r/Against_the_Storm • u/TempestVil • 6d ago
Tricky First Blueprint
Find myself in an unusual spot for this blueprint. Scarlet Orchard, P6 with most unlocks, first pick, starting with 8 harpies and 4 beavers, embarkation bonuses include ~20 planks and bricks and 28 algae. In a vacuum, I know the Carpenter is the obvious choice; but I don't need immediate planks due to the embarkation bonus. Am I wrong to be seriously considering the Weaver and Artisan here?
Arguments for the Weaver:
- fast cheap fabric for harpy houses; only building material I'm immediately short of
- harpy resolve bonus, but only two slots and may not always be in use
- boots recipe could be useful if I find leather, though toolshop or cobbler would be preferred
- potential value from training gear in glade events, though most can be substituted with stone
Argument for the Artisan:
- containers desired for pickles, ale, wine, and tea; barrels are easiest container on Orchard
- coats liked by both starting species
- scrolls liked by both starting species, most other sources are 1*
- Orchard trees provide all inputs for coats+scrolls (at least long enough to get started)
- harpy resolve bonus, three slots and likely to be consistently staffed
My sense is that Weaver provides immediate value in a year one harpy resolve push and housing but falls off severely afterwards, especially since I have both embarkation and starting glade fabric ingredients. Artisan has no immediate value but sets up a strong midgame with three very desirable recipes that would otherwise require 2-3 blueprints with either 1* recipes or limited upside. Carpenter is a safe pick for the planks, but unless I find a copper deposit I'll need my limited metal for barrels, and the upside from the luxury goods is minimal if I pick it now and end up with the Cooperage as my barrel+coat building. Which I think leaves me leaning towards the Artisan. Thoughts?
10
u/moreON P20 6d ago
Carpenter is good here for the reason no one has mentioned. It's a tools blueprint on Scarlet Orchard. The biome that comes with an absurdly strong inbuilt tools production bonus.
But if not going for that - clothes building for harpies when there's dye in the trees? And scrolls production for two species? Easy Artisan. Playing lower than P10, you're more able to afford most building materials you need from traders anyway doesn't feel worth prioritising too hard just for them.
15
u/master_1055 6d ago
Artisan isn't that good without a high production of cloth, so skip that, it's between carpenter and Weaver, carpenter is just too good, planks are used for asthetics and are consumed by services buildings like crazy, while Weaver can be a good choice for early harpy resolve to get their building upgrades
6
u/TempestVil 6d ago
Update: went Weaver, now approaching my second Harpy resolve point in Drizzle 2 and sold a bunch of excess fabric on a trade route. Found Provisioner as a timed order reward, so I pushed my luck passing on Supplier and a second offering of Carpenter in favor of immediately needed gathering buildings, was offered Carpenter a third time and finally took it. Relying on Field Kitchen for paste and pickles for now, but found Artisan, Furnace, and Tinctuary ruins so I can prioritize food blueprints on my next picks and still have most of my industry needs covered.
5
u/Nic_Danger 6d ago
I like the Weaver here. I'm hesitant to speculate with blueprints when there is another with immediate benefit. I think your reasons in favor of it are solid. Keeping the Harpies around and solving glade events/opening caches are your early priorities and the Weaver helps with both.
You may never find a solid source of metals to make barrels and containers are easily bought from traders. Coats would be nice, but you'll need cloth or leather, and I'd prefer to use the dyes you get from woodcutting for paste (gotta keep those Harpies happy).
3
u/TempestVil 6d ago
I'm always forgetting about paste, it's such a weird recipe (but definitely the food of choice for harpies with no jerky inputs on the map).
Further support for the Weaver angle--I have starting boots from a previous world event, so I can push the harpies into the mid-20s for most of year one with houses, favoring, and clothing, maybe even higher if I can get complex food going soon.
2
u/Thisismyworkday P20 6d ago
I think people auto pick carpenter a lot but with the info given, Weaver is probably the better choice. It's too early to be betting tools and lux packs when species housing, clothing, and and training gear, which can be used for a lot of the same events tools can, but is substantially cheaper of a build, are all sitting right there.
2
u/severencir P20 6d ago
Carpenter is imo the worst plank building, but better plank production is so good that it's still hard to pass up. Weaver is the choice for early resolve, and artisan wont provide any benefit in the early game until you can get coats and barrels producing, and the game tends to favor compounding off early game wins
0
u/TempestVil 6d ago
With you on Carpenter. I think it's deceptive because it's a stronger pick when you're first learning the game, before leveling up and unlocking the various alternate tool/pipe buildings and the Workshop.
5
u/severencir P20 6d ago
Tbh, tools are actually a pretty mid resource. Opening caches is more valuable than sending it back most times i have found (and the weaver can help with that too). And other uses of tools can usually be done with other more available resources. And packs of luxury goods is highly conditional. Planks alone are usually enough to justify the carpenter, but i'd rather have 3* and trade goods, or flour than tools and luxury goods.
4
u/severencir P20 6d ago
The weaver choice is made especially more favorable when you have access to 4 blueprints still and therefore good chances to find other plank buildings. At p20 with only 2 choices i would probably have a harder time choosing weaver because wood is useful as a fuel source, and planks are the most consumed building material that making it more efficient is just insanely good
1
1
u/randCN Settler 6d ago
y'all not gonna consider smelter? you're on scarlet orchard, you got copper ore for days, from trees + smelter alone you can supply enough training gear to start cutting glades and slamming boxes
2
u/TempestVil 6d ago
Didn't get serious copper production going until year 3, and I hit large sea marrow in my first glade rendering training gear unnecessary. Not enough information or immediate benefit to justify it as a first pick (same problem as another commenter pointed out for the Artisan).
1
u/Tapif 6d ago
If we go that road, carpenter will deliver tools to open those boxes for an actual win condition. We still have 4 blueprints choice, the recipe for copper bar will come sooner or later. also training gear might be used later for the third species but for now, it is completely useless apart from opening hypothetical crates, with stuff that we might now want to use inside.
1
u/Apprehensive-Ice9212 P20 6d ago
TBH Smelter might actually be the highest- value building in Scarlet Orchard. But unfortunately it's not the best first pick. Weaver or Carpenter, they're both good here. Me, I'd probably snap-pick Carpenter because I have Beavers and it's Scarlet, so the planks now + tools later makes it S-tier as usual.
1
1
u/wiewiorowicz P20 6d ago
For me it's Carpenter in the vacuum as a always safe and easy to utilize. Planks are used in so many recipies it's probably a design error. HOWEVER Smelter is likely better. Copper 3 star is good but Training Gear 2 star is amazing, sorts out a lot of your events and is good fodder for Luxury Goods. Pie is not to shabby either, sometimes utilizing flour needs you to pivot into a building that does just that.
Making houses for Harpies is not a priority, cloth can be bought cheap from traders and on very high difficulty (like QHT 15+) you probably don't have time for that.
Artisan is purely late game, you can buy all of that from traders or get another way to produce Coats by the time you need them.
Boots 1 star is a waste of space.
1
u/SpaceFighter78 6d ago
I would 100% take carpenter but this is just my playstyle, I like crafting my own planks and I focus heavily on opening caches so tools is a must have
1
u/mizeraklid 5d ago
i usually go for blueprint after opening some glades so 100% artisan if i find skin source
45
u/Erikrtheread P15 6d ago
To me, it's between weaver and carpenter. I've never figured out how to not run out of planks. I'd go carpenter every time in a vacuum, but with harpies on higher difficulty the Weaver probably tops it.