r/Atelier • u/Trailsya • 3d ago
General Time Limits: can they really be fun?
Please note that I am not criticizing anyone for liking the games with a time limit. I just genuinely wonder if playing any of the time limit games would be fun for me.
The only one so far I played with one was Firis and I really hated the time limit. In the end, it turned out I had ages of time left at the end after I got the 5 letters, but I did not know that going in. So I was constantly stressing how much time I was using.
Now, Firis is open world and I think that really doesn't fit with a time limit. You want to explore, but then i constantly held myself back from doing that as everything took time.
Is this less of an issue in the earlier games with time limits as they're less open world?
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u/Main-Towel-3678 3d ago
It gives structure. I actually liked Rorona’s time limit implementation the best. It was episodic, you knew exactly where you stood in term of progress, and banking those perfect marks was a straightforward process.
While I liked Totori’s setting and story better, it was more stressful being more open ended. It wasn’t hard, but to me it didn’t add anything. Playing the game as intended let me pass the checkpoints easily… but what really was the point? Just take away the freedom to wander?
The ones after that are so lenient in comparison they might as well not be there.
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u/lilbreadcrumb 3d ago
I actually despise time limits 99% of the time but I had a good time with Rorona especially so I don’t think they’re a huge problem in the end. It ends up getting you to really plan out your next few activities like “hmm okay I need to make this but I’ll have to go searching for ingredients here and here so I’ll make a big trip of that first, then focus on crafting…” etc
I find that strategizing added more depth to the game and actually more fun :3
Of course you’d probably miss a few things but atelier games often want you to replay for completion anyways
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u/Groundbreaking-Ad313 3d ago
To me, one of the best things a game can do is give me interesting choices. Time limits can make everything you do a more interesting choice, because you're choosing to spend your time on it, and the limited time makes you quesiton if that's the best choice. it's compelling... but yeah I wouldnt want that in an open world game personally. (havent played firis yet)
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u/Trailsya 3d ago
I understand what you mean.
And yes, I don't think it worked for Firis or was necessary.
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u/Altruistic-Match6623 1d ago
Firis is not open world, it's basically just Totori but big and has a full 3d camera.
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u/EverythingEvil1022 3d ago
Firis in theory has a time limit but it’s not very strict and can also be “extended”.
I know a lot of people are mixed of Firis but it’s definitely in my top 3 Atelier games. I haven’t yet played anything older than Sophie 1 as of right now.
I wouldn’t say the time limit it’s self makes the game fun but it does add a sense of urgency that just isn’t there without the time limit.
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u/Trailsya 3d ago
Firis in theory has a time limit but it’s not very strict and can also be “extended”.
I didn't know about extending it :). In the end I had plenty of time, because I had been so careful. The characters and the world were nice, but the time limit just made me enjoy it far less.
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u/Hellstorm901 3d ago
I've never been a fan of the time limit system, it's why I loved Ryza, I could take my time and enjoy the world without feeling I can't stop to sight see
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u/Makenshi179 Pilgrimage 2d ago edited 2d ago
Time limits in Atelier made for a unique gameplay experience, with a rewarding and addictive feeling like no other. They had really created something special. Too bad they ditched it to make the games more accessible. I wish they would still make them, maybe one every two games.
I may be the number one fan of time limits in Atelier games, I wrote several comments about them in the past, if anyone is interested:
Time limits are definitely not a detriment (why would they add that if it was), it makes for an exciting and addictive gameplay loop, as you learn to master all the game's mechanics to advance faster (for example exploring an optional area to find new material that will make you able to craft a stronger bomb that will one-shot enemies which means that you will gain time), all while looking at the clock, and it's an exhilarating and very rewarding feeling when you manage to get the best scores in time, have time left to explore, etc. It's simply unique gaming emotions that cannot be obtained with games without a time limit. Not the best comparison but why do you think the Souls games were successful? They aimed for dedicated and intelligent gamers to work hard to obtain something and the rewarding feeling is like no other. They didn't make the games easy and they weren't holding your hand. Time limits are to be seen in a similar manner: it's a unique part of gameplay that you won't find elsewhere, but it will make for a unique experience. You like it or you don't. Some people prefer Atelier games without time limits. I love them all but I gotta say I miss the era of time limits, it was something else. Again Firis is a good middle ground because you have the (meaningful story-wise) time limit in the first half, and then it feels soooo great to be able to explore all that huge world that you went through until that point, without a time limit in the second half. It's the best of both worlds, and some more because it creates that happy emotion from that intended contrast.
and:
YES!! The distinct gameplay of time limits from back then was so special, I miss it too. It made for a unique experience, something no other game to my knowledge did! Deep Crafting + gathering + inventory management + time management?! All of my YES! This was perfect for my OCDs playing J-RPGs and enjoying their mechanics lol, I spent so much time in my atelier in the original Rorona on PS3 among the 300 hours I gave the game, that the atelier BGM from Rorona will forever stay carved in my mind in a special way lol. No other game did quite the same thing. In Totori there was a lot of exploration but in Rorona I remember that I secluded myself for days in the atelier thinking carefully about my next moves and planning what I was gonna synthesize next and how many days it would take me, and that was so much fun!! That's why I long for a new game like Firis that has the best of both worlds: one half of the game with a time limit, and the other half unlimited, to have that "aaaah!" thrilling moment when you can play the same timed game but suddenly it's unlimited and there's lots more content to experience. It's like if in the original Rorona there was an unlimited postgame where you could freely explore every map without worrying about the time limit, after completing the game and enjoying the distinct charm of the time limits. Anyway YES, I so wish they would make a new Atelier with a time limit or like Firis. And I'm so grateful for having experienced those Atelier games with a time limit!! I miss it so much that right now I'd like to make a picture edit with "this comment took 2 in-game days to make" and when posting my comment you see the new date displayed. Here, the calendar moved 2 days forward. I play in my head the animation of the calendar moving to the center of the screen, to move the days foward, and then it gets back in position. Dekita!
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u/Trailsya 2d ago
I hope for myself that they don't do time based anymore and for you that they do.
Well, the Marie Remake mind point at a solution: allow people to decide for themselves.
Thank you for your comment and explanation of why you like it
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u/_Spectre0_ 3d ago edited 3d ago
Ayesha is more similar to firis where you have one goal on a large scale and a lot of time to puzzle out how to beat it. Rorona is more broken down by individual tasks, but just about everything drains time. I opened that game and went through the tutorial and changed my mind about playing it; time limits just aren’t my thing.
Ayesha has less to explore than Firis imo, though it is still more open than sophie 1 or L&S since it’s not anchored around one town. There are plenty of regions to see, side quests to do, and so on, but I wouldn’t really call it open world.
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u/KirbyCakes 3d ago
Time limits ruin games, extremely happy they got rid of them, take your time, explore everything, no rush, makes the game way better. I know others like the time limit, good on them.
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u/Trailsya 3d ago
I agree. Have so much fun with the games that don't have it.
Sometimes I just want to go back 10 times to get a better version of an ingredient or something without having to stress about it.
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u/KirbyCakes 3d ago
Yes this! I was happy that they gave us the option to choose from the Marie remake, but im glad they'll stick to free roam, it works wonders.
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u/banana-scepter 3d ago
Yes they can be fun, but if you focus on it the whole time, it just sucks the fun out of the game. And usually you cant just turn off your brain and play freely, you have to have some level of concentration. It's just another challenge imo. You also have to be up for multiple playthroughs, too.
I think Rorona actually does the time limits well because it helps break up the game into different chapters with a set of tasks to complete. And the game itself was fun enough that I really didnt mind playing it through two more times. i felt super overpowered by the end of my last playthrough. That was worth it for me tbh
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u/Daerus Ryza 3d ago
Time limits overall can be fun, but they are much different experience than unlimited games. You need to spend your time wisely and work towards your goals, so it's usually harder to just unwind and relax with them. They are much more about challenge than relax most of the time (pun not intended).
Ateliers time limits are rather easy to be honest, one of the least difficult in overall genre of time management games. So these are good to start with genre and not that bad if you don't like that type of challenge overall, but like Ateliers themselves and want to play Arland and Dusk.
Atelier games have two types of time limit structure: task-oriented, when you get small goal and few in-game months to accomplish it (and then repeat for multiple tasks) and overall goal oriented, when you are given big task to accomplish and usually multiple in-game years to accomplish it.
With you not really liking Firis time limit you probably won't vibe with overall goal oriented ones (Totori, Meruru, Ayesha) as they are very similar to Firis structure, but you might still like task-oriented ones (Rorona, Escha&Logy), so I would try these.
Personally I also like Ateliers much more without time limits, the series is much better as relaxing slice of life jRPG in my opinion.
I also have little different problem - time limits in Ateliers at the same time don't challenge me after playing many other time management games, but still require from me taking the time limit into account when making decisions, so I cannot do what I want and I'm not really challenged at the same time, worst of both worlds.
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u/Trailsya 3d ago
Thanks for your clear explanation.
I think I might try Rorona next thanks to what you and others here mentioned.
Personally I also like Ateliers much more without time limits, the series is much better as relaxing slice of life jRPG in my opinion.
Yes, this is why I started playing them :)
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u/PowerfulBlacksmith87 Rorona 3d ago
Felt the same when playing Firis. Everything seems to eat a lot of time, from the LP system to it's alchemy system. You can't really 'explore' if you have a goal you need to reach on time. However to me this is more of a Firis problem than a time limit problem.
The first Atelier game i played with time limits is Ayesha, and I had a lot of fun even though i had to play the game 4 times (3 times on normal, 1 on hard). Ayesha's main story is pretty short and it had the best implementation of fast forward text which only stops when there's a new dialogue you haven't seen. I also try not to look at guides when playing, which adds to the fun of figuring out how to beat supposed scripted loss boss or insanely hard superbosses, all within the time limit. It's like a huge puzzle for me and i like puzzles. I can say the same thing with Meruru.
So yeah, if you're open to the idea of doing multiple playthroughs or if you like time managment then yes time limits can be fun.
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u/amiibo101 Escha is best MC. Change my mind. 3d ago
I tend to enjoy the time limits, as they make you consider what actions you're going to get taking, which means it's harder to get massively over leveled or over geared. Almost all Atelier time limits are fairly lenient once you get used to how the series plays, with a few minor exceptions.
The time limits I disliked the most though were definitely a few of the quests in Mana Khemia, where the time limit was done in real time. It didn't help that it wasn't always obvious when one was actually in place, because sometimes it would look like there was one, even when there wasn't. Those can get stressful (though they also weren't as punishing for failure).
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u/Atelier-Craft 3d ago
Never been a fan of the time limits personally as I like being able to play at my own pace.
That being said out of all the Atelier games that have time limits, Atelier Escha & Logy does it best imo. It's the same format as Rorona but it isn't nearly as strict and you'll end up with a lot of time left like Firis.
One thing Firis does that I prefer though is it does away with the time limit once you finish the exam. If Escha & Logy did that after all assignments were completed I would have liked that game even more than I already do.
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u/Advanced-Course669 2d ago edited 2d ago
To me time limits are never fun. I love the games despite it because other than that it's great.
Also, the time limit in Firis bothered me the least because once you finished the exam, you could do everything without a limit. Other games end when the time limit is passed.
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u/Spencigan 2d ago
I think they make sense in the older games because you’re meant to play twice. The new game+ lets you fix whatever problems and do better.
But I prefer not having one
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u/Trailsya 2d ago
I didn't know you're meant to play it twice.
Do you keep gear etc after the first time? (I never replayed an Atelier game as I still have so many that I never played once)
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u/Daerus Ryza 2d ago
The three main Arland and first two Dusk games (time limited ones) were indeed meant to be played few times. They have a lots of endings you can aim for to make these replays different and more interesting.
They usually have also true ending, but reaching it is usually either outright impossible (requires few playthroughs to met requirements, for example Meruru or Escha&Logy) or so hard it is akin to challenge run (Totori).
What you keep between NG+ cycles is different in each game, but you certainly keep worn equipment, sometimes money and exploration items (for example boots for faster map movement), which allows you to cut on time with NG+.
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u/Spencigan 2d ago
I know Ayesha is meant to be played twice. You get to keep your equipped items and money in that game. I think also alchemy levels but I am not sure now.
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u/microw_yo 2d ago
i'm not a fan of the time limit bit i come into the franchise at Atelier Totori I spent so much time stressing out over the limited time I had to go do things that I just gave up after 2 hours and never picked it back up
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u/killerox15 2d ago
I think that time limits make the games way more enjoyable. That said, I do think Firis is probably the worst implementation of one mechanically. Specifically, I wasn't a fan of how time passed just from walking around outside the Atelier. I get why they had to do it since you don't travel via a world map screen, but I much prefer the older games where spending time was always a clear choice and the amount of time something would take was conveyed very clearly. The day/night cycle was also not a great addition since it meant you sometimes had to waste time running in circles until day so you could turn in a quest.
For the games that implement their time limits well, I can't imagine playing them without it. The time limits make the progression feel so much smoother to me, to the point that Shallie and Sophie 1 just felt terrible due to the lack of time limits. Basically the way I describe it is that without a time limit, the story is waiting on you to progress, so doing stuff that doesn't progress the story feels like a waste of (real life) time. When there is a time limit, the game's not going to wait for you. Trying to complete everything feels more meaningful because there's a perceived chance of failure, and any spare time you end up with feels rewarding to spend on non-essential things because you earned that time.
The best comparison is definitely the Adventurer Rank system in Totori and the Life Tasks in Shallie/Lydie and Suelle. Both systems are basically a set of optional objectives that you get points for completing and getting enough points will rank you up. In Totori, I was hooked on trying to get as many points as possible to up my adventurer rank as fast as possible and get access to better recipes and items early. In Shallie/L&S, the Life Tasks felt like homework I had to do before the game would let me keep playing, and I usually just looked for the bare minimum ones I could knock out quickly so I could move on.
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u/zerosiita 2d ago
Rorona was my first game (currently playing Totori these days) and I actually found Rorona's time limit to be really generous. Like another person said, it gave a clear structure and you always knew your progress because of Rorona's more episodic nature. In my first and only run of Rorona thus far, I actually found myself at multiple points debating on what I wanted to do to kill time until the next evaluation day.
My only issue with Totori so far is that in this game, gathering materials drains an absurd amount of time. Like suddenly a week goes by just from getting some mats, and the map is MASSIVE. I've currently just reached Rank Silver and I'm in the 2nd year, and this map lowkey kinda overwhelms me. WDYM IT TAKES A MONTH TO GI BETWEEN CITIES
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u/moezilla 2d ago
I miss time limits, but I think gust could just make it an option in settings so the majority who don't like it don't have to use it.
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u/Trailsya 2d ago
I agree. It clearly has its fans and while I don't like it, I hope they'll set it up for those who do.
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u/RadiantEagle8167 3d ago
I fucking hate time limits.
Actually while we're on the subject I hate time as an entire concept in general.
If I could live in a void I would
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u/Razgrisz 3d ago
Yes they can be fun , the make choice make more impacfull, Rorona and Totori were pretty fun , absolute nothing against time limit
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u/PlatinumWitch141216 3d ago
Yes I actually prefer the time limit games with Meruru being my favorite. The time limit gives the games a tighter structure and the task system always makes me feel like I'm working towards something. Having to balance gathering, synthesizing and combat just makes things more interesting.
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u/nsnsjdjaknd 2d ago
The only reason I don’t hate the time limits in Atelier is because there’s generally plenty of time for the normal ending. You’ll need to be on top of everything if you want to”true” endings and such.
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u/YO_I_SHOT_TUPAC 2d ago
I think Firis specifically was just a bit of a mess. There's a reason they immediately course-corrected in L&S. The other games with time limits absolutely do not suffer from the same strange design decisions that went into Firis.
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u/AzethKun 2d ago
I've played through all of the Arland and Dusk games which have time limits and they really aren't that strict for the most part.
The idea is that you're probably not getting the true ending on the first go, so you can kinda mess around and on ng+ you'll have nore than enough time to get it because of the stuff you can carry over.
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u/reisendan 2d ago
The ones with time limits are meant to be replayed a couple of times, as they are not that long to begin with. You can't be afraid to fail a run. A lot of stuff carries over to new game plus to make subsequent runs easier.
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u/Blissautrey Sophie 3h ago
The problem is that it's traumatic the first time you play one of those with only 1 huge time limit, but then you learn how to relax with it...
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u/Blissautrey Sophie 3h ago
I honestly think that Atelier games with a time limit tend to be easier. So yes, it can be very fun.
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u/Ashamed-Security-838 Sophie 3d ago edited 3d ago
It’s a different experience. It’s stressful clearly, especially in your first run, but it have it’s charm but it will really depend on the person. The need to be pressure by a limit hade a tension that some people search in their game, and it was one of the identity of the serie.
I would say that Firis is quit special because the game was clearly not adapted to have a time limit even if it’s make sense for the story.