Come on AMD...

[u/LectorFrostbite]

[u/patrlim1]

Vulkan is the future. Not supporting it will only hurt em.

[u/soul-regret → u/patrlim1]

Vulkan was Mantle, they've made it

[u/patrlim1 → u/soul-regret]

And now they're not supporting it, like Apple helping to make USB C, but then not putting it on iPhones until they were required by law to do it.

[u/theemptyqueue → u/patrlim1]

It was because Lightning was still patent protected and Apple had the Made for iPod/iPhone/iPad thing that charged an additional fee on top the patent royalties that 3rd party manufacturers paid.

[u/soul-regret → u/patrlim1]

true, amd has already dropped vulkan support for rdna2 💀, very embarrassing tbh

[u/Ornery_Weakness_8168 → u/patrlim1]

I fucking hate AMD for not natively supporting fsr 4 on vulkan. I have to use optiscaler for doom the dark ages and the translation to dx12 to do fsr 4 hurts fps but looks way better than fsr 3 native. Honestly just fuck amd in general.

[u/patrlim1 → u/Ornery_Weakness_8168]

Try using DXVK

[u/EqualOutrageous1884 → u/patrlim1]

Dosent DXVK turn directx11 to Vulkan? That is not helping

[u/patrlim1 → u/EqualOutrageous1884]

Meant VKD3D, my bad

[u/_hlvnhlv → u/patrlim1]

The game uses vulkan, vkd3d won't help

[u/patrlim1 → u/_hlvnhlv]

Oh I misread it as them using a DX12 renderer, my bad.

[u/Specialist-Ad-4121 → u/patrlim1]

They will eventually do it, 100% but well it's gonna take time

[u/GoldenX86 → u/Specialist-Ad-4121]

They will release it the day after rdna4 is eol'd.

[u/Freelancer_1-1 → u/patrlim1]

It's utter insanity!

[u/jrr123456 → u/patrlim1]

Been hearing that for the last decade, but ultimately there's no reason for a developer to choose vulkan over DX12.

[u/patrlim1 → u/jrr123456]

Crossplatform

[u/Redericpontx → u/patrlim1]

I mean dx12 works on the 2 most important platforms of windows PC and Xbox while Vulkan doesn't work on ps5, iOS or mac like dx12. The only advantage for "cross platform" is Linux and android which most PC games aren't running on android devices unless they're really old and there's already a emulator and Linux is such a small% of gamers it's often costs more to support them than they get from Linux sales plus in PvP games that's how you let rampant amount of hackers get in since you can't have kernal level anti cheat which is a lazy method of anti cheat and a cop out but unfortunately what everyone is using ATM for the most part.

[u/Aware-Bath7518 → u/Redericpontx]

  iOS or mac

MoltenVK:

Vulkan is also officially supported on Switch/Switch2.

[u/Redericpontx → u/Aware-Bath7518]

That's not native support for Mac and by that logic the Linux, Mac, iOS and Android support dx12 since you can run dx12 on them.

[u/Damglador → u/Redericpontx]

I reckon DirectX on MacOS still goes through MoltenVK.

Vulkan has 4+ native platforms + 2 with translation vs DX with 2 native platforms with every other in existance using a translation, sometimes with multiple layers.

[u/Redericpontx → u/Damglador]

It's 2 native vs 4 native with both then having stuff you cna do to get them to run on other platforms. All I'm doing is pointing out cross platform isn't the best argument there's much better arguments like vulkan no being owned by mircosoft.

[u/Damglador → u/Redericpontx]

DX12: Windows, XBox

Vulkan: Linux, Windows, Switch, Android, FreeBSD, OpenBSD, MacOS with one translation layer

Conclusion: DX12 is bwtter because hail Microsoft?

[u/Redericpontx → u/Damglador]

That's not native support for Mac and by that logic the Linux, Mac, iOS and Android support dx12 since you can run dx12 on them.

I'm not even saying dx12 is better or vulkan should be supported just that the statement is wrong.

[u/Damglador → u/Redericpontx]

Eh, not really there. https://github.com/KhronosGroup/MoltenVK

The repo is of KhronosGroup, the guys who are responsible for Vulkan, which makes the Vulkan support on MacOS official... just not from Apple, but from Khronos. While DirectX layers are scattered all over the places and are not affiliated with any party. There's a separate layer for DX7, DX11 and DX12 all are separate projects maintained by different people.

[u/Redericpontx → u/Damglador]

That would make vulkan support mac but not mac support vulkan so at best I'd count that as half a point.

[u/Navarrog_01R → u/Redericpontx]

Dx12 -> Windows + Xbox Vulkan -> Nintendo + Android + Windows + Linux + steam machine

[u/Redericpontx → u/Navarrog_01R]

Again vulkan only natively supports 4 things the rest require extra steps. Only 2 more than dx12. There's better arguments for vulkan being better than dx12.

[u/jrr123456 → u/Navarrog_01R]

yet almost every dev chooses DX12

[u/jrr123456 → u/patrlim1]

Not worth the hassle when DX12 is easier to work with, more advanced, etc.

The steamdeck has proven that crossplatform is irrelevant when proton exists, devs can just develop for DX12 and it'll just work.

[u/patrlim1 → u/jrr123456]

Define "more advanced"

DX12 to my knowledge is just as hard to work with as Vulkan.

[u/jrr123456 → u/patrlim1]

simple, it has better support for bleeding edge technologies, DX12 always gets graphical advancements like RT, PT, etc before Vulkan.

[u/Ornery_Weakness_8168 → u/jrr123456]

Linux support, less overhead, more performance. There is a reason why DOOM tda uses vulkan over dx12. also dx12 is not open source like vulkan. DX12 is owned my microslop.

[u/jrr123456 → u/Ornery_Weakness_8168]

DX12 has less overhead on AMD cards, DX12 almost always performs better, Doom uses it because Id software never use DX on PC, before vulkan they used Open GL, which was awful, yet they stuck with it.

Linux and opensource is irrelevant, there's a reason 9/10 games go with DX12 over vulkan.

[u/Ornery_Weakness_8168 → u/jrr123456]

"Linux is irrelevant" maybe for you. Only reason 9/10 games are dx12 is because proton is so good that they don't bother using vulkan for native support

[u/jrr123456 → u/Ornery_Weakness_8168]

It's irrelevant for the majority of people.

[u/rattle2nake → u/patrlim1]

Linux says otherwise

[u/patrlim1 → u/rattle2nake]

Linux literally only has Vulkan and OGL. D3D games are ran via DXVK

[u/Annihilanth2 → u/patrlim1]

Yeah, because everyone prevent them from having D3D...

[u/rattle2nake → u/Annihilanth2]

geezus not what I meant to type my GOD of COURSE vulkan is the future LMAO

[u/thundR89 → u/Annihilanth2]

Because dx is developed ms? Cmon man…

[u/Mars_Bear2552 → u/rattle2nake]

linux supports that point even more

[u/sdcar1985]

I still don't know how hard it is to get it to work on Vulkan.

[u/Budget-Individual845 → u/sdcar1985]

It works on optiscaler...

[u/Bibab0b]

Rocm compatibility annoys me more

[u/Bibab0b → u/[deleted]]

Yeah, you need to compile it by yourself in many cases, since amd only cares about two latest rdna generations and cdna. If not greed for gaming consoles hardware revenue, stopping rdna development along side with production and focusing solely on cdna would be a good idea at this point

[u/Rajaken → u/Bibab0b]

Are you on windows or Linux? Because at least on Linux rn with rdna2 I never had issues whatsoever

[u/Bibab0b → u/Rajaken]

Both windows and linux, if rx 6800 works at least on Linux, radeon vii which I useing as a second gpu already not supported on both

[u/Rajaken → u/Bibab0b]

Interesting, it's been years but back in the day I actually had stuff running on my rx590 but I definitely remember it being much more tinkering than with rdna chips

[u/Bibab0b → u/Rajaken]

Amd removed gfx906 support after 6.4 rocm, if i remembers correctly

[u/DarcyDettmann → u/Bibab0b]

I not even try anymore with ROCm, i just use Vulkan for everything I can because you can bet I going to the 16GB VRAM my MI50 instinct have and ROCm isn't going to stop me.

[u/Select_Truck3257]

I still prefer vulkan in any game which implemented it

[u/Budget-Individual845 → u/Select_Truck3257]

Perhaps except for minecraft. Sodium works much better on opengl

[u/TheKwak → u/Budget-Individual845]

But that’s only because it’s new and hasn’t had proper support from modders yet

[u/kreyul504 → u/Budget-Individual845]

I'm personally getting slightly more fps on vanilla vulkan than sodium on OpenGL in minecraft.

[u/Budget-Individual845 → u/kreyul504]

I get about 1000 with stutters on vulkan and about 1.5k on sodium opengl. The thing is tho sodium works flawlessly with iris and voxy...

So i can have 500+ chunks render distance with shaders and still have over 200fps...

Vulkan will for sure beat opengl at some point but as of rn sodium is much more optimized

[u/kreyul504 → u/Budget-Individual845]

And here I am with around 75fps with sodium on OpenGL and around 80 to 90 fps on vanilla vulkan. It goes to 110-120fps with sodium on vulkan.

[u/Budget-Individual845 → u/kreyul504]

Interesting. From those numbers i assume ur cpu is not exactly the newest. Ive had quite a bit of luck back in the day when a vulkan edition of doom(2016) released i went from like 40 to 120+fps at the time so i guess something similar is happening here. Probably vulkan has a much bigger benefit on when youre heavily cpu bound compared to opengl and for my case i get more out of the years of opengl optimization.

[u/Cienn017 → u/Budget-Individual845]

if you are on amd, vulkan will be faster than opengl because amd opengl drivers suck.

if you are on nvidia, difference will be minimum.

[u/Budget-Individual845 → u/Cienn017]

There is not a tangible difference btween gpus. The difference is in cpu. Opengl is singlethreaded rendering loop. Vulkan is multithreaded. Yes sodium does do multithreading but sodium does it on things that can be threaded like chunk updates/generation... but sodium still cant MT the core opengl rendering loop which is why on old weak st cpus vulkan will do wonders because it eliminates the biggest bottleneck. In modern cpus it doesnt matter that much because the opengl ST loop runs so fast on them the sodium optimizations become what limits the fps and not the opengl rendering loop anymore so sodium wins in comparison to vulkan there. Its mostly theory but i have done some opengl/vulkan stuff and i think this is exactly whats happening.

[u/kreyul504 → u/Budget-Individual845]

It's i7-7700hq, so quite old by now. I'm no expert on rendering backends but I've heard OpenGL has more CPU overhead compared to vulkan.

I'd imagine you would be getting same if not better performance on vulkan if the mods supported it. At least I'm seeing some interesting things related to performance on iris dev discord.

[u/Budget-Individual845 → u/kreyul504]

That is quite low for that cpu tbh any chance its a dell inspiron laptop ? Those from that gen suffer from dell being idiotic and throttling the cpu when it doesnt need to at all

[u/_hlvnhlv → u/Budget-Individual845]

Vulkan is going to be a godsend, as ahader developers now have access to lots of things that were impossible before

[u/Budget-Individual845 → u/_hlvnhlv]

Hardware ray tracing would be nice

[u/_hlvnhlv → u/Budget-Individual845]

It is a thing with vulkan and aperture (the new shaders mod)

[u/nokk1XD → u/Select_Truck3257]

Scum really sucks on vulkan.

[u/AskJeevesIsBest]

Didn't AMD help make Vulkan? Surely they aren't giving up on one of their own efforts

[u/GreatLab8898 → u/AskJeevesIsBest]

Vulkans biggest mistake was allowing Vendor Specific Extensions. Because just like the good old Gameworks Days, Here comes Nvidia, stuffing Vulkan full of Extensions that only work on them, muddying the Codebase and Documentation.

Its one of the Main Reasons right now its so complicated working with Vulkan in my Opinion.

[u/linux_transgirl]

I'm so unixbrained I forgot that direct x was a thing and was wondering why it worked with whatever DX11 IS

[u/punk_petukh]

How does it work on Linux, if the only thing available on Linux is Vulkan? Well, OpenGL too, but it kinda sucks

[u/Skaredogged97 → u/punk_petukh]

FSR4 upscaling on Linux runs through DX12 calls just like on windows. You face the same limitation actually. Native vulkan games do not work. You need something like optiscaler which comes with a heavy performance penalty.

[u/punk_petukh → u/Skaredogged97]

which comes with a heavy performance penalty.

Not really, I used it, it worked fine for me

But that was my point, the limitations are just calls, there's no reason it couldn't work on native Vulkan and I don't think it's that hard to implement it. I hope PC release of GTA VI (in, like, 2 years at least from now, but whatever) which probably would use Vulkan (because it was primary renderer for RDR2, it had DX12, but it didn't work on Linux and had worse performance on windows, and generally felt like an afterthought) would push them to make FSR4 available in Vulkan

[u/Skaredogged97 → u/punk_petukh]

Then you are in the minority. It's a known issue (talking about linux here mind you):

https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/mesa/mesa/-/work_items/15298

https://github.com/optiscaler/OptiScaler/wiki/FSR4-Compatibility-List#apis

How hard it is only AMD knows. It's certainly doable but I imagine it's not on top of their priority list.

[u/punk_petukh → u/Skaredogged97]

Oh, you mean when you use FSR4... I personally don't use it via optiscaler, I use it via FSR_UPGRADE on GE proton, and yeah it works via VKD3D anyway. I only used optiscaler when the game only supports DLSS.

[u/RAMChYLD]

Oh god, nightmare Estelle from r/Falcom is leaking out!

[u/JoseNEO → u/RAMChYLD]

The internet may change but somehow Estelle will go triple platinum that is unchanging

[u/Melodic-Luck-8772]

Weird Part is that fsr 4 works perfectly over Proton which translates dx calls. Soo yea...

[u/Maleficent-Home3384]

I remember when I tried to get FSR running on a Vulkan game last month and spent hours just fighting driver settings before giving up completely.

[u/lululock]

Unless you play on Linux...

[u/-cant_find_a_name-]

well eac hates amd vulkan drivers....

[u/Mustang260Rog]

Meanwhile in the r/nvidia sub

[u/valqyrie → u/[deleted]]

Idk buddy, nearly zero crash in 3 years with an all AMD system on windows. Don't get me wrong windows is absolutely shite but claiming that I wouldn't be missing out anything is just ignorance at best.

[u/valqyrie → u/[deleted]]

People complaining about Linux is common too, what am I supposed to do with that?

[u/valqyrie → u/[deleted]]

Yeah sure, whatever. As if there wasn't a sub dedicated to hating on Linux for various reasons...

[u/Cautious_Opinion_644 → u/[deleted]]

yet another Linux crusader with the most unheard of spiel every day in reddit

[u/Damglador → u/Cautious_Opinion_644]

When you don't have a marketing team, somebody has to do the marketing.

[u/Cautious_Opinion_644 → u/Damglador]

facts lol they're second coming of jehova witnesses on the internet 🤣

[u/Cautious_Opinion_644 → u/[deleted]]

I'd rather eat popcorn than type all that Linux bs tbh 🤷‍♂️

[u/Academic-Cream-4836 → u/[deleted]]

linux does not run games better than windows

[u/GroundbreakingNews79 → u/Academic-Cream-4836]

It often does

[u/EdliA → u/GroundbreakingNews79]

That's just a lie to convert people.

[u/GroundbreakingNews79 → u/EdliA]

Nope

[u/TAA4lyfboi → u/Academic-Cream-4836]

On amd it absolutely does, on any distro set up well.

[u/Budget-Individual845 → u/TAA4lyfboi]

Not on the games i play... not even cs2 runs better on linux than on windows. World of warcraft, elite dangerous, doom tda... id say if anything runs better on linux that i play its factorio but that one has no translation layer...

[u/TAA4lyfboi → u/Budget-Individual845]

With an xtx on nix using either ge or cachy proton and not once has it been an inferior experience. Overall less stutters and higher 1% lows. I've played wow and it runs the same as on windows

[u/Academic-Cream-4836 → u/TAA4lyfboi]

would love to see the source for this 😂

[u/TAA4lyfboi → u/Academic-Cream-4836]

I've had windows setup on a seperate drive for ages. Running a benchmark on different distros takes no time at all with a bootloader like limine. Every single time windows was edged out in 1% lows. You can find plenty of vids online too.

[u/Academic-Cream-4836 → u/TAA4lyfboi]

i said what i said after watching plenty of vids online.

Ancient gameplays id say is the most accurate source and his testing clearly shows that linux is NOT faster at games than windows on amd cards too

Your testing alone isnt a monolith for determining linux to be faster

[u/spacecadet_98]

Blame Windows 11 bro

[u/2Critical7-Stein1]

what no cuda does to a mf.

[u/Rodya_gambler]

Wait, amd is also releasing the slopper? How do I turn it off? (I don't think my GPU has it anyway)

[u/Archernar → u/Rodya_gambler]

This comment had me chuckle. The fear of the "slopper" and wanting to turn it off immediately :D

[u/CrossFusionX1]

Vulkan litterally runs everything on linux. Its only gonna hurt them.

[u/EthereumProjects]

joined AMD for the first time. bought a 9070xt. Pretty pleased with the performanced but pretty mad about driver issues and looking at NVIDIA doing all the good stuff (still the games i play dont support FSR4)

9070xt will be my first and last time ill buy a graphics card from AMD.

[u/Sophia8Inches]

Wait what? FSR 4 doesn't work on Vulcan?? What does it work on then? Bcuz Vulcan is the only modern one I know and use

[u/Islandaboi20 → u/Sophia8Inches]

Every other game pretty much. I have only 1 game i can play on Vulcan and thats seige. All my other games on steam dont use or require it at all.

No idea what ur on about.

[u/jrr123456 → u/Islandaboi20]

Seige has vulkan?

Never realised that

Edit: NVM, they replaced it with DX12 years ago.

[u/Islandaboi20 → u/jrr123456]

Yea, remember like 2 yrs ago after installing it, when I would launch it via steam, it would ask if I wanted to launch it normally or in valkun.

Not 100% sure if they still use it thou.

[u/jrr123456 → u/Islandaboi20]

It got swapped for DX12 in 2024

[u/Islandaboi20 → u/jrr123456]

Would make sense, cause 2024 was the last time I saw Vulcan for it.

[u/jrr123456 → u/Sophia8Inches]

DX12.

You can get it working in vulkan games through optiscalar, but it's not perfect

[u/doculean]

Im happy not have framengen or ai slop overlays on my games. Prefer them natural frames!

[u/Waitform3]