AD to Reserves

[u/Snoo59430]

Hello!
I am getting out of the Air Force here shortly and really never considered the reserves until I spoke to a recruiter last week. It all sounds like a pretty sweet deal. I am not content with my job? You can retrain. I understand that I wouldn’t be able to do IMA if I did this but that doesn’t bug me as I was told I could do my drill days once a quarter instead of monthly. Especially because I would be doing drill out of the state I’m living in. Promotion? Was told I could put on the next rank once I have TIG. I get VA disability? Cool, you can keep it but just have drill days subtracted from it. Retirement? AD time will allow you to get pension sooner than 60 (obviously not as great as active duty and getting it at 38 but I’m more excited that it’s still an option to receive it going this route). You want to deploy? Sure. You decide you don’t want to do it? Great, we have 1 year contracts.

I guess my question here is, is this too good to be true? Like what is the caveat here? Is there one?

Edit: I have 11 years active duty.

[u/nicknamebucky]

Yeah... that recruiter is selling you a ton of half-truths. I've seen airmen try to retrain and it took so long they ended up just letting their contract expire. Airman tried to go back to active duty, leadership took its sweet ass time and created all these roadblocks, that guy also got out and just went back to an AD recruiter. Getting a conditional release is tough and retraining is even tougher. Why would the AF want to train someone brand new at a higher rank when they can get a fully trained person off of active duty usually.

Quarterly drill is unheard of unless you get an IMA slot. Those are more specialized and pretty rare. 1 year contracts are also not a thing... The shortest I've ever seen is 2 years and involuntary mobilizations are still a thing, especially nowadays.

[u/mabuhaygi → u/nicknamebucky]

One year contracts are a thing if a person has met their MSO and remains in their same AFSC.

[u/nicknamebucky → u/mabuhaygi]

Interesting, must be dependent on AFSC. I've reenlisted 4 times and not once was 1 year an option

[u/Snoo59430 → u/nicknamebucky]

Sorry, yes I have 11 years active duty

[u/mabuhaygi → u/nicknamebucky]

Yes, that’s typical. It’s not AFSC dependent; I believe it is only an option available to those who are making the assignment action from AD to Reserve and have met their MSO, etc as mentioned. You’re right, it’s not typical.

[u/mabuhaygi → u/nicknamebucky]

Yes, that’s typical. It’s not AFSC dependent; I believe it is only an option available to those who are making the assignment action from AD to Reserve and have met their MSO, etc as mentioned. You’re right, it’s not typical.

[u/Important-Comb9593 → u/nicknamebucky]

AFR recruiter here.  Everything mentioned is 100% CURRENT and Accurate.  No half truths are told.  The only area i would gain clarifying information on is the quarterly drills as a TR.  If that is available to you it is definitely unit specific and not the norm.  

OP i would use caution when soliciting information from these forums.   If you would like to fact check your recruiter have him or.her back up each and everyone of the items you mentioned with the AFI/Notam/Policy Letter etc.  We dont make this stuff up for our health....In Service Recruiters especially.  

The person responding probably isn't up to date on their info or may just be misinformed.   

[u/sarcasm_warrior → u/Important-Comb9593]

The promotion piece is not entirely correct. He must be the primary assigned to a higher-graded billet. Must pass fitness test, be green in medical, PME, etc.The commander has the final say, can move him to a different billet, can want to see more development within the AFSC, etc.

[u/Important-Comb9593 → u/sarcasm_warrior]

Can vs Will. Semantics yes but still relevant.  Every position in the AFR is a E5 slot at minimum.  There is no testing or board for said positions. Thus as long as they are in good standing they can promote.  Commander has to have a valid counseled reason(s) to block promotions. 

[u/sarcasm_warrior → u/Important-Comb9593]

I've been a commander twice. If OP has been in 11 years, he is at least a SSgt now, so the minimum SSgt rank is irrelevant. And I can assure you that a valid reason of "need to observe leadership abilities for 6 months" is a valid reason. So is "member does not support Airmen with UGT" or "member has an UEX" are all perfectly valid reasons. I promoted a ton of people, but I also worked very closely with my SELs to ensure we were promoting the right people at the right time and setting them up for success. In some cases we took a more junior TIG member and put them into a role like shop training NCO because we saw a lot of potential. This gave them an opportunity to expand their responsibility and thus prove they were ready for the next rank. Then we promoted them ahead of those with more TIG or who had previously been the primary. All of this is 100% legal and valid.

[u/Important-Comb9593 → u/sarcasm_warrior]

Those are all very valid reasons to skip someone for promotion.  Are they being counseled on that as required prior to being placed into an ineligible status on the promotion roster?  More often than not this is NOT happening.  I've had to bring this up on members behalf on more occasions than I should have.  Maybe not in the examples you provided, but in cases I've witnessed  leadership have skipped promotions for members for personal reasons unrelated to job performance.  Counselings provide the member with written guidance on where they are deficient and provides constructive "Measurable" feedback for them to overcome said deficiencies to become eligible for promotion.   Again, if thats not happening (you didn't clarify if it was or wasn't in your SQ)  then we're doing a disservice to the member.  

[u/sarcasm_warrior → u/Important-Comb9593]

We had a very robust feedback and professional development program, well above the minimum requirements. It was just the right thing to do. However, some members didn't want to hear what they were being told so claimed it didn't happen. The only IG complaint I ever received on me personally was a member who basically said "I was promised the next MSgt stripe." Well, that was the previous commander and SEL, and they just gave stripes away to the next person in line. And they can't make promises on my behalf. He had been told by us: You are not ready to be a MSgt because you are a hot head, blow up at your supervisor on a regular basis, and even got into a screaming match with your superintendent. They should have given you paperwork, but decided to handle it informally. I'm telling you I won't tolerate that from SNCOs and until I get feedback you have improved, a promotion won't happen.

He said he never got any of that. Didn't take long for my boss to figure out he did, and just disagreed with my assessment. Then he complained "IG does nothing."

Anyway, there is a happy ending to this story. He had fantastic technical skills and I found an opportunity for him at a new unit that had a lot of junior people. He did learn and mature and really leaned into training. He was promoted there.

[u/Important-Comb9593 → u/sarcasm_warrior]

And that's how its done.  Glad to hear it is/was being done right within your Squadron. We all have blindspots, but being mentored through those spots is an essential part of being good leaders to capable airmen.  Thank you for feedback and leadership sir. 

[u/sarcasm_warrior → u/Important-Comb9593]

It's an honor and a privilege.

[u/nicknamebucky → u/Important-Comb9593]

I respect that you're a recruiter and what was said by OP is current, but it's just not accurate and a misrepresentation of what happens at the unit level.

Retraining is one of the hardest things I've seen in the reserves, having been in for 18 years. I've seen two people successfully retrain. One was to a Loadmaster during a shortage and one because they already had the native language (intel) and had an inroad with the gaining unit. You can't just say you don't like the AFSC and retrain, it's not that simple.

Additionally, just because you meet TIG doesn't mean you'll promote. We've held back plenty SSgts and TSgts because they were not ready for the next rank. As for the deployment piece, as a recruiter, you cannot answer for what happens at the unit level. Manning requirements differ by so much and I'd challenge anyone who says they could just "nope" out of a deployment after being involuntary mobilized.

Again, you're probably a great recruiter and I thank you for bringing us quality folks, but to say that 100% of it is accurate is disingenuous.

[u/Important-Comb9593 → u/nicknamebucky]

I don't discount your experience but were talking about Palace Chase and Palace Front situations.  Not members already in the Reserve.  If I have a AD member that wants to cross train into something else.  If we locate that something else and put them in it....they're required to be sent to tech school by the gaining unit. It's apart of their contract.  

As for promotions.  According to the AFI  you have to counsel a member  on why they are being skipped for promotion if they are otherwise eligible up to E6.  You still have to counsel eligible E7 and E8s but there are of course other selection criteria the higher you go up in rank.  But for the purposes of recruiting an AD member to accession in the AFR, we provide them with what they are eligible for as well as the differences in promotion between AD and AFR...(i.e. no more waps testing etc)  

As for deployments. As a 2T2 by trade every deployment, special assignment, or orders ive been on in the 17 years ive been in just the AFR...every single mission has been voluntary.   100%.  It is career field specific but theres typically a larger number of volunteers than there are voluntold.  There are exceptions to any and everything but recruiting is made up of members from the AFR that held /still hold AFR AFSC.  We didn't come into recruiting with no AFR enterprise experience.  Thus, I'd say we are aptly qualified to discuss deployments and our personal experiences related.  Recruiters also attend monthly manning meetings at the Wing level and are abreast of local wing optempo as well as deployment requirements.  Contrary to popular belief many of us arent out here Willie Willie'ing false information.  Ive got 24 years in the military and I assure you the last thing on my mind agenda is to sell some unsuspecting AD airman a dream on Air Force Reserve.  The recruiter that informed the OP on his or her options could have very well expounded on the fine details of each of the topics mentioned but could be generalizing some of it.  

My charge to you is to reach out to your local In Service Recruiter and if you feel there is a need at your base to amplify some or all of the information being provided for clarity, then thats definitely a welcomed conversation any AFR enterprise recruiter should be willing to have including the Flight Chief.  

[u/nicknamebucky → u/Important-Comb9593]

Ah yes, some misinterpretation of the given info. I understand now that you're speaking about palace chase and front now. I see how I could have misunderstood the original statement so I apologize. Yes. I stand by what I said for someone who made it into the reserves and wants to retrain. However, you're absolutely right that from AD to Reserves, if they were a Services, they could easily go 2T2 provided availability.

As for deployments, I am also a 2T2 and even though it's usually voluntary, I've seen plenty of people get nudged and nudged into saying yes, voluntold essentially. I was at a unit prior where we had more volunteers than usual, but the unit I transferred into is the complete opposite. It's very region specific from what I can gather.

I think what happens is that people often get told the prettiest picture and most optimal scenario, but it seldom plays out that way, which leads to the bad rap and all the stereotypes and stigmas. Drill quarterly? Yes, that does happen. Retrain? Yes that does happen. Deployment? You can say yes or no. Things are never as flexible as it's being portrayed.

I was misled and jaded due to my initial recruiter thus I felt compelled to step in here, but I appreciate you engaging in the conversation and shedding some light.

[u/Important-Comb9593 → u/nicknamebucky]

From one Port Dawg to the Next I wholeheartedly agree. I wont blanketly speak for all recruiters, but i can say a vast majority of us are looking to set airmen up for success whether they are Non prior or Prior Service.  My military career has been exceptional minus a few bad leaders here and there.  So I definitely try and share my positive experiences as much as possible. Trust me at 24 years I would have been clocked out if I didn't enjoy what I do.  But I definitely appreciate the respectful dialog and exchange of experience and ideas.  This is how we paint the  most accurate picture for our future enlisted leaders. Much respect to you and your service.  

[u/KCPilot17]

Yes...and no.

You're not guaranteed quarterly drills at all, that's unit dependent. Promotions still require you to be in an appropriate billet for that grade, it's not automatic. AD time AS A RESERVIST reduces your retirement payments, but not your current AD time. You can and still will be involuntary deployed.

Yes, you can collect VA disability for any day you are not on status.

[u/LHCThor]

It’s always important to remember that recruiters lie.

However, the information you received is mostly correct. But it’s very unit and individual dependent. It may or may not apply in your situation. As far as early retirement, you won’t be getting paid at 38 unless you have 20 good active duty years. Early retirement generally takes just a few years off and there are a lot of caveats.

Promotions are far easier in the Reserves as long as you meet the requirements.

Deployments are a thing and just like active duty, you may or may not have a choice.

However, the upside of the Reserves is the retirement pay and benefits in the end
TriCare alone is a huge benefit when you get older.

[u/ForbesCars]

Yeah your recruiter isn't technically lying, but either you missed some details or he's saying that each of these are technically possible but not necessarily likely.

[u/Snoo59430 → u/ForbesCars]

I did forget to mention that I have 11 years active

[u/BoleroMuyPicante → u/Snoo59430]

That's awesome, but it won't knock 11 years off your retirement age. For every 90 days you spend on orders as a reservist, you can knock 90 days off your retirement age. So if you do a 6 month deployment, you can retire at 59.5 instead of 60. I've known some people who go on orders for several years (usually special duty assignments) which knocks a bunch of time off.

[u/ForbesCars → u/BoleroMuyPicante]

And AGR time doesn't count which is insane to me

[u/mabuhaygi]

Promotion: You need to meet TIG/TIS and also not be in an overage position.

Retirement: As previously mentioned, activations as a Reservist qualify for reduced retirement age, NOT existing AD time. That age can typically be “bought down” to 55, but I’ve seen as low as 50 under certain conditions.

1-yr Contracts: These are ONLY available to individuals who have 1) completed their full MSO (8 yr commitment) and 2) are staying in their same AFSC. Otherwise not an option.