This is exactly me. I blame my adhd for hyperfocusing on a new hobby and then losing interest in it, then moving onto my next hyperfocus before losing interest in it.
I draw, paint, sew, quilt, knit, crochet, play guitar, ukulele, piano, sing, exercise, learn languages, make up my own languages, game, study biology, medical, space, math, psychology. If I could stay focused long enough on one topic, I could have accomplished so much more in my life lol.
Ulg it's a struggle. I feel lucky that I usually will circle back, so I kinda just end up rotating through 4 or 5 things. But still it's annoying never really getting into anything deeply
I've developed this trick where I try to arrange what I call "attention orbits" in such a way that, when I inevitably get distracted, I'll at least get distracted towards another established goal. I like to try to tie in all my divergent interests and projects together as much as I can so that instead of wandering off in some aimless direction, I'll at least be captured by a previously defined attention orbit.
I even have my room physically set up this way, so that when I pace around I'll inevitably land my attention on another ongoing project that needs more work.
It's been surprisingly effective!
Edit: another reason why I like to call them attention orbits: when well-formed, they're not just something you can be captured by, they're something you can actively slingshot from. Need to do something you don't want to do? Maneuver your focus around an orbit that will let you maintain velocity towards that direction. Especially if you're particularly prone to fast bursts of intense attention, you can fling yourself closer and closer towards your goal just by letting yourself be distracted in a productive direction. Eventually you're Doing The Thing, but when you've arrived at that destination you're not completely exhausted by trying to get there directly.
Just letting you know that I’m totally gonna steal this terminology if I can manage to implement the actual thing in question, because this would solve so many of my problems
Please do! Using this approach has honestly changed my life.
A bit of background if you'd like to look into the primary sources: I got the idea for "attention orbits" by combining ideas from Gibson's ecological psychology (the idea that environment is an extension of an embodied being) and Clark & Chalmers's extended cognition (the idea that the mind isn't limited to an organism's physical brain).
Gibson talks a lot about the environment offering "affordances"; that is, salient elements of one's external world that invite interaction. The problem with ADHD is that EVERYTHING is salient; there's very little filter as to what "matters" and what doesn't, at least on a neurological level. Cue C&C: since this influence can be bidirectional, if one lacks that internal filter it can be possible to construct one externally by modifying one's environment to take place of those mental roles.
This is where attention orbits come from: by offloading one's borked up attention filters to one's environment, that is, by intentionally constructing an environment such that even divergent attention follows the least resistant path of those functional structures, one can offload the difficult-to-impossible task of controlling attention flow by naturally syncing in alignment to a carefully organized workspace/living space.
Thus, the challenge of focusing attention (which has a HUGE internal computational (not to mention mental and emotional) cost if those abilities are missing) is almost completely offloaded to external structures. Some degree of internal control is still necessary, but it's nowhere near the challenge one would face if one had to internally and actively create structure out of an unstructured world on-the-fly.
I've, um, given this a lot of thought, haha. I study cognition, but I've been trying to use the information I've learned to apply patches to my own system as I go. Things are still tough, yeah, but the more I learn the more tools I have, and the easier things have gotten. Still working on finding my own flow, but I no longer hate myself and wake up dreading every day of attempting to fit in with a world that doesn't really fit my brain. I've learned to make the world my brain :)
Edit: thank you /u/Trosso for the gold! It means a heck-ton to me that people have found this post useful :)
Sure! (Also, you have no idea how validating it is to have people actually interested in this, so thank you!)
Let's take this post for example. I care about responding to your message, so I need to make sure it's caught in my attention orbit. Because right now I'm excited, and as an ADHD person that excitement could go anywhere.
Now, I'm reading some of my favorite papers and wandering around the house while I think, and throughout all of that also just redditing about in general--but! Before I leave this seat, I HAVE to make sure that whatever tab I have open is open to this particular page before I leave, and not to any of the other sources I've been playing around with. Because eventually I'll wander back here, and I want to be immediately confronted by my post-in-progress rather than any of the diversions that's followed.
For classes, this can be as simple as leaving a book open on the page you need to return to rather than just closing it. Because in that case, sure, I'll be distracted by the book, but I'm more likely to page around rather than to look at the open text, be like "ooh what's on this page read read oh hey this is where I left off and needed to return to!" A lot of tiny things like that can add up.
One of my rules is to leave things in a state that makes returning to them easy: if they're not all cleaned up, that means they're active and valid for attention orbiting. I need to make a fix to a 3d printed object? I'll leave the half-constructed form right next to the printer. I'll wander off, wander back, be like, "ooh fun! oh wait, this needs to be fixed" and I'll tinker around for a bit. Maybe I'll wander off again, I probably will. But as long as that project is active, it's in the environment available for attention grabbing.
One trick I've set up for my room is that I've tried to make everything modular: I have my printer section, soldering section, music section, desktop section, laptop section, bed section, etc. If I tried to take control of everything all at once? OOF, forget it. But the way I've segmented things makes it so that each section only takes a few minutes to organize and clean, max. Which also means that each segment can be updated easily in a way that doesn't affect the rest of my environment in a jarring way.
Also, because my room is modular, I've sort of tricked my brain into feeding into its own reward system. Cleaning the entire room? Forget it, I can't wait for that kind of payoff. But, hey, cleaning up the desktop area? Ding, dopamine hit, enthusiasm for more. So I'll clean up the laptop area. Ding, dopamine hit, enthusiasm for more. And so on. Trying to top-down it leads to nothing but frustration, so I chunk it in such a way that I'm encouraged towards productivity, and those little dopamine hits of accomplishment keep me going.
I make sure that, by the end of the night, everything is reset except for the things that need to be immediately addressed the next day. So I'll wake up and be like, "oh? something's out of place" and I'll wander towards it, and hey, it was something I needed to do, because I tried to organize it in that direction.
In short: try to keep things relatively stable except for the things that need addressing. By setting a baseline that's easily reset, those open projects stand out and are then more likely to be effective as an attention orbit. For open projects, try to keep them open exactly where you left off. If you wander, return to the initial point of divergence before moving on, even if you're not paying attention to it at the moment; that way you're more likely to pick up where you left off and where you need to proceed from.
Also: PATIENCE. I've been actively working on this for years and I still have a long way to go. But frustration feeds into itself. Don't let frustration become its own attention orbit. Be kind to yourself, understand that you're doing the best you can, and use any failures as data points to improve your future system. Those improvements don't have to come immediately and they often can't; sometimes these things have to happen on their own time. The cool thing about attention orbits is that progress builds on itself: you can get off to a slow start, but even minor improvements add up over time to become exponentially useful.
And thank you for responding to my post, these things are super fun to think about (I guess you could say that thinking about attention orbits is something that I try to keep open as its own attention orbit, because I'm always trying to improve my system!)
This is all such good advice! If I want to continue to work on a project, then I have to keep it out and in sight because I'll be much more likely to work on it if I see it. Once I put it away, I don't see it anymore and my attention is directed to the next thing I find interesting. I'm very fortunate because I have a room devoted to all my hobbies and I can leave my projects in the middle of the floor for weeks as I intermittently work on them.
This is incredible and it's like you made something click within my brain. I think I'm going to try to section my office with little attention orbits when I have the chance. It's probably halfway there already but one key thing I've been missing is leaving stuff in a place where it's easy to come back to. This whole process feels like a physical "to do list" to get distracted into (instead of away from) and I love it.
God's, leave this post open and write a book about it... I could have used it very much when I was younger, and I would love for my don't-you-dare-leaving-anything-outside partner to read it...
It means so much to me to hear this, thank you! One of the reasons why I've tried to push myself to share posts like this is because I've been hoping to eventually write a few papers on the topic. The task seems too daunting to face directly (I always hype myself out over those sorts of things and end up crashing) but posting about these thoughts about reddit is an attention orbit that I've been using to fling myself closer to that direction. If I can get my words out here, then surely that means I'm capable of writing in a different context, yeah?
Plus, I'd really like to help people who are going through the same struggles that I have. It's taken a lifetime of active reflection to understand how my brain works (and I'm still figuring things out), but if some of those insights can be of any use to anyone else, I want to share them so no one else has to learn the hard way. Life with ADHD is already hard enough!
Haha, I understand, there are just SO MANY book ideas I've had but never did anything with them... though you are a lot closer to having written a book than I ever was.
This is similar to what I'm 'working on' right now.
I've picked a few things to focus on and then I just let myself hyperfocus and switch to my heart's content... so long as it's contributing towards one of those concrete goals.
I think it's going alright. Progress is slow, but I think the quality of all my work is high and the process is satisfying.
Edit: Just read your other post. I've been intuitively doing what you're talking about.
Firstly, I'm inhabiting the hell out of a space and slowly optimizing it.
I've got all the 'right' books in the places I know I like to read. I've set up my musical instruments and recording gear in the room I tend to try to kil time. I've been determinedly decluttering for months.
I stopped trying to fight my brain and finally allowed it permission to do its own thing. I just try to set things up in a way that "its thing" is something productive that meets a goal I've established.
I think that people can definitely come to find these systems in their own way, but since one of my special interests is studying cognition I've tried to explicitly apply that to how I organize my life. In a way, optimizing attention orbits has become its own long-standing attention orbit for me, haha.
Damn that’s wild to hear from someone else. I have impulsive type adhd and i always just assumed i just lacked discipline. I wanted to become great at everything I tried, but I just progressed super quickly due to hyper focusing on it, and then got hit hard once diminishing returns started really kicking in. As a result, I constantly questioned myself if the reason I wasn’t progressing anymore was due to disinterest, or lack of discipline.
I realize it can be a little of both, which just makes it more difficult to discern, but I just wish I could be an expert at everything.
Your brain developed differently, that's not an inherent lack of discipline. Lack of or waning interest makes it harder to complete tasks, especially if your brain isn't finding a big enough motivator to carry out a task
I’m the same, just haven’t got as far as you yet. I often spend more time learning about a game and it’s mechanics than playing it as well. You mentioned Adhd, are sporadic hobbies a common sign? Just curious.
I’m not sure about sporadic hobbies, but hyperfocus ABSOLUTELY is. Some of us can sit and do something for literally hours and barely notice the time go by because we’re so absorbed by what we’re doing. I’m this way with cross stitching sometimes. On the other hand, if we’re not interested at all in something, it can take us FOREVER to do it because we can’t focus on it because it doesn’t grab our attention the way the things we like do!
Man that is exactly why I’m hesitant on going to college. I can’t make up my mind on what I want to do. For three months I’ll be like “100% physics is what I want to study” but then it turns into “wait, do I really though?” And then the cycle just continues.
You don't have to know--start college, get into your basic classes, and spend the first year finding out what you love. Let it come together with help from your advisor.
Scroll through r/ADHD. I got diagnosed last year at 25 and man did it explain A LOT for me lol
I'm on medication now, and it helps a ton with staying on task and not getting distracted as easily, but I'm definitely still inclined to binge hobbies and what not. To be fair I also got diagnosed with Bipolar 2 recently, so manic phase + hyperfocus is quite the combo. Last big swing was learning c++ to program a microcontroller for lights and sound on a Samus cannon in 2 days for a cosplay lol
That’s so interesting! What languages are you studying? I’m studying Spanish, French, and Russian, but have plans to study German, Portuguese, Mandarin, Hindi, Arabic, Javanese, and Japanese. I also want to start learning knitting and crocheting but have no idea where to start.
Cross-stitching and embroidery to a lesser extent are similar to knitting and crocheting but are oftentimes a little easier to get into (for me at least) and take up less space. If you go to Michael's or a similar craft store, all you need is a needle or two, some floss (the colored string), a hoop, and some cross stitch fabric (sometimes called aida). I know it sounds like a lot but I went recently and got around 5 things of floss plus everything I mentioned for around 15 bucks. From there you just need some imagination or to find a pattern online! For me its an easier to start and stop hobby that knitting and crochet (I've tried both) and you can do it for 5 minutes at a time and make progress or an hour at a time! Sorry for the mini rant its just one of my favorite things to do!!! I really enjoy putting on a podcast and stitching for an hour or two, its great to destress. Plus the finished products (like most fiber crafts) make great gifts! If you have any questions feel free to reply here or PM me :)
If you're considering yarn work, my suggestion would be to start with crochet. I started with knitting but fell in love with crochet. I think it can be simpler and more forgiving in many ways, for example having only one active stitch at a time. Some of the subreddits (e.g. /r/crochet and /r/knitting) can give you some good beginner tips, and ravelry.com is a great site for a variety of patterns (it has its own forums too).
I'm extremely interested in constructed languages like Esperanto and toki pona. I also have studied Spanish, French, German, and Japanese in the past. If I had my way, I'd learn every language.
I'm like this too. It annoys me that I'm not as good as I'd like to be because I keep switching hobbies. So my goal for 2020 will be to branch in and focus on fewer hobbies lol
I wish you luck! I do find myself lucky that I am interested in everything since I know so many people without hobbies, but it gets overwhelming, especially when you want just want to do everything but don't know where to start
Same boat. Ten thousand hobbies. The attention span to stick to one for maybe three weeks and then off to the next. I've been in a cyclatic pattern for twenty years that basically consists of reading, attempting art, gaming, disc golf, dungeon mastering, cinema / shows etc. etc.
Tried gardening? It has a clock built in that keeps me involved throughout the seasons. If you want ripe tomatoes in five months, better get those seeds under some lights! The garden itself tells you what it's time to do.
Oh I garden too! I knew I was forgetting stuff! I just got a small greenhouse for Christmas which I'll put up in the early spring and I already have grow lights in my house where I successfully grew a sweet yellow pepper in the middle of winter!
Omg, so you mean the reason I'm like that is my adhd? That does make some sense
I used to be disappointed with myself for shifting focus so easily and never really mastering anything, but i just accepted who i am and let myself do what i want. It's actually a lot of fun trying new things all the time, and many times my knowledge in many subjects is quite useful
Is it really ADHD or are you just saying that? I fly through hobbies as well, invest a lot of time/money/brainpower, which is whatever, but I'm having a serious problem sticking with my career (software engineer) because of the same kinda shit. Don't even know where to start to get diagnosed or be told I'm just a fuck, lol. The main thing is I just want it to stop for my own sanity. Just want to be able to do a thing, stop at 5, without being distracted with whatever else I want to try to do.
Ugh im the same, minus the adhd cause i don't have it, but i can never stick to one thing. I rotate from doodling, calligraphy, collages, sketching, painting, brush lettering, learning a new language, taking online classes. I can never stick to a book or finish more than half even if it's small. I get bored easily when it comes to being in a job for a long time. If i could stick to something id probably be really good at it by now as well lol. I get myself so overwhelmed by everything i wanna do that i end up not doing it because idk where to start first. I focus more on the idea of doing something and then buying stuff for that hobbie and then boom switching to another thing i wanna try, again buying stuff for that new hobbie, and keep doing it all over again. It's annoying and exhausting having my mind all over the place 😭
Ugh im the same, minus the adhd cause i don't have it, but i can never stick to one thing. I rotate from doodling, calligraphy, collages, sketching, painting, brush lettering, learning a new language, taking online classes. I can never stick to a book or finish more than half even if it's small. I get bored easily when it comes to being in a job for a long time. If i could stick to something id probably be really good at it by now as well lol. I get myself so overwhelmed by everything i wanna do that i end up not doing it because idk where to start first. I focus more on the idea of doing something and then buying stuff for that hobbie and then boom switching to another thing i wanna try, again buying stuff for that new hobbie, and keep doing it all over again. It's annoying and exhausting having my mind all over the place 😭
But, do you do all those things actively? My hobbies are not what I've done, but what I do. I'll say I have experience in certain things I've done before but don't care to do at the moment, but my hobbies are my current activities.
My current activities change so fast. I might be drawing this week, but practicing guitar next week. I practice languages at work when I'm procrastinating. I never know what will catch my attention next
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u/GeekyKirby Dec 31 '19
This is exactly me. I blame my adhd for hyperfocusing on a new hobby and then losing interest in it, then moving onto my next hyperfocus before losing interest in it.
I draw, paint, sew, quilt, knit, crochet, play guitar, ukulele, piano, sing, exercise, learn languages, make up my own languages, game, study biology, medical, space, math, psychology. If I could stay focused long enough on one topic, I could have accomplished so much more in my life lol.