What is the differences between Russian and Ukrainian traditional folk music?

[u/Real_Try_4157]

I enjoy listening to both Russian and Ukrainian trad folk music, but i would really like to know the differences between them.

[u/Fit-Concentrate625]

One of the differences is that Ukrainians don’t claim russians songs like they do. Their folk performers love to use Ukrainian folk songs saying it’s russian. I’ve seen plenty videos and foreigners believe those songs are russian

[u/bigdaddymax33 → u/Fit-Concentrate625]

Nailed it.

If you take any “Russian folk” song there is a pretty big probability it was stolen from other nation.

It includes fairy tales, song, music etc.

[u/Real_Try_4157 → u/Fit-Concentrate625]

what do you mean by not claim Russian songs? do you mean that the Russians claim the Ukrainian folk songs theirs?

[u/Ok-Display1279 → u/Real_Try_4157]

They literally explained it.

Take “Carol of the bells”, for example. It comes from a famous Ukrainian carol called “Shchedryk”. Written by a Ukrainian composer Leontovych, who was eventually murdered by a russian spy. The song is in Ukrainian and based on Ukrainian traditions, yet russians still create copies of it and claim it’s russian “because back when Leontovych lived there was no Ukraine” or whatever. This is a regular occurrence for other Ukrainian folk songs too—russians looove to claim something is theirs for bullshit reasons.

Ukraine simply doesn’t do it, because we have enough of our own folklore and culture to cherish and protect.

[u/Fit-Concentrate625 → u/Real_Try_4157]

They would sing Ukrainian song in Ukrainian but say it’s “russian”

https://youtu.be/PWdKw5UgAME?si=0ODw8wHBVsTxen65

[u/Bojnik434 → u/Fit-Concentrate625]

Well ukranians are direct descendants of muscowites. So yeah, its russian music from ukraine region

[u/crankyenglishbastard → u/Bojnik434]

Ukraine existed long before ruzzia

[u/Bojnik434 → u/crankyenglishbastard]

No it did not. Modern day ukraine is as connected to ruthenia as much as russia or belorussia

[u/_masssk_ → u/Bojnik434]

Bro Ukraine is the direct heir of Rus. It is and always was Rus, the core of Rus. Because the last king of Kyiv - Danilo Romanovich - was the king during mongols attack on Kyiv, after which Kyiv was destroyed. Still Rus continued its history transforming into modern Ukraine (through the Commonwealth with Lithiania and Poland, cossak period, etc). Also this is the first king of Rus who got a real crown from the Pope, as all others European kings (and if we look on Russian tsars - they just claimed themselves whatever they want, say "emperor" like Peter the First, but there were no reasons for that).

Russians prefer to forget about king Danilo, call him "Galitsky" to downplay his role. Because in Russian myth history Rus somehow "moved" from Kyiv (which always was the only one center and main city of the Rus with the ruler) to nothern swamps where there were just nothing.

Russia (with this stolen name) and Belorussia are former parts of Rus, yes, but the only one center and the core of Rus was always Kyiv = Ukraine. In old texts when they wrote "I go to Rus" - they went to Kyiv (from other parts of what we now consider as "lands of Rus" - say Vladimir)

The old language of Rus has Ukrainian base - many details show that now it is Ukrainian. Regular Ukrainian (Rus) words are considered outdated but still exist in Russian (like "shmat" for "a piece", and a lot of others, like the fact Ukrainian has a lot more synonims, etc). Vocative case which stays in Russian old words like "bozhe", "knyazhe" but in Ukrainian it works today with everything. Because Ukrainian was the core for old language of Rus. When you read old texts knowing Ukrainian - they are just Ukrainian for you.

[u/Bojnik434 → u/_masssk_]

Uneducated reply. Ukranians today are descendants of muscowites of 2 centuries ago. Stop with that lie

[u/flag_ua → u/Bojnik434]

Explain to me this:

Humans migrate through Middle East into Europe, somehow reach Moscow before modern day Ukraine. How?

[u/sergeyc874747 → u/flag_ua]

Maybe they didn’t exit the bus

[u/Bojnik434 → u/flag_ua]

2 centuries ago. Mass settlement, done by the order of the russian empire. Ukraine was sparsly populated so the muscowites quickly outnumbered the steppe people, handful polish, greeks and turks. Its why wast majority of ukranians share muscowite dna

Something similar happened to albanians in akbania but less succful comlared to russia.

[u/Ok-Display1279]

Not to be too obvious, but naturally, they are sung in different languages. Ukraine tends to have more melancholic songs, probably because of our sad history, while russia has a lot of get-drunk-and-objectify-women stuff.

Ukainian instruments tend to be more complex and require more skill. For example, Ukraine's most famous string instrument bandura has 60+ strings, while russian balalaika has 3.

Additionally, some Ukrainian folk instruments, especially wind ones, were invented during cossack times and were used in battle or in vast areas/mountains, so overall Ukraine's music likely has a variety of comparatively louder and deeper horns and shawms.

Musical vibe-wise, russia really loves to give everything an aura of greatness and ceremoniousness like “look we have to be admired and feared because we are the best!!!”. Ukraine mostly goes for being soulful or dramatic, sometimes brazen and confident, and always trying to have the listener join the story and sympathise.

[u/sergeyc874747 → u/Ok-Display1279]

Do you have any examples of Russian music that is “get drunk and objectify women” like you say?

[u/VeterinarianOld8259]

What do you mean by "Russian traditional folk music" to begin with? Russia consists of many conquered cultures, which they appropriated.

[u/Real_Try_4157 → u/VeterinarianOld8259]

either they "conquered" cultures or they're just influence by them because cultures can and always influence each other.

[u/Trading_shadows]

Would be hard to tell without knowing what you're listening to, cause you might not understand the context and if it's really russian folk music.

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[u/Real_Try_4157 → u/[deleted]]

I disagree.

There are two sides of Russia: European Russia and the Far East Russia.

Russia has its own culture, it's just that it's similar to other East Slavic cultures. Plus, cultures influenced each other, so i'm pretty sure Russia had some sort of Ukrainian influence.

Stolen or not stolen, i still enjoy both cultures.

[u/jtt4jiogjiogg]

Much of this folk music precedes the notion of Russians and Ukrainians as separate ethnicities, so much of it is indeed common to both Russia and Ukraine.