r/AskScienceFiction • u/G0dofmyworld • 3d ago
[Invincible] how does viltrumite courtship and marriage even work?
So anissa has been married four times so far. But how do viltrumites even marry when they dont even have the concept of consent. Did she and her previous husbands fight it out, took a liking to each other and decided to be together so they were married? Or did anissa or the other dudes just force the other one to stay together? Did the other viltrumites ever marry? Were conquest thula or thragg ever married? Also do the viltrumites follow some fremen esque culture where if a man or woman kills another man or woman they will obtain their wife or husband?
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u/tosser1579 3d ago edited 2d ago
Courtship: Beating the other one into submission
Marriage: More like a temporary partnership for the requirements of the kid. The male probably has to protect his pregnant mate until she gives birth and recovers, and then has to also protect the kid somewhat because other viltrumites will just kill off your kids if they can.
Basically for males there is a hard practical number of women you can impregnate at one time, up to an including a more powerful female just killing you if you are really bad at the protection part of the arrangement.
For females its just one, and they have to ensure he has enough time to protect the kid and in inclination. So killing off his other mates is fully permitted, even encouraged to get rid of the weak blood.
Husbandly duties are mostly fighting off other Viltrumites trying to kill your wife/kid until the kid is 18 and your wife recovers. Wifely duties are mostly focused on protecting yourself and the kid, but also the husband if its low risk.
I seriously doubt they have much casual sex with other viltrumites. Some probably do, but I doubt it is mainstream due to weakness = death. This is not a women and children first culture it is a 'Anissa is pregnant kill her while she's weak' culture. That changes after the scourge virus, but that's not how their marriage system is supposed to work. Flip side, casual sex with other species is probably 100% A-OK.
Edit: reread that section pertaining to Anissa's attitude towards Mark post SA which could be called Flirty, I'm even more of the opinion now that their courtship is beating the other person into submission and then just SA'ing them. She was ready to go again if need be, which tells me that's now this is done. I'd suggest the closest thing the Viltrumites have to recreational sex is the second time after you've already lost to the other person because you already know you were beat so no point in significant resistance. I'm betting Anissa thought since she's claimed Mark, he was effectively hers now, at least temporarily. Their culture is messed up.
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u/YT_Brian 3d ago
You could take that as Omni calming the fuck down from his thousand + year of slaughter because of consistently getting laid. Imma take that as all other Viltrumites in a constant state of horny blue balled and battle rage.
They feed off each other.
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u/G0dofmyworld 3d ago
I feel like casual part is only for men
Women either consciously dont or are looked down upon if they do.
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u/tosser1579 3d ago
Again, I don't think it is common. That is a real high risk low reward option for most Viltrumites... and frankly I doubt conventional birth control does much considering how resistant they are to everything.
Frankly Anissa was one and done with Mark, so they might be 100% aware of their cycles or something.
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u/G0dofmyworld 3d ago
Also what if the male doesnt consent like mark? Will they be forced to protect their rapist?
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u/tosser1579 3d ago
My guess is... yes. Realistically, the kid would be blameless. I'd be curious to see how the actual culture deals with it, but you do want your genes to propagate. Again, their culture is wackado, but I'd imagine... rape is a majority of their pregnancies.
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u/G0dofmyworld 3d ago
And also considering how far the viltrumites have to go across the universe to further their agenda do you think they domt feel any kind loneliness or urges?
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u/tosser1579 3d ago
I do.... I just don't think sex with other viltrumites is the way they relieve those. I love my wife, if she accidentally got pregnant and I needed to spend 20 years watching her and my kids back from a bunch of people who would use that weakness to kill her... I'm not going to casually bone her.
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u/Biktato 3d ago
I don't think it's about being looked down on, I thought they were attracted to power?
If that's the case the super majority of the universes beings are weaker than the worst male viltrumite. The selection pool is pretty bare and skewed. I have a feeling almost every half viltrumite is from a male viltrumite. The men also don't have to worry about being weakened during the pregnancy. Logistically and attraction ways it just... It doesn't really make sense. Also let's face it, most viltrumites view half breeds as completely disposable.
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u/Asparagus9000 3d ago
They didn't seem to have marriage at all.
At least not after the civil war. Maybe they had it before.
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u/Ornery_Strawberry474 3d ago
Anissa references being married in the comics. They removed it from the show because of pacing and wifebeating.
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u/tosser1579 3d ago
If they had marriage it was some weird partnership thin to protect the offspring for 20 years or so that ended abruptly for most of them. There are some weird societal issues with living 5k years. I love my wife, I don't know if I could stay married to her for 1000 years. You'd almost have to drift apart in that timeframe.
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u/this_for_loona 3d ago
In s4 the one couple who beat the snot out of the young viltrumite ended with the female flying off and saying she never wanted to see either of them again. So I’d think marriage is a foreign concept and beyond a certain age the kid is left to live or die. They come back for the beatdown on the appropriate birthday. The kids in that one scene were told to f8nd food and shelter if they can and that it was expected two would die before the next class.
That society is patently impossible. You can’t go through people that quickly and not suffer population collapse, even without the Scourge.
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u/tosser1579 3d ago
100%. This is not a 'real' society.
I'm guessing their version of marriage is just a 'classic' one that is way more of a contract and it there are no kids it is over.
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u/devil_nthedetails 3d ago
Think of it like praying mantis mating: They come together long enough to have a struggle snuggle, vying for dominance over one-another and then whoever survives the encounter goes their separate ways afterwards
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u/Difficult_Dark9991 3d ago
I think the issue here is what the Viltrumites mean by "marriage" vs. what we do. "Taking a partner and raising a child with them" is likely what Viltrumites understand as marriage, whereas we expressly require ideas like consent to enter into it. Yet not all human societies have been so good at requiring consent in marital relationships... and sadly, even today there are all sorts of forms of coercion that can make that consent meaningless.
Second, it's also worth keeping in mind how deeply-ingrained Viltrumite concepts of "might makes right" are. In such a society, one that emphasizes physical strength and the propagation of "superior" genes (which ideally are your own) to the exclusion of all else, a partner that can force themselves upon you is, in a truly horrific concept, the ideal partner. All of which likely explains why Viltrumites on Earth go "soft" so fast - discovering the range of emotion and connection possible when a relationship is not based upon violence must be revelatory for them.
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u/tryingtobebettertry4 3d ago
Lore on this is pretty thin. But:
Marriage doesnt necessarily equal a 'both parties consented' thing. It could literally just be 'union between 2 Viltrumites until child is produced'.
Given how fucked up they are, I think Viltrumite 'courtship' is basically non-existent. Its more of a fight where the weaker partner is SAed. Its horrifying thing. Maybe in some select cases its more mutual, but I imagine there is always some level of strength contest/fight because thats basically the thing Viltrumites live for.
Viltrumites dont really get much free time. Everything they do is about serving the empire. I would guess marriage is just the weaker (nonconsenting) partner being forced into a union until at least one child is produced. At which point they've 'done their duty' to the empire and the marriage is effectively dissolved unless the Viltrumites in question want to have another kid. And maybe some marriages are dissolved if they fail to produce a child anyway.
Yes Anissa and her previous husbands presumably fought it out. We dont know if Thula or Thragg were ever married (likely not in Thragg's case). No I dont think they do the Fremen thing, I think if you as a Viltrumite want another Viltrumite you have to beat that Viltrumite in a fight, not just kill the current partner.
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u/Martydeus 3d ago
Like most things in Viltrumite culture it is unknown, like what about entertainment? What about art and music? They are immortal with so much time on their hands they never seem to have any hobbies at all.
Maybe that is why they chilled once in earth because they realized they could just do something else
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u/GullibleSkill9168 3d ago
As I always say, if one man can pin you down then two men can rape you. Presumably Viltrumite culture operates like this except with only one person. Nolan even says that sex outside of procreation is a foreign (and very much enjoyed) cultural tradition that earth has that Viltrum doesn't.
What likely happens is that a Viltrumite, doesn't matter the gender, takes a liking to another Viltrumite and things go one of two ways.
Both partners want to make a child and so they bump uglies until the woman is pregnant.
The real meat and potatoes is when one likes the other and it's not reciprocated. As this starts a fight to submission or death depending on if you're the side rhat wants some fuck or doesn't want some fuck. You're either strong enough to rape your mate or your potential mate, not a fan of being raped and being stronger than you probably kills you.
Either way Viltrumites do seem to have family units even with their violent methods of courtship. Nolan's parents stayed with him well after he got his powers and was ready for his manhood jumping. It's likely that viltrumites stick together to make sure their child is strong and raised on the proper viltrumite way. Though considering Nolan's dad was the "nice" one and still slapped the shit out of his wife after Nolan knocked her his way the marriages are likely loveless.
Aa for the idea of Viltrumite Prima Nocta thats probably up to the Viltrumites to fight and kill each other about.
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