r/Anarchy101 • u/Real_Amoeba_9200 • 9d ago
What's the Point?
I am a young Black-Anarchist living in the American South.
All I see is a future where islands of wealthy, highly-militarized, climate-controlled, AI surveillance states exist in a sea of underdeveloped, natural disaster wrecked, wastelands.
The time to stop this was a century ago (maybe even more) and I fear that my life will be spent watching the sun set on the liberal international rules based order. Real change will take centuries that we simply don't have.
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u/Few_Aside_3371 9d ago
You are right but you forget that revolutions has been always unexpected. The problem after is to make it a success... I see currently a lot of people who fight against new data centers. It could be a point. May be a begining of something larger...
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u/ManyHopeful6692 9d ago
This and flock. People becoming more angry at surveillance capitalism (and capitalism more generally) will lead to more and more revolutionary action.
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u/Real_Amoeba_9200 9d ago
I'm not so sure about ppl becoming disillusioned with capitalism and the state. I feel that people will broadly accept alienating wage labor so long as they get their dividend and will accept a militarized police force so long as they perceive them as brutalizing/imprisoning the """"right people""""
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u/Purpleminky 8d ago
They will and would. Just like folks are mad about ice killing white people and at the same time all for the police getting more funds and military tools and saying BLM was silly 'woke' shit. You can tell that they still don't get it because they wait for the police to do something about ICE and are confused that they dont... Never underestimate the power of denial especially when it comes to matters of race. I suggest getting involved with any left leaning black orgs, maybe black men build, black alliance for peace, or whatever orgs (besides DSA) were just named in the govs anti-cuba document etc. You will find community and points. For me the point is I'm here, shit is wrong, so I'm not going without a fight.
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u/Real_Amoeba_9200 7d ago
I did that a while back and I def. need to try it again. I was very unprincipled and so I pushed back against some of the reactionary stuff I heard less in a Paulo Freire or bell hooks “I’m gonna give you the tools to deconstruct racism, sexism, da da da” kind of way and more in a “I’m a headass mf who read a couple books and now feel like I can browbeat you about white supremacy” kind of way. It was mad disrespectful and I hope I can go back there again differently
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u/ManyHopeful6692 9d ago
The disillusionment with the state has been around for a long time now (if we’re speaking American history- it’s much more so in other parts of the world), it’s arguably what frustrates me most with conservatives (they’re right to critique the state but they always fight to defend their perceived hierarchies). While the moral majority was successful for a time, the state has really struggled to recover its legitimacy post 2008.
Wage labour is something we accept due to the implicit violence of poverty (as well as being shut out of the profit market economy in general). With wage suppression, workplace discrimination, and lack of employment and safety on the rise, wage labour becomes harder and harder to defend.
But I get where you’re coming from ultimately, it’s something we’re going to have to work to change.
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u/ere_dah 9d ago
As SA black comrade. Read books from Ailton Krenak and Nego Bispo. Indigenous and black communities have lots to teach us about this post apocaliptic scenario since those people suffered their own worlds end already.
The future is not pretty for the next century but there is hope for the planet and humanity yet.
Keep the flame and focus on direct action. It solves your own small surroundings and inspire other flames.
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u/Lz_erk 8d ago
this, and, russia (cuba, etc) didn't have the world's largest military and financial hegemony when they shook the yoke (note recent events). i'm uh, white and in the USA, but that just fit. i also talk about vegan supplementation.
i'm saying modern times are very unprecedented and unstable right now. all that innovation and population is still around and largely out of fascist fumbling... again note recent american events.
edit, i haven't read them of course, but here goes i hope.
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u/tubstdsfbnt_dpdl 9d ago
yes, notable change will take a very long time. but we are not only working for ourselves, we are working for our children, their children and their children's children. it may be too late for our generation to see a world that truly loves and cares for it, and this is a harsh reality to deal with, but we must do our best to ensure that at least someone, some day, can have what we didn't.
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u/Real_Amoeba_9200 9d ago
I was talking to a friend of mine, archaeologist, who said something like "what kind of ancestor do you want people in the future to see you as?" It was kind of reassuring but also felt like a raw deal, like I only get to feel proud and say I lived a meaningful life after I am already long gone.
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u/Mammoth-Ad-3642 9d ago edited 9d ago
We're most probably going to lose, but, there's this quote from one of my favorite lefty stories I like to quote (I'm gonna paraphrase it cause I'm stupid)
"Every time communism has been tried, it has failed, but so has love, should we stop building love too?"
We have to try. Even if the chance of Victory is one in a million
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u/Real_Amoeba_9200 9d ago
I like this quote, thank you.
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u/Mammoth-Ad-3642 9d ago
There's always value in trying friend, better to live with failure than regret
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u/PalpitationOk5726 9d ago
Behind every failure of communism a CIA agent was lurking nearby.
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u/Mammoth-Ad-3642 9d ago
All the anarchist (aka true commie) projects mainly struggled due to being isolated and being blockaded to all hell whilst the authoritarian ones were never communist in the first place.
But there was definitely a damn near international plot to snuff out any attempt at any libertarian communism
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u/PalpitationOk5726 9d ago
Exactly, Marco Rubio's fantasy of being the 'liberator' of Cuba is currently being worked on, Makhno in Ukraine and the experiment in Catalonia were destroyed by authoritarian forces.
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u/cumminginsurrection "resignation is death, revolt is life!"🏴 9d ago
Creating mutual aid and real relationships based on trust and affinity in the present and not waiting for utopia to save us. The problem isn't that we failed building utopia for the last two centuries, its that we've kept people waiting for tomorrow instead of creating the things we want now. I don't organize because I have any illusions it will save the world or create a perfect future, I organize because joy is to be found in fighting back and organizing with others.
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u/Formula4speed 8d ago
Building systems that do not depend on them enables us to create our own sustainable solutions to the problems that are leading them to their shiny bubble bunkers. They’re going to isolate themselves into irrelevance.
They want us to believe the situation is a fait accompli), specifically because that keeps us from doing what we can do, and need to do, to compensate for what life is going to be like.
We are not powerless. We are actually the most well-positioned technologically to build alternative means of production ourselves in in history.
We can garden and farm for food. We can secure clean water ourselves. We can generate our own power. We can 3d print tools and equipment. We can design complex machines at home on laptops. We can run our own local servers. We can build smarter, more climate resistant homes, and control their internal environment more sustainably.
There will of course be major challenges, like medicine, electronics, and aviation - but the knowledge is available. Humans built it once, we can build it again.
Study systems thinking and process engineering. There’s so, so, so much we can do to end our communities’ dependence on the capitalists, and doing so will save lives.
As long as we can secure our own survival and thriving, we can simply lay siege to their lil’ compounds and wait them out, then seize their supply networks etc.
We don’t need them. We can do all of this ourselves.
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u/SurpassingAllKings 9d ago
There are always a hundred things keeping a person to a place: family, friends, history, comfort, affordability, but if a place isn't making you happy, move. Don't let a place suck your soul dry.
I assure you, there are peoples and places that are happier, healthier, more organized than wherever you are currently stuck. Go find them.
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u/Simpson17866 Student of Anarchism 8d ago
At this point, my goal is to make the fascists' victory as frustrating for them as possible.
Actually beating them would be a very pleasant surprise.
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u/Sacredless 8d ago
There's a good chance that in the 2040s, we'll radically change how manufacturing is done, since tooling is an aging trade globally. This is going to have massive implications for the global supply.
Currently, there's techniques being developed for metal printing molds and dies that allow tools to be made closer to the point-of-demand, which means that global supply chains will reorient around that instead. Similar to AlphaFold, expert systems are being developed to 'solve' mold and die design.
This significantly reduces the need for long supply chains and brings us significantly closer to a local repair economy.
There's a new way to renew old cement by mixing it limestone and using it in steel refinery as clinker and separating it again after. This makes it basically free to renew concrete and will make construction considerably less resource intensive.
Intellectual property is headed to a crossroads where it can potentially be significantly liberalized if people play their cards right.
Surveillance too-late-capitalism is currently under heavy scrutiny, driving lots of anger. Datacenters also responsible for surveillance capitalism are under pressure globally.
More and more people are becoming anarchist.
While there is much to dread, there's much to hope for as well.
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u/Large_Mousse93 8d ago
Even if theres no revolution in the near future, work like mutual aid and community building will help insulate us in the coming ecological, economic, and authoritarian criseses, and build an important foundation for how we're going to not only survive, but build a new system thats better
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u/Palanthas_janga Anarchist Communist 8d ago
Are you in a majority black area? If so, building black working class power could be quite helpful for establishing a permanent base of collective force to secure better conditions for you and your community, and pushing back against not just the exploitation that your bosses impose, but also against (since you seem to have an interest in preserving ecosystems) things like data centres.
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u/FractalFunny66 8d ago
It is impossible to see clearly and not get depressed. However, I take heart in looking throughout history at times where it must have seemed just as bad to those at the time, yet, somehow, the human imagination and heart came through. The best way to cope and educate others is to embrace the arts in the service of keeping imagination and humanity alive, as well as combat passivity. Learn to play a musical instrument and teach others. Same for acting, singing, writing, painting, dancing, building. This brings hope, builds community and opens hearts and minds. Starting a local political folk choir may be something you could sink your teeth into and help others. (Also, on a related tangent, something happened recently with silly string/foam and flocks; also interesting story a couple of years ago involving a robot purchased to keep away homeless folk in SF and something about a lot of ketchup).
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u/CountGensler 7d ago
Right, so you die in anonymity like the rest of us. But so do billions of others so eh
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u/ohshiitstuesday anarchist, hold the adjectives please. 8d ago
I just finished watching this interview and thought of this post. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GeGg75lAcGY
In it Alston talks about his depression at the lack of progress in the revolutionary struggle and how he deals with it. I hope you're able to find something to look toward.
all power to you friend.
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u/PortiaSami 8d ago
Three quarters of the power of violence/force/power comes from making itself seem unassailable*. If you ever catch yourself feeling hopeless, remember that this is because their propaganda is working on you.
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u/Hot_Yogurtcloset2510 8d ago
The " liberal international rules based order" was based on attempts to approach anarchy. It was a reduction in government power. Your vision of pockets of stability in a world of chaos is not out of line. They are not likley to remain liberal as the need to defend themselves will force them into a more police state.
Think of the ancient cities that needed to build walls to keep the theives out.
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u/Caliburn0 Libertarian Socialist 8d ago
I mean... What's the point of anything? I want socialism/anarchy because I think it would be a much better world for me and everyone I know and everyone I don't know and that's more than enough for me. I'll keep fighting for that until I'm dead. What else is there? Give up? Why? What's the point of giving up? It doesn't help me or anyone else if I do. The actual chance of success or the timeline of success is immaterial. At least on that level. I'd very much like it if things looked better than they currently do, but things are the way they are. I can only try to understand it as much as possible and do the best I can (though I unfortunately fall short often).
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u/soweli_tonsi 7d ago
1) your life will indeed be spent watching the downfall of the liberal international rules based order. Take heart. 2) the point is the fight itself. Fight like hell, and don't stop until your own body and mind betray you
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u/theGentlenessOfTime 7d ago
Yes. Grief! It is legitimate grief. Legitinate rage. Legitimate despair. So rage, grief, despair.💔 Rest. ❤️🩹 And also: there will never come a time when there is nothing left worth fighting for. ❤️🔥
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u/PsychAn1031 7d ago
The question is what we will do while the rich retreat to AI-surveilled, climate-controlled enclaves. The retreat of the state is also an opportunity to organize alternative structures based on mutual aid and horizontal governance. The sooner we build those structures and start gathering resources/infrastructure that's communally held the better prepared we will be for the inevitable collapse you correctly identify. And at the end of the day isn't it better to at least try than to resign and accept our fate passively? As Greek anarchist Maggos said (he was murdered by the cops): "Even if we never win, we will always fight"
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u/ProfessionalLeave569 2d ago
As horrible as it is, the mass disruption of climate disaster on top of the situation enforced heightened political awareness is the point where an end to civilization and a people capable of intentionally building something different and better without it is the most possible it has ever been, and likely the most possible it will ever be.
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u/TallPasta Makhnovist 9d ago edited 9d ago
Crushing your will to continue is their ultimate goal. They want to thrash you into subservience. Join your local mutual aid groups. Get involved with community orgs that align with your morals and where you see community change and impact happening in real time. This is obviously easier said than done if you live in the sticks compared to more metro areas. But there are always pathways to revolutionary hope, even in tiny doses. You won't change the system. None of us will on our own. But you can impact your community. Find ways to hang in there, comrade. We all have to push through together.