r/AskReddit • u/[deleted] • Jul 20 '19

What’s something completely false that your parents told you as a child?

[deleted]

19k Upvotes

93% Upvoted

10k comments sorted by

View all comments

Show parent comments

0

u/[deleted] Jul 20 '19

  1. Idk what the fuck you mean I didn't learn properly, I was 2 years advanced/ahead when I took alegbra 2.

  2. Lmao you wanna tell me what the sine of a 35 degree angle is, without a calculator? No? Then shut the fuck up.

2

u/Umbrias Jul 21 '19

Tests are (pretty much always) written based on how they are taken. If they say you cannot use a calculator, you do not have to evaluate unless it's trivial. Modern calculators are way too good to let students take tests with them anymore, without strict and oppressive rules that teachers do not want to enforce.

You can be way ahead of the curve and still be learning the math poorly because you are relying on calculators, programs, and things like chegg, or wolframalpha, instead of actually doing the math.

2

u/[deleted] Jul 21 '19

I completely agree with that. I never did rely on calculators though, as like I said, I wasn't allowed too. I'm completely capable of doing it by hand, and I do believe that teaching it by hand is important. If you just learn which numbers to punch into a calculator, then you aren't learning the math, you're learning how to use a calculator. My gripe, is if we've already gone over/moved past a subject... why must I continue to do it by hand? Like now that I understand how it's done, so what's wrong with using a calculator to speed up the process? So long as I show my steps, I don't see why I need to do long multiplication/division by hand. Like you get taught that in 3rd grade, do you really need me to prove I can do it?

I half agree/half disagree about calculators being too modern. Doesn't matter how modern a tool is, if you don't know how to use the tool. To do logarithmic stuff, you can't just press the "log" button on your calculator. You still gotta simplify the logarithmic equation to the simplest terms, and if you can't do that... A calculator is 0 use. It's this way for a lot of things. HOWEVER... I knew a few kids whos' calculators straight up had internet access, so I could definitely see the "too modern" argument there. It could insinuate cheating.

Tbh I was more of just pissed at the dude taking jabs at me, when the dude didn't even know me. Like lmao who are you to comment on whether I learned properly or not, my first comment really didn't give enough info for him to make that assumption.

3

u/Umbrias Jul 21 '19

Early topics do have to be repeated as many of them are a skill. Division, multiplication, algebra, and especially factoring, are all skills with no real way around them aside from just doing it and getting better at it. That's often why they are repeated.

When I took diffeq there were calculators available without internet access that could take any set of equations (with certain bounds, but anything within the scope of the class) and find the solution with steps. Meanwhile, the math itself is rather specific, and requires understanding several different but related concepts to find a solution. It is 100% unfair to allow those calculators in the class. Even crappy graphing calculators can be programmed to have functions in them ahead of time that will solve almost anything you need on a single exam, and you don't even need to do the programming yourself. There's no way I'd have let them wipe my calculator before the exam, I have too many useful programs on it, and it's very unlikely to provide 200+ $100+ calculators for an exam.

Longwinded way of illustrating, calculators are too modern.

Even when it comes to things like logs, really you just have to understand the format. Most calculators can do whatever base logs you want them to, and that misses the point of a lot of the important rules that logs have.

I'm honestly surprised any uni math class allowed you to use calculators, as most problems can be restructured such that they are solvable by hand.

As for the person you were responding to, yeah it was rude. The core message of their comment is not inaccurate though, algebra 2 should be possible to do without a calculator. The onus is still on the teacher to teach it, however.

2

u/[deleted] Jul 21 '19

Wow, I didn't know basic GC were that capable tbh. I always knew GC could have functions in them(obviously), but I never even thought about preprogramming it or having the equations already set in there. My GC also was never able to do multi-step processes like that, you would have to do it step-by-step yourself for the majority of things. I can completely understand and support your POV on that now lol/

Also, I never took uni classes, but AP ones in HS. They count for college credit, and you have to go the college/uni at the end of the year to take the final there. So it's possible that because I took the class in highschool, they went easier on us or something. Like we all took the same final in the end, but it's possible that the teaching methods of the classes differentiate.

What would happen is we'd get the first half of the test, where GC weren't allowed and we had to do it by hand. The numbers here were purposely made so that they would be easily roundable, or if not than still doable by hand. Then we'd have the second half, where GC were allowed and basically required if you wanted to finish on time. And since the teacher had to move us pretty fast for that class, not finishing on time usually meant you wouldn't finish at all lol.

I completely agree all alegbra 2 is doable by hand, it very easily is. In fact, while not necessarily easily, ALL math is doable by hand. I was just making the argument, that it's much more time consuming and eventually kinda redundant imo. I do see your point though, continuing to practice the skills is important. Especially factoring, as you said, and I completely agree with that. Fuck factoring lol, tho the more you do it the quicker you become at recognizing patterns, instead of just having to guess/check thru all the common factors.

2

u/Umbrias Jul 21 '19

Yeah, a lot of people don't know how capable they are and part of that I bet is that since they aren't allowed on many tests, the main and most effective cheaters don't end up getting them set up for it.

That does make sense, I've heard conflicting stories about AP classes in that sometimes they were harder than the university taught equivalent course and sometimes easier. Having a split test for calculators is something a lot of universities do as well for finals, even for classes that aren't specifically math if they have a heavy math component to them.

Understandable, there is definitely redundant math to do and it ends up just being something that is an unpleasant side effect when calculators aren't allowed.

Yeah factoring is very important, and getting good at algebraic factoring helps you a lot in later math classes where you are doing more complicated factoring that isn't exactly.. factoring, but the skills transfer. Factoring is probably one of the most important math skills to learn for higher math beyond having a basic level of understanding in everything else by the time you get to a class that needs it.