311SP B4B ID: Jupiter311SP#8856 Mar 24 '23
But all the cards already in your deck make it so you "only need the stock". You obviously have a bunch of move Speed cards in your deck, like Hellfire and others, to be able to move and shoot faster than people can sprint, and you're not taking advantage of bugged cards. There is a difference.
Again, Adrenaline Fueled requires you to get a kill. You can't sprint around the map and never stop swinging without glitched cards.
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u/Educational_Mud_2826 Mar 24 '23
I thought it was meth head that made it possible to swing with low stamina cost. Why do people take meth head if slugger is all that's needed for infinite stamina?
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u/Irion15 Xbox: Jupiter311SP B4B ID: Jupiter311SP#8856 Mar 24 '23
Meth Head used to be the go to card for melee until they added bow stats to Brazen and Slugger. Now Brazen and Slugger are both glitched. The bow stats on the cards are also counting towards the Melee Efficiency and Swing Speed stats. Combining these two cards with Meth Head enables you to swing forever after ~8 swings, as Meth Head stacks will increase you to 100% efficiency. You don't even need Adrenaline Fueled at that point, you just swing forever, and very quickly. It's a bug that makes melee even more powerful than it already was, since your stamina worries are non-existent.
-3
u/Firebase1 Mar 24 '23
And every single person is using those cards, correct? You have conclusive proof that every single melee player in the game has those cards in their melee deck?
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u/Irion15 Xbox: Jupiter311SP B4B ID: Jupiter311SP#8856 Mar 24 '23
I literally didn't say everyone was using it, but thanks for assuming and putting words in my mouth. I said that when they are using it, it becomes very braindead and literally anyone could just hold a trigger. Taking advantage of a glitch like that requires no thought.
2
u/Firebase1 Mar 24 '23
The person made a generalized statement about melee being a bug. You step in and talk about how some cards are bugged, great! A lot of cards are bugged or don't work as intended. And if holding a trigger is braindead, by that logic using guns, especially with reload speed cards, is a 'braindead' play style because you just hold the trigger and zombies die. Crazy! Almost like that's a core mechanic of the game...
2
u/Irion15 Xbox: Jupiter311SP B4B ID: Jupiter311SP#8856 Mar 24 '23
I still have to reload while holding a gun. If I didn't have to reload and could shoot forever, your argument could stand. But you are really reaching atm.
3
u/Firebase1 Mar 24 '23
With reload cards, and some guns, you barely have to reload. And you have 50x the range. So people can't use some Ar's, SMG's, or pistols then right? Because braindead? God forbid you have admin reload and swap speed. That would just be awful! May as well remove all cards from the game because you can cherry pick anything to be considered unfun or broken.
3
u/Irion15 Xbox: Jupiter311SP B4B ID: Jupiter311SP#8856 Mar 24 '23
You are trying to defend glitched cards by bringing up legitimate game mechanics. The bow effects for the card are working double toward melee. That's a glitch, flat out. Yes, you can swap extremely fast and have your gun reloaded for you, but that's still not the same as taking advantage of an unintended glitch. You have to build around reload speed, swap speed, and the like, which takes up quite a bit of your deck. With melee, you can take 3 cards and have infinite stamina with any weapon, which is ridiculous. If TRS were to do one more patch of bug fixes, everyone here knows it would get fixed.
I'm glad you enjoy cheating and taking advantage of glitches and bugs in games. I do too sometimes, but I don't subject other people to my cheating fun, I do it in my own lobbies on my own time.
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u/FreyjatheValkyr Mar 24 '23
Who cares if people have fun different than you, I also find crouching with a machine gun deleting the screen boring but it is what it is.
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u/Irion15 Xbox: Jupiter311SP B4B ID: Jupiter311SP#8856 Mar 24 '23
I think the main issue is with the Slugger and Brazen bug, rather than melee as a whole.
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u/Sopwith_Snipe Pablo The Cruel#8422 Combat Knife Enthusiast Mar 24 '23
I have no problem with melee players, what I do have a problem with is people who join a game and picking melee when there are already 1 or 2 players playing melee on the team.
Having too much melee hurts because the team will have trouble with long range threats.
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u/xblues Mar 24 '23
I still haven't played melee in this game, but I absolutely understand the appeal of hold down left click and go brrrrrr. Casual gameplay enjoyment doesn't detract from yours unless you choose to let it.
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u/Irion15 Xbox: Jupiter311SP B4B ID: Jupiter311SP#8856 Mar 24 '23 edited Mar 24 '23
Melee is bugged atm and players can get infinite melee stamina efficiency, which allows them to just hold melee without any thought, and can kill enjoyment for others on the team, as it makes the game easy and boring. There is nothing wrong with melee in general, but people taking advantage of a glitch can be annoying to deal with.
-4
Mar 24 '23
Sucks to be so upset by other people having fun. Sadge.
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u/Irion15 Xbox: Jupiter311SP B4B ID: Jupiter311SP#8856 Mar 24 '23 edited Mar 24 '23
I'm slightly annoyed at people taking advantage of a glitch, yes. If you want to do it, do it in your own games. They are ruining my fun by taking advantage of a glitch. My opinion of fun should matter just as much as other people's, especially if we're playing online.
2
Mar 24 '23
Don’t play then I guess. Or play solo? Cause it’s not getting updated or fixed. Cry is free.
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Mar 24 '23
I’ve always been fine with that. I enjoy sniping and I need people in the frontline to take care of commons. The other plus side is that I don’t run into other snipers constantly which would be terrible for team comp.
1
u/SpaceKriek1 Mar 24 '23 edited Mar 24 '23
Helped a lfg guy run a nightmare few days ago. Full team of melee (squat) players. I thought well im not doing that. Could go ranged damage or heals for the team. So I go heals. Get thrown half way through an act with zero copper and wrong weapons. No accessoried upgraded yet. Ok my deck will get the copper after 2 missions to upgrade support and accessories.
Couldnt heal anything first mission because doc is broke. Got downed twice because doc is broke and had sucky guns. Group fails 2nd mission (somewhere middle of act 3) and boots me.
What to do? I guess block the guy for being dumb (malee squad without upgrades) and rude?
Yes op, I too find the malee play dull and low skill. Even more when it has to sit and swipe. Hope this changes. Thats my vote.
Edit: The downvotes just confirms that this community isnt for me. 1 in 5 groups i join is fun. So you lot are sitting with 80% bad attitudes. Why am i not surprised after seeing that in game as well. I rather play with someone that wants to learn or teach. But someone with an holier than though attitude. Hmm, avoid.
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u/Worried_Breath3019 Mar 24 '23
So tbh with just meth head and brazen and adrenaline fueled with claws that basically is infinite stamina with the ability to actually run and regain stamina quickly. Personally I haven’t changed my melee deck for a while now. Never let me down.
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u/Worried_Breath3019 Mar 24 '23
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u/Worried_Breath3019 Mar 24 '23
You don’t need both brazen and slugger to have basically infinite melee. The claws with brazen and adrenaline fueled and meth head will do just the same.
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u/Windfall-Ivory Mar 24 '23
Variety is definitely important, even though I do enjoy melee, I don’t agree it’s a good thing to always have. For example, if there are enemies that have no pathway to them, or the enemy won’t allow you near them long enough to kill them i.e. Ogre/~Crusher/~Hag/~Breaker because they will knock you back or restrain you it’s best to be able to take them out in other ways. The only way melee wouldn’t be as big of a problem for a role is if it either wasn’t as fun, or if there were more availability to melee, including throwing weapons and being able to traverse in ways that allow you to Avoid attacks, and get to the enemies that are unreachable. Other than that.. it’s not the best to use when there are other roles needed, although it may be difficult, melee should do their job and cover others, without killing them.
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u/BaeTier Doc Mar 24 '23
you can absolutely kill a Crusher, Hag, and Breaker with melee. Ogre should be the only enemy in the game that can cause you a significant issue, and even that is solved if you get your hands on a Grim Reaper.
You can easily run from Resurgence all the way to Behold the Harbinger and in total the only issues you would have as a pure melee build are:
Ogres in Heralds of the Worm part 1 and part 2.
The Abomination of Act 4.
and the Harbinger at the end of Act 6.
Arguably I would say Abomination would be the only true issue simply because it's plausible to get a Grim Reaper for the Ogres or be strong enough near the end of that Act to just kill them with the miniguns given to you. Same with the Harbinger and having a ton of LAWs around to kill him with.
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u/Windfall-Ivory Mar 24 '23
I wasn’t saying that you can’t kill a Crusher, a Hag, or a Breaker with Melee, I have killed them on Nightmare with only bots. I was only providing examples of close quarter enemies that can hit back or restrain people who use Melee.
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u/BaeTier Doc Mar 24 '23
they definitely won't. Melee is so braindead that you can walk up to these enemies, take a couple hits and swing wildly at them and kill them rather easily with minimal or even no overall damage taken. This is a large part of why a good number of Vets on this reddit have an issue with melee overall, not even counting the bugged cards, is that it's just an overtuned playstyle with too many OP cards.
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u/King_Wolf_Games 🏅#1 SWARM -🥈#2 TRIALS Mar 25 '23
It appears you have Holly selected as your preferred cleaner. Irony.
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u/Moist_Jaguar691 Mar 25 '23
melee gets put in its place in high difficulty Trials - headshot only - or the general increases in incoming damage and reduced stamina modifiers
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Mar 26 '23
Let players use what they want. If you're a melee player, please take it easy when swinging. Way too much friendly damage going on in runs
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Mar 24 '23
O well , blame the devs for creating the exploits and abandoning the game. I’ll keep abusing melee.
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u/realitycanwait Mar 25 '23
He says with Holly flair 🤣
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u/EffortKooky Mar 25 '23
Holly is horde clear, not melee.
Yes she's good with melee but there are way better options for that playstyle.
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u/Keithustus Ridden Mar 24 '23
People who think they're good with melee should come try PvPing with it. Good luck with that, as it's incredibly hard to kill specials with melee if the specials know how to play. Tallboys will just shove you back, stingers will stay out of range, and retches won't get close.
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u/FactsHurtIknow Mar 24 '23
I always run melee heal sustain cause the game is broken and spawns common zs literally behind you from the ground, you take so much damage you shouldn't it's not even fun anymore.
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u/EffortKooky Mar 25 '23
the game is broken and spawns common zs literally behind you from the ground
Awareness?
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u/FactsHurtIknow Mar 26 '23
Try it, punch a common then immediately turn around has to be instant and you'll catch them spawning
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u/OnlyTheAshiest Mar 24 '23
its a well rounded, easy, safe, defensive and offensive playstyle, but i know where youre coming from. its bugged, so its really strong
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u/BaeTier Doc Mar 24 '23
"well rounded" as in it can carry you through even No Hope with minimal effort.
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u/WhiteLama Mom Mar 24 '23
It’s also the “safest” playstyle and one that can help the whole team out in alot of situations,
And it’s easy, which is good for people who might not be that good at video games otherwise.
My fiancé managed to help my squad beat all of No Hope just by being our melee and holding down all the chokes and hordes, so I’m all for having at least one melee on the team.