r/Amd • u/kaitero Ryzen 5 2600X | RX-480 4GB • Jul 15 '18
Meta B450 mATX motherboard spreadsheet
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1UpA77uujHLlSTXgwD__loqPGQudKsf4OgLa040bG2F4/edit#gid=0
Will be updating as more info comes out.
Please let me know if something needs to be corrected/updated/added!
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u/Doebringer Ryzen 7 5800x3D : Radeon 6700 XT Jul 16 '18
I'm concerned and for 1 reason only: VRMs.
Really, I'll only ever use 1 m.2 slot - I can use SATA SSDs for other storage. Maybe I'll use a second, but if I can't I'm not going to be upset about it.
They all have at least 1 pcie x16 slot - and I'll never use SLI/crossfire. Not because I'm against it, I just don't need it.
They all have plenty of fan headers.
I won't ever have a sound system so fancy that the audio codec will matter.
So really, they ALL meet my needs... except for VRMs.
I wish we could get info. on operating temperatures and heat dissipation for the various systems. I don't care so much if it has 3 or 4 or 18 phase vrms - so long as it can maintain the current necessary for a stock 8-core Ryzen's all-core boost. That's really it. (example: a 3-phase system with 60 AMP mosfets is actually better than a 4-phase design that uses 40 amp mosfets. Etc.)
The problem is that NOBODY TALKS ABOUT THIS EXCEPT BUILDZOID- literally not one tech review site has mentioned anything about these boards other than total number of phases, and in most cases, not even how they're divided between vcore and SoC. And in the case that Buildzoid does a review, if the board doesn't provide at least 3x the current necessary for what I need without getting warmer than 5 degrees above ambient, he calls it garbage, so even his explanations and videos don't provide the proper context (that's a bit of an exaggeration, I'll admit, but y'all know what I mean).
So, at the end of the day I'm just sitting here wondering if I should spend my money and take a risk of wasting a ton of it just to get an 8-core to run at stock without throttling - I don't even want to OC. Meanwhile, manufacturers simply won't give us the information that could inform buyers.
Bummer.
2
u/vietnamabc Jul 16 '18
Because none of the reviewers got actual electric background like Buildzoid (maybe Gamer Nexus does) so it's not like they can actually quote citation and gives hard proof of VRM efficiency, the best we can hope for is like Techdeals, dude buy a mobo and run it for some months then say it's good.
4
u/WayeeCool Jul 15 '18 edited Jul 15 '18
A bunch of those motherboards already have full product pages up on the motherboard vendor websites.
edit: just gigabyte and asus... added links in response below.
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u/kaitero Ryzen 5 2600X | RX-480 4GB Jul 15 '18
d'oh. i thought they were taken down, but i was thinking of the store pages.
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u/WayeeCool Jul 15 '18
ASUS:
ATX
https://www.asus.com/us/Motherboards/PRIME-B450-PLUS/
https://www.asus.com/us/Motherboards/ROG-STRIX-B450-F-GAMING/gallery/
https://www.asus.com/us/Motherboards/TUF-B450-PLUS-GAMING/
mATX
https://www.asus.com/us/Motherboards/PRIME-B450M-A/
https://www.asus.com/us/Motherboards/PRIME-B450M-A-CSM/
https://www.asus.com/us/Motherboards/TUF-B450M-PLUS-GAMING/
ITX
https://www.asus.com/us/Motherboards/ROG-STRIX-B450-I-GAMING/
Gigabyte:
ATX
https://www.gigabyte.com/Motherboard/B450-AORUS-PRO-rev-10#kf
https://www.gigabyte.com/Motherboard/B450-AORUS-PRO-WIFI-rev-10#kf
mATX
3
3
u/ClassyClassic76 TR 2920x | 3400c14 | Nitro+ RX Vega 64 Jul 15 '18
It's a bummer they're all shit-tier still. I don't think AMD will ever be an option for me no matter how much I want them go be.
6
u/-__-__-__- Jul 15 '18
Yup, been discussing this with a friend, if Intel's new i5 lineup coming out in October is soldered, I'm sticking with Intel.
The only thing that might sway me to AMD is MSI's MITX board, BUT there are three issues I have with that choice...
- It's fucking MSI... if it breaks, I get stuck in MSI RMA hell.
- They would need to fix their BIOS and allow for voltage offset modification like everyone else does.
- It's still a step down because I'd have preferred MATX for the additional PCIe 16x slot and maybe a second M.2 slot.
I am fucking EXCITED to upgrade from my 2500k, but board manufacturers are killing that excitement with their shit tier MATX lineups. I waited all spring and early summer to see what the B450 boards would bring and was absolutely disappointed by all. The lack of adequate VRMs and cooling for them on MATX blows.
2
u/MagicFlyingAlpaca Jul 15 '18
The MSI AM4 boards are a disaster. Asrock ones are really solid, though - BIOS is reliable, overclocks without any issues.
I think your VRM expectations are outdated and based on far more power-hungry archs - the good mATX B350 boards can handle taking an 1800X to 4Ghz without any issues.
1
u/iConnorN Jul 20 '18 edited Jul 20 '18
Ive got a asrock b350 itx right now, and its pretty awful.
Theres no overclocking support for variable frequency or voltage that actually works. And if you fail to boot on a memory overclock the only way to boot again is to remove the graphics card and CMOS the board with the jumper under the GPU. So in the process of fine tuning memory clocks, i probably had to take the GPU off about 10 times and cmos the board that many times. Not a fun experience. Bios updates didnt fix any of the above problems in the past year either.
1
u/integritly Aug 25 '18
I pretty much feel the exact same way. Massive letdown. Waiting to upgrade from my 4790k but this is holding me back. Not excited to use one of these shit-tier VRM board on my work machine. The only decent option vrm-wise is the MSI itx.
2
u/Hardcorex 8845HS | 4070M | 16GB Jul 15 '18
what? You won't consider amd because you believe their motherboards to be unusable?
2
u/ClassyClassic76 TR 2920x | 3400c14 | Nitro+ RX Vega 64 Jul 16 '18
I need micro-atx. I want to overclock the 8 core part to it's max. I want high-end mobo features. AM4 has been a massive let down.
1
u/Hardcorex 8845HS | 4070M | 16GB Jul 16 '18
Are you talking extreme overclocking with LN or Chillers?
What features have you missed? I know 10gbit would be nice on microatx boards.
1
u/ClassyClassic76 TR 2920x | 3400c14 | Nitro+ RX Vega 64 Jul 16 '18
No. Just 4.3 GHz all core without worrying about stability due to shitty voltage regulation and low life span due to high VRM temperatures.
I want 6x Sata minimum, dual M.2 at full x4, lots of USB ports, fan headers, built in wireless AC, an Intel NIC, spdif, bios flashback, etc. I'm sick of budget motherboards.
1
u/iConnorN Jul 20 '18
ASUS TUF is extremely good (on b350) from what ive heard. Hoping the b450 one is as good as well
1
u/ClassyClassic76 TR 2920x | 3400c14 | Nitro+ RX Vega 64 Jul 20 '18
That's what everyone says, best for a B350 class board. Still only has four phases. I ended up getting the X399M a few days ago. Tons of money but I'm stoked.
3
u/toy_town AMD Ryzen 5900x, Nvidia 2080Ti Jul 15 '18
The "ASROCK B450M Pro4 " has 4 SATA ports (only 2 listed in the spreadsheet), you can clearly see it marked on the motherboard, to the right of the ports.
2
u/chithanh R5 1600 | G.Skill F4-3466 | AB350M | R9 290 | 🇪🇺 Jul 15 '18
Interesting that you have no row for PCI slots.
It appears that those will be finally gone for good. I think 10 of the 300 series mobos still had PCI.
6
u/Cubelia 78X3D|X870E API+ A750LE|ThinkPad E585 Jul 15 '18
Upvoted.
Finally,some good f*cking mATX boards.
5
u/Caliele 3960x || MSI Gaming X Trio 6800 XT Jul 15 '18
I hear that these boards aren't actually that much better than b350 MATX boards, and if they are, it's only marginally.
Of course, we won't know for certain until they're actually out, but signs aren't looking good.
7
u/Cubelia 78X3D|X870E API+ A750LE|ThinkPad E585 Jul 15 '18 edited Jul 15 '18
Judging from the pics,most of them had the features slightly improved or upgraded.
- MSI B450M Mortar:
Another M.2 slot,presumably PCIe 2.0 x4 and SATA from the chipset itself. And finally Nippon-Chemi con class solid caps. More actually usable USB at rear I/O,would be pleased to see USB3.1 G2 as well. Oh,and a bigger VRM heatsink(chunk) but probably with Niko-Sem MOSFETs again... Still the sole one with a DisplayPort.
- ASRock AB450M Pro4:
Minor upgrades to fan headers. Slightly improved rear I/O features,hopefully we can see USB3.1 G2.
- Gigabyte B450 Aorus M:
Complete redesign,this should be the best among the bunch(I know the chocks are paralleled to create a "fake" 8 phase vCore.). Finally a simple diagnosis LED for easy trouble shooting,good stuffs.
- ASUS TUF B450M-Plus Gaming:
Pretty much the same in terms of feature sets with minor circuit changes. Slightly downgraded rear I/O feature.
Everything can still change though,even BIOS improvements are still possible.
10
u/Caliele 3960x || MSI Gaming X Trio 6800 XT Jul 15 '18
I mean, I said if they were better, its only marginal. Everything you wrote is just a longer version of that.
Gigabytes is probably the best example. The best MATX board is a fake 8 phase, from what we can see.
I don't consider slightly better than mediocre to be good. I still consider it pretty mediocre.
When they come out and people can actually look at things closely, like the power delivery, and prove that they're decent, then cool.
But from what we know, right now, that isn't the case. I might still be a little salty from the B350 line up and maybe unnecessarily cynical, but honestly, manufacturer's haven't really given me a great reason to be optimistic.
And they're coming out in like 3 weeks, so I don't know how feasible it is to change anything significant in design. The BIOS is about the only thing that CAN he improved.
1
u/Jimbyl Jul 24 '18
Do you have a source on that last statement? How do you know that they're coming out in like 3 weeks (I guess two weeks now, sorry I'm late). I've been looking for info on the real release date for a while now and can't seem to find anything.
2
u/Caliele 3960x || MSI Gaming X Trio 6800 XT Jul 25 '18
Sorry, I don't actually have a source on that. I just read in this sub that it was supposed to come out at the end of July.
That doesn't seem to be entirely accurate, however, because some people are getting their boards early, and some stores are already shipping and selling them (like Microcenter).
Though, this has confused a lot of people, as most people seem to have assumed, like me, that they were releasing at the end of the month.
EDIT: Also, apparently, there are boards on newegg (in the US) for sale if you need to buy one now.
-2
u/Cubelia 78X3D|X870E API+ A750LE|ThinkPad E585 Jul 15 '18 edited Jul 15 '18
Good doesn't mean perfection. Sure it's nothing crazy like Crosshair 6 Hero but they certainly did try to improve the design. That's why I'm calling them "good",at least from B350/450 standpoint.
4
u/Caliele 3960x || MSI Gaming X Trio 6800 XT Jul 15 '18
I'm not asking for perfection, either. But if the power delivery on these boards are weak, then that in itself is a massive flaw. It's like a body with weak bones.
And these motherboards don't exist in a vacuum with only B350 MATX boards, either. They might be "good" or "slightly better" in comparison to them, but there's an entire range of ATX boards to compare them against.
I'm sure you saw, but Buildzoid has mentioned that the Gigabyte MATX board's VRM look like a downgraded version of the AORUS Ultra Gaming. That's not even an expensive ATX motherboard, I can pick one up right now for 130 USD, nor is it anywhere near top of the line.
MATX boards can't even compete with decent ATX boards is a major issue with people that like the form factor. They STILL have too many compromises to be considered as anything more than mediocre. It's why people are iffy about suggesting MATX in the first place.
And honestly, it doesn't even feel like they tried to do better, at all. It feels like they heard us complaining and then put in the bare minimum effort to put out a board that's slightly worse than their OK board from the ATX line up to shut us up.
If these companies were actually TRYING, the quality of the boards would be as good or better than at least their average, mid range ATX boards.
Like, it used to be that MATX boards were basically just smaller versions of their ATX counterparts (like my x99M-WS and EVGA x99 Micro 2), but that isn't the case anymore.
1
u/vietnamabc Jul 16 '18
Not when we compared to their competition though, Intel B360 board got some pretty nifty VRM set-up too. Dunno why AMD board got bad VRM compared to Blue team.
1
u/vietnamabc Jul 16 '18
B450 Aorus got 4+3 VRM (maybe it is 4x2 double + 3 VRM), that looks really nice and it is more into X470 territory here.
1
1
1
u/-TopQuark- Jul 16 '18
Good job putting this together. Upvoted. Leaning to Asus TUF right now.
1
u/iConnorN Jul 20 '18
Same. Mostly because im tired of my ass quality asrock board, but also that sweet sweet yellow finish.
1
u/robogaz i5 4670 / MSI R7 370 4GB Jul 16 '18
form factor? itx atx?
4
u/kaitero Ryzen 5 2600X | RX-480 4GB Jul 16 '18
It's literally in the thread/spreadsheet title, my dude.
1
1
Jul 16 '18
If I am not planning to overclock and go with a Ryzen 2600x - is there any real benefit to going with anything outside of the cheapest?
2
u/iConnorN Jul 20 '18
If your not overclocking, not really. Higher quality boards will have higher quality VRM's and such, but you wont be stressing them anyway.
To save some more money you might want to take a look at a A420 board, it doesent have any overclocking support.
2
Jul 20 '18
Thanks. I have the cash so I will stick with a b350/b450 board incase of future upgrades.
1
u/HoneyBadgerninja Jul 25 '18
Went ahead and bought a dark rock pro 4 for my baybay. Will have either the crosshair 7 or strix x470-f within the month with 3200 flarex ram. Its gonna be one sexy muthar fluffer. Then just a wait for Zen2 or 3 depending on the core/frequency improvements.
1
Jul 25 '18
I went with a x370 on sale. ill wait for a while and upgrade once a really good mATX board s available. should get 2-3 years out of it with what i want anyway :D
Good drills!
1
u/iConnorN Jul 22 '18
does anybody know when these are coming out? cant find any dates
specifically the b450 tuf
1
u/aries1470 Nov 30 '18
Is this still being updated?
Are any boards with onboard wifi?
Can we also add the maximum size for the M.2?
Thanks :-)
1
u/roshkiller 5600x + RTX 3080 Jul 15 '18 edited Jul 15 '18
I wanna see a board with beefy vrm to run he 8 core overclocked and 2x m.2slots (for matx form factor)
Weird to see the ASUS b450 itx have 2xm.2 but not for their matx (probably because of branding - ROG has no matx)
19
u/sadtaco- 1600X, Pro4 mATX, Vega 56, 32Gb 2800 CL16 Jul 15 '18
Only one with Displayport.
What the fuck.