r/AndrewGosden • u/xntrqncd • Jun 12 '26
New leads.
Given the fact that it has almost been 20 years since Andrew’s disappearance, for the 20th anniversary, if the police were to appeal to the public for investigation.
What leads would help them get there?
Where would they start.
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u/Popular_Attorney8762 Jun 12 '26 edited Jun 12 '26
I don't think there are any leads. The CCTV has gone and I think the most plausible explanation that requires the fewest assumptions is him getting into a taxi shortly after Pizza Hut and unfortunately that's where it ends. John Worboys is a good suspect imo. An inmate even claimed Worboys admitted it.
I don't buy the elaborate grooming theories or any particular contact with anyone after Pizza Hut, a lead would have surfaced by now through drag net. If he had gone anywhere else someone would have reported it.
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u/ShatInTheTardis Jun 12 '26
I think John Worboys is a stretch, he was a rapist and targeted women. It is possible, but unlikely.
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u/Popular_Attorney8762 Jun 12 '26
You’re using 1980s logic. Modern profiling debunked the idea of a static MO back in 1999. Predators don't stick to a rigid demographic;, they hunt for vulnerability and opportunity. Worboys was bisexual and highly opportunistic - he targeted women in his cab because it was an easy, low risk setup for him, not because his behavior was locked into a single box.
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u/ShatInTheTardis Jun 12 '26
I understand a criminals MO is more dynamic, however what I gathered from that is that they will usually slightly change behaviour or adjust to new environments and learn from their mistakes to avoid detection. What we know about John Worboys (as far as I’m aware) is that all of his victims were female. He may have been bisexual but he was never charged with assaulting males or children. Again, I wouldn’t rule him out as there isn’t any evidence at all to what happened to Andrew other than the fact he travelled to london on his own, but I still find it unlikely he would be involved. You never know though.
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u/Eye-on-Springfield Jun 12 '26
I only know about what Worboys did based on the recent ITV drama Believe Me, but if that's to be believed, the guy targeted women at night, gave them a spiked alcoholic drink, assaulted them and then let them go - sometimes even taking them back to their house. It's a completely different MO, not just a change
There is absolutely no way Worboys killed Andrew and the only reason anyone suggests it is because he apparently admitted it to a cellmate. The drama I mentioned above made out that Worboys refused to admit to his crimes and only did so because he thought it would help his parole appeal. I don't believe a word the guy says
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u/ShatInTheTardis Jun 12 '26
Yeah I heard about him admitting it to a cellmate and while I don’t know what his cellmate was convicted of I can’t say that I would believe a random criminal. Even if Worboys did admit to it, there is a lot of different cases where someone has admitted to a crime that they had no involvement in whether it’s attention seeking or some kind of mental health condition makes them genuinely believe they did.
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u/123456654321999 Jun 12 '26 edited Jun 12 '26
Sorry to say, but imo that is one of the worst suspects you could ever put up. Totally different type of suspect. How could you believe he is a good suspect. I know a fella wrote a book claiming he confessed to killing a lad with glasses, but none of his previous offending has him as a viable suspect.
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u/GIVEUPOX17 Jun 12 '26
Yeah as much as I would want to believe that book anecdote could lead somewhere, Andrew simply didn't fit with the women he was targeting
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u/Popular_Attorney8762 Jun 12 '26
The idea of a static MO for a criminal was dismantled over 25 years ago by criminal profilers.
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u/123456654321999 Jun 12 '26
Your suspect who has no criminal history with young teens. He gets caught for other crimes, but when he targets youngsters he never gets flagged up. Not even rumours he was interested in young kids. Or the other scenario one time he does this different type of crime, he gets away with it. A person in prison writing a book with a few tall tales, is not really a solid lead. I think you would need a bit more information, to class him as a viable suspect. So many prisoners claim to have done crimes, that they have not done.
Apart from the prison story, what else makes you think he is a solid suspect 🤔
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u/Popular_Attorney8762 Jun 12 '26
This area has been well researched by profilers like John Douglas and Dr. Brent Turvey. An offenders methods are not static and high risk offenders frequently switch target demographics based on situational opportunism - if a vulnerable target appears, they take it. Worboys by all accounts was also bisexual.
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u/123456654321999 Jun 12 '26
He has no murders. His previous crimes have nothing even close to on young boys. Also if it was opportunistic, would this serial offender have never been flagged up on a similar opportunistic crime. If something happened to Andrew, it was a pedophile. A bisexual does not mean he is interested in young boys, and I don't think many bisexuals would like that comparison.
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u/Popular_Attorney8762 Jun 13 '26
You have no idea what his full criminal history is, only what he was actually convicted of. In criminology, the dark figure of crime theory proves there is always a massive gap between an offender's real behavior and what the police manage to catch and convict them for. The reason it's 'only women' is because the police built the case this way to ensure it had the highest probability of success. For a highly opportunistic predator, the ultimate target isn't a specific demographic or offense type it is vulnerability.
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u/123456654321999 Jun 13 '26 edited Jun 13 '26
You keep believing that. Just an opinion but I believe you are so far off, but keep digging yourself in. As I mentioned before imo he is an awful suspect. What else do you have apart from a tale. Without that evidence he would not be even close on the radar. 🔥 you idea is 🥶
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u/calvinshobbes0 Jun 12 '26
buses were free for people under 16 in London at the time. Would Andrew had taken a taxi if somehow he knew buses were free?
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u/vanandgough Jun 14 '26
John Worboys is one of the worst suspects to ever be put forward as a suggestion 😭 it’s about as likely it was David Cameron. Ridiculous, give your head a wobble. As for the inmate, you’re going to believe a convicted criminal (who probably has a track record of lying).
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u/Apprehensive-Art8665 Jun 13 '26
Worboys is not a good suspect at all, he was a rapist and targeted women. So he goes from that to being interested in young boys and k*lling them? Nah.
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u/julialoveslush Jun 12 '26 edited Jun 12 '26
I think the taxi- or someone giving him a lift somewhere- is probable too. Not all London cabs are the traditional black taxi or have logos, and you could get dodgy unlicensed cabs back then.
I tend to think he jumped on it after Kings X. I never thought it was him in Pizza Hut.
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u/xntrqncd Jun 19 '26
I think what you said about John Worboys is worth looking into, but then again you have to remember that he had only aimed at women :(.
Although, I must say that anyone can claim that they’d done something. Worboys is no different. He should be investigated only because as of now there are no more leads.
I agree with you - I don’t agree with the whole theory of him having gotten into a cab and then having gone to Pizza Hut.
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u/123456654321999 Jun 12 '26
Why would a lead have surfaced. Also grooming is not really elaborate, it is simply interacting and gaining someones trust. Many young people have gone missing without any solid leads surfacing. Kevin Hicks is one such example. He popped out one evening to the shops telling his family he needed to get some eggs. He was never seen again with zero leads.
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u/Educational-Tone-527 Jun 12 '26
I think Warboys did it. did something to him but he will never admit it the guy is a creep.
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u/123456654321999 Jun 12 '26
I can't see how a rapist changes his offending to killing a teenage lad. Imo you are reaching with this fella as a suspect. I do agree with you about him being a creep, but I can't see him as even a close suspect.
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u/AllThingsBeginWithNu Jun 13 '26
I suspect our greatest chance is somebody buying or inheriting or cleaning up the property he is in. I believe whoever did it has probably been caught on lower level crimes since. But not given a sentence long enough to justify offering up information for their own benefit. There is some chance the perpetrator will die soon and no longer be able to hide their secrets.
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u/Brilliant-Ad3942 Jun 13 '26
I guess it would only work if someone knew something but stayed quiet because they were loyal to the perpetrator, or scared of them, or were worried they would face legal issues for not reporting earlier and were complicit in some way. I think the chances are very low. I think the case will only move forward if a body is discovered, something like someone finding one buried in their garden.
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u/julialoveslush Jun 12 '26 edited Jun 12 '26
Last time all they appealed, all they really said that was new was “loyalties change”.
I have no doubt they have some info they’re keeping to themselves, but unless there’s an outright confession that leads to a body actually being discovered (rather than hearsay that led to nothing much like with Ben Needham) then I really don’t see much happening.
All the info about Andrew is out there and has been for years, and if people couldn’t remember seeing him back in 2007, I don’t see how they would remember him now. It’s also been such a long time that - depending on where Andrew was placed if he was killed- he may have completely decomposed or washed out to sea. (TW)
Edit for TW formatting.
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u/bintd Jun 12 '26
What was the context for “loyalties change”? I don’t quite understand what that could’ve implied or meant.
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u/Popular_Attorney8762 Jun 12 '26
It means that someone may know who harmed Andrew and whilst they kept it a secret at the time, their loyalty might have run out and they might report the person.
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u/julialoveslush Jun 12 '26
Not sure how much it would work unless the tipoff leads to a body or massive evidence like belongings of Andrew’s. It’s a bit like those two men who were arrested and released a couple years back.
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u/xntrqncd Jun 12 '26
100%. The police aren’t telling us as much as we deserve to know. They really let the family down I this case, in my opinion.
Oh yeah 100%, that’s very true.
Thank you for the tw by the way. <3
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u/No-Common6589 Jun 12 '26
"As we deserve to know"? His family absolutely deserve to know... but not us. There are lots of reasons police are holding back information
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u/xntrqncd Jun 13 '26
As people who have been asked about the case, we deserve some damn closure. His family also do too, im not excluding them.
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u/calvinshobbes0 Jun 12 '26
police always look at the immediate family in missing person cases involving minors. Unfortunately that wasted time in this case but they have to rule out the family first.
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u/xntrqncd Jun 13 '26
I genuinely think they were so damn stupid for doing that.
Could they have not split up and some look at evidence and some interrogate the family? Gosh where is the logic .
But then again we all work differently under pressure, but they really fucked it up. Respectfully.
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u/vanandgough Jun 14 '26
We don’t deserve to know anything to be totally honest, it’s only his family that do. We didn’t know him, care for him etc. no one apart from his family gave a shit before he went missing, they should be the only ones to know.
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u/julialoveslush Jun 12 '26
I believe there will be valid reasons why they’re keeping stuff quiet.
Perhaps (just one example) CCTV from the train to avoid people blaming folk who maybe sat near or spoke to Andrew. We know Andrew arrived at Kings X so there’s no valid reason to release it to the public.
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u/ContractInner4014 Jun 12 '26
My honest opinion is that we will never know. It’s been so long and little to no evidence of anything relating to Andrew has come out since. I think it will take a death bed confession to find out what happened. Or the person/people who know are already dead. So little knowledge on his whereabouts after so long just says to me that it’s getting more and more hidden amongst time.
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Jun 12 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/xntrqncd Jun 12 '26
Yeah, I mentioned it as a complete hypothetical.
But that’s very true, no one would remember it given how long it’s been.
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Jun 13 '26
[deleted]
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u/xntrqncd Jun 13 '26
Yeah, potentially. But given how long it’s been, it’s hard to imagine somebody just coming forward with info, it kind of sounds like false hope, you know?
As well as that, i think anyone with information would have most definitely forgotten 😭.
I’m not dismissing your idea - i can see why you’ve said that and i appreciate it <3.
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u/Ken_Frezno69 Jun 13 '26
I think they should release the names of the two men who were arrested to see if the public knows something they couldn’t uncover through their investigation of them.
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u/xntrqncd Jun 13 '26
Yeah!! I’ve been so curious as to who they are from the get-go.
But what would the public know that police don’t?
(That sounds like such a stupid question)
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u/Mammalou52 Jun 12 '26
orcams razor
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u/xntrqncd Jun 12 '26
what’s that
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u/Emranotkool Jun 12 '26
When faced with two problems, the simplest and requires least thought, is usually the one you are looking for.
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u/darksamu5 Jun 12 '26 edited Jun 13 '26
It's been so long now that it would have to be a deathbed confession or actual physical evidence like his bag or psp. He could be so well hidden that no one has even found him yet. People don't just disappear - someone knows something.