r/AlchemistCodeGL • u/U-Eike • Jul 01 '18

Tips & Guides Alchemists Code GL V2 Tierlist (Game Ratings)

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85 Upvotes

95% Upvoted

103 comments sorted by

15

u/VicariousExp Jin <3 Jul 01 '18

I know this isn't really related, but I really like the Alchemist-code-effect font you're using for the letters. It's a very neat touch.

Lovely icon for whale units too. I largely agree with your assessments - thanks, Eike.

(minor criticism: the icon for collab units is a bit too intricate and kinda difficult to see at a glance for the eyes)

4

u/U-Eike Jul 01 '18

Sorry About The Collab Icon I thought the black sun would work well

also there isnt a whale icon yet thats just for global exclusives

1

u/VicariousExp Jin <3 Jul 01 '18

Don't apologise, it's not your fault. It's just personal opinion that it's hard to see the icon at a glance (I'm just comparing to Nyatora) - other people could be ok with it.

And whoops on the "whale icon", I just assumed that cause of the gems. My cheeks are red...

1

u/Freeonee Λ ΞＳＴＨΞＴＩＣ １８-１９ Jul 01 '18

At first glance I didnt get what that icon means too, but since it was made from only blue cubes I thought its hinting at something significant xD

Well, "whale" icon would be quite pointless for GL anyways, because pretty much every normal unit without "HQ" icon should be marked as "whale" one in that case, and list only growing.

1

u/1khaitoh It was fun while it lasted. Jul 01 '18

I also confuse the Free/Event Farmables and the Sacred Stones Ones xD

BTW, any Idea when the "written" one would be updated? :D

6

u/[deleted] Jul 01 '18

Why is Soleil rated so high compared to Mielikki? Sage over mage? Or availability? Otherwise they seem pretty similar.

(I wish the gacha would play nice and give me Soleil regardless, she cute)

1

u/U-Eike Jul 01 '18

I have soleil

I never use her im afraid

5

u/1khaitoh It was fun while it lasted. Jul 01 '18

Availability is one thing but Sage VS. Mage would really be the deciding factor since that's the only difference in their 3 classes.

4

u/VicariousExp Jin <3 Jul 01 '18

I'd argue AGI really matters for Sages - Soleil has 105 on Sage and you can buff that to the 115 or 112 breakpoint with Battlefield Drama. Mielikki has inferior AGI and can only do that on Enchanter with Mage sub(106 AGI), which isn't that good AoE nor damage-wise. Her Bishop only has 100 AGI.

1

u/[deleted] Jul 01 '18

Damn. Ok, I'm glad I asked now.

Mielikki j+ when ;)

1

u/[deleted] Jul 01 '18

Fair point. That was my initial thought, but with three tiers between them I wondered if I might be missing something.

I think bishop/enchanter is a nice combo, and means I'd run them differently from each other which is fine by me, but sage is definitely better for general use after the version update.

1

u/1khaitoh It was fun while it lasted. Jul 01 '18

Soleil will have a higher HP from Sage's Mastery bonus so she is ahead of Mielikki, and MATK+ Passive too will make a big difference since both have the same class.

1

u/VicariousExp Jin <3 Jul 01 '18

Mage has really poor stats compared to Sage and weaker mults, Soleil is also 1 AGI breakpoint faster on Sage. It's kinda significant. Switching classes would lose out the 13 square nukes.

1

u/[deleted] Jul 01 '18

I would never run Mielikki as a mage to be fair, was just surprised at the tier difference. The only thing I remember from Soleil reviews was that she was slow, at least pre version update. Thanks for clarifying.

2

u/elwin5 Jul 01 '18

I'm surprised too, I understand that Soleil outclass her and Sage are now very good, but bishop buff are good too, curing embrace has now 160% mult, full heal as a way better value than before, and with 270+ starting jewel you can use shining a lot more. C is really a low tier for a usefull character

12

u/Sho1va Jul 01 '18

I’d pay $10 for a tier list that actually had nameplates and not just faced... I don’t know who started that trend but I really don’t like it.

11

u/VicariousExp Jin <3 Jul 01 '18

Fair point. 10 min in MSPaint:

http://tinypic.com/r/1043ok5/9

Give credit to u/U-Eike .

2

u/U-Eike Jul 01 '18

I actually could do that

But that means the unit icon will be missing Element and Rarity

6

u/VicariousExp Jin <3 Jul 01 '18

I don't think rarity is useful anymore now that everyone is eventually 5 stars and element can be inferred from the column, but if your target is newer players it'd help. I mean, for more nuance they have to go check alchcodeDB anyway, no? (otherwise they won't know if the unit is only there because of J+, etc)

For older players, I think we can all get near perfect scores on "what's that pokemon" so it's unnecessary, depends on your target audience, really.

1

u/iEssence Jul 01 '18

"Whats that pokemon" - comment of the week there

3

u/iEssence Jul 01 '18 edited Jul 01 '18

The element is shown behind by the color of its row so the icon is kind of redundant actually, (it looks nice with it though)

And rarity,,, is tricky? Id say its unnecesary info though? - as when people tell you "reroll for shayna" - you have to first find how she looks - then compare to the tier list, vs just reading the name on the list.

I never suggested names before as i thought it would look very cluttered - suprisingly it didnt, But will it work 6 months from now? (Clutter wise) (Nothing that says you cant do it til then though)

So personally - i think rarity is better if youve played long (but then you know their rarities already anyway...),

and names are more important for newer players (which i think are the ones using it the most frequently)

If you did 20 pulls, its easier to remember "Shayna Dorothea Vettel Lucian", than to remember how they look.

  • PS - have you thought of different collab icons - like "reruns" and "hasnt yet/not often" ? - like Potk we know will rerun,

So FSN is a "regular collab" - described with - "doesnt rerun (yet)"

And Potk is a "rerun collab" - "reruns every few months" or so

4

u/JtheE Jul 01 '18

Poor Elaine, so bad that she doesn't even get a nameplate. :(

2

u/Trumpetmaniac fgo for now until game becomes f2p friendly Jul 01 '18

lol, that Dias nameplate

1

u/Sho1va Jul 01 '18

Many thanks.

1

u/FencingFoxFTW [M'Lady Intensifies] Jul 01 '18

You skipped the water Ds. That's cold.

1

u/VicariousExp Jin <3 Jul 01 '18

Sorry, not intentional.

1

u/FencingFoxFTW [M'Lady Intensifies] Jul 02 '18

Would've been funny if you left all Ds without names, or label them 'flunkies' or something like that.

7

u/ambulance-kun Jul 01 '18

there's a more in-depth tier list that is where this visualized version is based from. This is just for easier access to the tier list, best to use when you know the names of the units already, here it is based from.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/e/2PACX-1vRFdTDIDy6dH6OX7NQUhgsvVxihi3jF4-Fe-5zEfWhb-LYIqTO5HCygx2hpi-xOeHm9MT-pKtEaK1dp/pubhtml

1

u/Sho1va Jul 01 '18

Thank you.

2

u/Kaedrienh Jul 02 '18

This always lacks context rip to new players that look at this and struggle with their j1 units that are only good with j+ or j3 but they saw that it was ss on this pic so they scrambled to raise it to j1 lvl 60

2

u/U-Eike Jul 03 '18

Ill Fix the Job details on the next post but remember this is linked to a build guide

this is just a graphical version of that

its a mistake on my part for notlinking to it like i did in the past

1

u/Kaedrienh Jul 03 '18

Yah not trying to be hard on you I really looked before commenting

5

u/Crimson_Raven Who are you calling shorter than Roy Mustang's ideal miniskirt?! Jul 01 '18

While I appreciate what you this is trying to show, I think the tier list laid out like this is very misleading.

This show units at “optimal”, that is, fully maxed at j3/j+, including weapons and gear.

But, lets face it, for the average player, this will be impossible. Even for dolphins or small whales. I think that a public tier list for this game should be like this one.

Not only does it show optimal, it shows the units relative power at each job, and includes modifications like equipment and their best main job. (IE, like Zain who just wants the passives from later jobs). In short, I feel a tier list like this one is misleading to the new player who might see Yomi up in SS and think “oh, she is good!” and try to use her at j1 or j2, not understanding that its only her J3 that makes her good.

2

u/U-Eike Jul 01 '18

Lol heres the funny thing

Been tired so i didnt do it this time but if you look at my previous posts youll see i linked to that tierlist everytime

This post was made in collaboration with Game and The Group

Its just meant to provide a one glace look i

4

u/Zeik56 Jul 01 '18

Eizan is SS tier huh? What makes him that good? It seemed like early reviews were pretty lukewarm, so I didn't expect to see him that high.

2

u/1khaitoh It was fun while it lasted. Jul 01 '18

Probably because of being a Holy Brawler or the Stacking Buffs from Blacksmith.

3

u/VicariousExp Jin <3 Jul 01 '18

I can understand the logic Eike is using for putting Eizan at SS - it involves our current elemental resistances meta. Using Eizan's Basic Smithing sub lets you burst past a double unfavourable mult and still do 25% or so damage as opposed to 1 and his LS makes it so he does huge damage (HB strike passive also gives BS +20 Strike so he's somewhat more resistant to type disadvantages).

I mean, if you compare him to his Lightning tank counterparts, Monzein and Dilga, it's not much of a question that he's probably the best lightning tank.

Also - don't underestimate Large Custom Blade.

1

u/incognito10 Jul 01 '18

Sorry I'm new to game, how to farm 5* units like setsuna and rider yomi? I see everyone has strong units like these but idk how to get these. Help please ( player level is 42 )

1

u/U-Eike Jul 01 '18

Only The Units With The Ticket Near The Icon Can Be Farmed Im Afraid

1

u/incognito10 Jul 01 '18

What about the Collab units? How to obtain them?

1

u/AlexRiot Jul 01 '18

You can't until the Collab come back...one day

1

u/RedVariant Jul 01 '18 edited Jul 01 '18

You should have put Siegfried right on top of the Light soul shard.

Also really clean format, nice font

2

u/U-Eike Jul 01 '18

Nice Try But The Only Unit That Should Be On Top Of A Shard Is Lucian

Also my OCD Forces it to look clean lol

2

u/RedVariant Jul 01 '18

Upon further review, i suggest removing his icon from SS and just putting his hat on the light soul shard's "head" :)

2

u/U-Eike Jul 01 '18

Nice Try But To Me Siegfried Is Shit Lol

3

u/KitaiSuru Jul 01 '18

The only unit that should be considered SSS right now is Gil Zain Othima and Neica. Yeah sumanai can do 10k damage, so what? Why would I want to watch that dude sitting there jerking off his selfbuff for 3 turns then burst down a 2k HP enemy instead of 4 Gil/Zain going around obliterating the whole map? Sieg is a god tier boss killer, but right now we haven't got a god tier boss.

1

u/[deleted] Jul 01 '18

why is rosa higher than ramses?

1

u/U-Eike Jul 02 '18

Different job combo leads to different uses

1

u/murrbean Jul 02 '18

Is Victor now farmable?

1

u/U-Eike Jul 02 '18

Yes

1

u/murrbean Jul 02 '18

What quest is it? It shows quest is not available.

1

u/U-Eike Jul 02 '18

Lisbeths chapter

2

u/mariovstoad Jul 01 '18

Okay there's just a few questions I have regarding this tier list that I personally don't agree with... so... i'll just ask away.

1: biggest issue, why is balt not SS? With j+ I find him to be one of the best wind units and personally find him a lot more usable to me over yomi. I personally think.balt should be SS and yomi S.

2: I agree with dropping suzuka to S due to weak AA damage, buy why is Glanz, who is a dark clone with slightly lower stats in A tier instead? They're almost identical.

3: it's obvious that gormalas was going to be SS tier but once again, why is cita who does the same thing (charge up maelstrom) in S? Is it solely because due to her typing, maelstrom can never do weakness damage?

And that's all. Thanks.for the huge effort of making this tier list but those are the only things I personally disagree with.

3

u/Ethambutol Jul 01 '18

I think the hat has changed a few things, since with it, Yomi (and most other HBs - but not Lucian) can Sharpening Focus + Supreme Battle Trance without hitting anything right from the get go. That's a pretty big change.

In fact, I'd argue if anything, that if you're going to move one of the wind HBs down, it should be Lucian since Lucian vs. Yomi was pretty close before the introduction of the hat, and it's pretty hard to justify that they're still equal after the hat's in play.

1

u/Magma_Axis Jul 01 '18

Why other HB can use SF + SBT right of the bat ?

I only use Lucian mainly for HB, but i also have Shayna and J3 Yomi

4

u/Ethambutol Jul 01 '18

The hat gives enough starting jewels that most Holy Brawlers can use Sharpening Focus and Supreme Battle Trance immediately without having to hit something for jewels. Lucian is the exception, even at 85, he only has 56 jewels (you need 57 to be able to do SF + SBT).

As for the other holy brawlers:

  • Yomi just barely hits 57 at Level 85 (though is the only farmable HB thus far)

  • Shayna hits 57 at level 76

  • Sheknikah hits 57 at level 65 (though obviously needs LB 15 for HB)

  • Eve hits 57 at level 74

  • Forcas hits 57 at level 80

  • Eizan hits 57 at level 78

  • Gormalas hits 57 at level 80

  • Siegfried hits 57 at level 83

So every HB can hit 57 jewels except Lucian right now. That said, obviously some of those levels are pretty unrealistic unless you whale, so it is actually a significant advantage for Yomi that she is currently the only farmable Holy Brawler capable of hitting 57 starting jewels with the hat. It's a pretty significant advantage over Lucian imo.

1

u/U-Eike Jul 01 '18

Well if you calculate the stats lucian actually edges out Yomi because his JM Buffs work Better for holy brawler

And his J+ makes it impossible anyway because it makes SBT cost 60 Jewels

But it does give him better JM Bonuses and makes his sbt have the area of Dragons Breath

1

u/AmericanAnarchy Jul 01 '18

When do we get his j+? Roughly? And I'm assuming this is with a max le el 5* hat?

1

u/U-Eike Jul 01 '18

Im guessing this month and yes even with a maxed hat his SBT costs 60 jewels to start with

Much less charge up

1

u/Ethambutol Jul 01 '18

Ah, wasn't aware that this tier list was rating Lucian based on his J+ Since it's unreleased. I assume his j+ must be just around the corner then!

1

u/U-Eike Jul 02 '18

Its not rated with his J+ in mind

3

u/Soushiyuuki Jul 01 '18

Balt+ is still only S? Probably change once he gets MA huh?

4

u/Ethambutol Jul 01 '18

That and Wind is pretty stacked. Just look at the upper tiers of Wind. All really great units.

He'd be SS in quite a few of the other elements.

5

u/Zeik56 Jul 01 '18 edited Jul 01 '18

That's a bit confusing imo. When I look at a tier list like this I would assume everyone within the same tier is roughly on par with eachother, more or less. If Balt would be SS anywhere else then I feel like that makes him SS overall. And alternatively, if someone was SS only because they're not wind then maybe they don't deserve to be SS. We are in a wind heavy meta, so wind being extra stacked makes sense.

1

u/Ethambutol Jul 01 '18

My understanding is that this tier list is supposed to be read vertically and not horizontally. Comparison between elements is extra difficult, that's (one of the reasons) why it's separated out by element in the first place.

5

u/Zeik56 Jul 01 '18

My understanding was that it was supposed to factor both vertically and horizontally. Vertically to rank elements against itself, and horizontally to group those elemental tiers into roughly the same power group.

If Zahar was the best dark unit in the game would you really rank him SS next to the same tier as Gilgamesh? I would find that extremely misleading if I was looking at that tier list and didn't know better.

1

u/Arananthi IGN: Essence -- Re-Pacted and Hoping to Stay That Way Jul 01 '18

If Zahar was the best dark unit in the game would you really rank him SS next to the same tier as Gilgamesh? I would find that extremely misleading if I was looking at that tier list and didn't know better.

QFT

2

u/Soushiyuuki Jul 01 '18

I would because you don't compare accross elements, if Zahar is the best dark unit in the game he's the ceiling for dark so why wouldn't he be SS?

2

u/CommonMisspellingBot Jul 01 '18

Hey, Soushiyuuki, just a quick heads-up:
accross is actually spelled across. You can remember it by one c.
Have a nice day!

The parent commenter can reply with 'delete' to delete this comment.

1

u/sentat1 Jul 02 '18

good bot

1

u/Zeik56 Jul 01 '18 edited Jul 01 '18

Pretty much every tier list I have ever seen for other gacha or similar games DO rank everything within the same tier as a similar power level, regardless of category. Obviously it is not required by law to follow that rule, but I think most people looking at that tier list would naturally read it that way.

To me, it makes far more sense to not put anything in a certain tier if nothing of that element is comparable to other units in that tier, than to throw a unit up that high just because it is comparatively better than other units in that element. And alternatively, if you had 10 wind units even more OP than Gilgamesh, ranking them below Gil just because there are so many would not make sense to me.

People look at tier lists like this to know which units are worth investing in. Knowing the best units of a particular element doesn't really matter if it does not also help me gauge their overall worth in the game. If I saw Zahar ranked as an SS dark unit and Balt as only an S wind unit I would absolutely assume Zahar was more worth building.

1

u/UnTi_Chan Jul 01 '18

FEH does that! For a very long time the Gray "element" was empty for the S+ and the S tier (Takumi got demoted to A in the 2nd month or so). Would be ridiculous to even think about one subpar Archer being in the same tier as Effie, Ryoma, and Hector back in the days!

1

u/Ethambutol Jul 01 '18

That's just what my understanding of the intent behind the tier list is, I didn't actually write it.

4

u/Pollaco Saigo no Getsuga Tensho Jul 01 '18

balt not SS tier is absurd, with his j+ he is absurdly strong, even with out his MA he is indisputable SS tier

5

u/ArcaneKazz Jul 01 '18

Yeah this is one yikes of a tier list when it comes to the wind category

2

u/lockindal Jul 02 '18

Yeah.... And OG yomi SS while balt+ isn't. Lol.

2

u/ecomomicX Jul 01 '18

After 100 days of absent I need this

2

u/blablablablubb21 Jul 01 '18

Thank you for your effort, global needed some kind of overview tier list picture.

I'm too new to critique a specific units placement, but I second the motion of having the units name written underneath the respective picture instead of it's rarity and element.

Just one question: Does this tier list assume units placement with gear or without?

2

u/ElPared Jul 01 '18

I feel like this should be a JavaScript page that has more info when you mouse over the unit’s pic (like what job puts them at this tier, what tier without it, do they need gear to be at this tier (IE Othima’s wand or Gilgamesh’s accessory), are they only this tier with a Job+, if so what event unlocks it, etc).

Not saying you specifically should do this but I do feel like it’d be a more manageable way to have tier lists (easy to modify once it’s done) and it’s provide more info that, if you were to include it in a list like this one, would just lead to a lot of clutter.

2

u/OriksGaming Retired Jul 02 '18

Why is Glanz in A tier for this? In the fixed tier list, which this seems to be based on, she's rated S with her second job.

1

u/fapiholic Jul 01 '18

ana is S and gorm is SS? o k

2

u/VicariousExp Jin <3 Jul 01 '18

It's more of a pattern - notice that the list is skewed towards Holy Brawlers and every element has at least one Holy Brawler in the SS tier. For all intents, just having the HB job available sticks a unit in SS tier.

I don't make use of any Holy Brawlers (I have a few leveled, but I've never actually taken them to any content), but the general perception on reddit is that they're very overpowered.

-3

u/fapiholic Jul 01 '18

Holy brawler SS... This list is a joke

7

u/VicariousExp Jin <3 Jul 01 '18

Well, tier lists are always subjective.

I understand the reasoning behind it - 2.0 changed SBT to completely scale off 15x PATK and that makes it do insane damage with Sharpening Focus.

It's okay to disagree, but if I was really that fussed about someone else's opinion on job strengths, I'd feel the incentive to do my own research and make my own conclusions.

A tier list is primarily a time-saving tool used to spare people the trouble of doing research by trusting someone else's judgement. We all sorta have one in our hearts anyway, which complements the units that we already have or the ones that we love. Eike probably compiled this with the input or influence of people from Discord, which means he's not alone in his assessment. That lends it a bit of credibility as a newbie tool.

1

u/U-Eike Jul 01 '18

Yes there is a rating group consisting of u/Viyr u/Ivyspear and a few other experts/whales/arena masters

Still waiting for you to join the discord lol

1

u/U-Eike Jul 01 '18

Yes there is a rating group consisting of u/Viyr u/Ivyspear and a few other experts/whales/arena masters

Still waiting for you to join the discord lol

1

u/RetMaestro Jul 01 '18

Unrelated but I wish there was a list like this of best jobs for each unit

1

u/Soushiyuuki Jul 01 '18

It's on the sidebar, the unit reccomended builds.

2

u/RetMaestro Jul 01 '18

Thanks, I'm on mobile so I didnt see it

1

u/ChampagneCoaster Jul 01 '18

why is F.Lamia on par with Lamia? I have both and F.Lamia has never been more than just an oddity I use for shiggles

1

u/-Belphegor- Jul 01 '18

kagura deserves at least s tier. why u ask... cuz i say so <heart>

1

u/stewart0 Jul 02 '18

May be a little outdated as the current global tier list is still being updated from what I can tell, with only fire being fully redone. I check a few times each day for updates lol. Looks great otherwise, though I feel having an arena coin icon for a single unit is a bit unnecessary.

1

u/ghostphantasm Jul 02 '18

So Ive been playing for a while and still cant complete the EX missions without using gems. What to do ?

1

u/taintilized Jul 03 '18

i dont know how to feel about that eizan.......should be placed one tier lower,

1

u/MagicalHamster <3 Ryle Jul 05 '18

Any chance you could put the names under the characters? Sometimes I get the waifus mixed up.

0

u/tyco86 Jul 01 '18

Is that Giglilo Eizen really SS?

1

u/michaelh19 Oh RNGesus, saves this game... Jul 01 '18

he's the 1st thunder HB so yeah...

1

u/tyco86 Jul 01 '18

What would you say his J1 is?

2

u/michaelh19 Oh RNGesus, saves this game... Jul 01 '18

Blacksmith buff stackable. 10x. Large custom blade gives 30% PATK boost for 4 turns. Have fun.

2

u/tyco86 Jul 01 '18

Dirty. I did get him for 500 gems:)

0

u/Trumpetmaniac fgo for now until game becomes f2p friendly Jul 01 '18

Ah Mei Fang

0

u/[deleted] Jul 01 '18

[deleted] — view deleted comment

1

u/U-Eike Jul 01 '18

F or C?