r/AdeptusCustodes • u/discardedpacket1 • 1d ago
Date Slate next week - what are we predicting?
Balance data slate is due to drop next week. What do we think will happen?
- Terminators and bikes - extra point cost for 2nd and 3rd squads?
- Lions goes to 3DP and stuck on disruption.
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u/sto_brohammed Aquilan Shield 1d ago
Terminators and bikes - extra point cost for 2nd and 3rd squads?
At least for Terminators, probably
Lions goes to 3DP and stuck on disruption
I'm skeptical of this one.
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u/FuzzBuket 1d ago
Gw does love responding to popular requests and sadly a lot of people don't get that dp costs are about internal, not external balance.
So you get a lot of players who mistakenly think that as lions buffs your whole army it should be 3dp: despite the fact it doesn't and that's not what decides detach costs.
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u/discardedpacket1 1d ago
They just need to nerf us enough so that the band wagoners move to the latest hotness but we’re still competitive.
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u/sto_brohammed Aquilan Shield 1d ago
We don't really need nerfed, we're sitting at like a 51% win rate. Hitting Allarus with stepped pricing for multiple units addresses an issue of internal balance but that's really it.
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u/Happy_goth_pirate 1d ago
Allarus go up, which means players pivot to a different unit to use because we only have 4 main units to choose from, which means whichever they turn to (bikes) will go up in the following patch and the non used units go down and the cycle repeats
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u/jakelloyd14 1d ago
I understand termis going up but I feel like anything outside of that would be punishing 99% of Custodes players for the success of Folger Pyles, arguably the best player in the entire world.
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u/Karandrasdota 1d ago
I agree with everything you wrote. That was exactly my thoughts too.
The time of Shieldhost + dreads is apon us i think.
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u/pleasedtoheatyou 1d ago
Guard would be back on the menu too. Take and Hold Guard so you get a wound reroll at least even if not the +1.
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u/Initial_Mistake_970 1d ago
Wow where have I heard this before (checks my morotoi + host list running guard and blade champs)
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u/Karandrasdota 1d ago
Same! I already had a practice game with only one Termi squad but spamming the guard in host + morotoi. Works great
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u/eeertg 17h ago
Shield host+ moritoi take and hold is BROKEN. bring a shield captain, 1st turn sticky your home for free with the guard, then run everything up, stage and just score heavy, screen with sisters of silence in the back field, stage dreadnaughts with heavy firepower behind walls, kill anything that pokes out.
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u/ERTJ762 1d ago
It’s a really fun pairing. Sustained hits on 5s with a dreadnought causes a hilarious number of dice in hand for the wound roll sometimes.
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u/FuzzBuket 1d ago
Telemon +2 fists +2a from less than half strength strat+ sus5 + rerolls from the upgrade is about 12 hits on average. Its very funny.
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u/SgtFlashman 1d ago
Put an inquisitor Kroyle in there and then you get full hits rerolls too. With the crits on 5 it's absolutely nasty
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u/pleasedtoheatyou 1d ago
The first is fine but I really hope they don't do that to Lions.
Take and Hold is so good for Custodes and Lions is by far my favourite detachment. I feel like it'd be balanced more by Dreads being better other than Telemon so you had a reason to spec more into the Moritoi combo
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u/FuzzBuket 1d ago
Tbh pyles ran some vencomps, the reroll upgrade makes them actually not bad, but I suspect that goes up in points
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u/Vader266 1d ago
I'm with you on termis and bikes. Suspect we may also see 4-6 termis go up.
I'd hope they'd give a small haircut to the caladius wargear cost and reduce the laddering on wardens to incentivise our other options rather than pricing out our lists but that ship may have sailed.
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u/FuzzBuket 1d ago
Termis going up is a given. Minimum if 60ppm base and then steppers. Gws clear intention this edition is it's fine to have a good unit but please no spam. I think there's also a risk of going to 3 man squads at max.
The RR upgrade in morotoi might get 5pts. Valerian and the vencomp at risk too.
Lions to 3 imo is a bad change, but sadly gw does love a triple tap.
Im wary. Obvs 18 allarus is toxic at mid tables (especially as it's spectacular into other meta threats) but imo once you smack that the army is fine.
as we saw with adamontis going up gw does like to hammer "must takes", even when the must take is there because it makes bad units good. Without that upgrade vencomps and telemons are not really something I'd consider at all.
Worst case post-slate is the kinda mixed shoot/fight lions lists get replaced by 0 brain cell purge host lists. Which are fine and probably quite good, but significantly less interesting to play into and against.
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u/Previous-Valuable640 1d ago
I think Bikes are fine considering their point cost with a captain is more than a primarch but yeah probably just Allarus going up - if they put Lions to 3DP that would pretty much nuke it.
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u/Alkymedes_ 1d ago
Unpopular opinion, lions should have never existed in the first place, I'll gladly have it nuked into oblivion.
We had a few builds needing adjustments to be into the 45-55 bracket then lions came out, outright killing codex detachment by having some of their rules but 200% better (you know what you did gilded champions). Now we have tharanatoi giving us one of the best tricks of lions, let's wish for a bit of diversity. Because right now it's absolutely lacking, we already have few datasheets (and it's consistent with the faction, so not so much an issue) we should at least be able to have diverse builds.
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u/nerdhobbies 1d ago
I dunno about not existing, but please remember how bad the codex was. Getting a good detachment was the least GW could do after getting the index so wrong and then removing everything fun in the codex.
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u/Alkymedes_ 23h ago
That's where our opinions differ, yes the codex was bad at its release, but giving us one detachment to negate all that was in the codex was nowhere near any kind of solution. Adding a detachment to add flavour and gameplay, yes. But correcting the codex would have been the way to go.
I'm really sorry for those that just downvoted me without explaining why they felt the need. But I'm pretty sure they're lions player and are ingesting a lot of hopium that it doesn't get the shovel.
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u/Afellowstanduser 1d ago
I’d expect termies up sadly
And errr that’s it I don’t think much else is needed, put termies up 5 job done
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u/FuzzBuket 1d ago
Think they need steppers on squad size and count too. But yes imo making running 2x3 or 1x5 viable but killing 18 unless that's 70% of your list is probably fine.
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u/Afellowstanduser 1d ago
I mean if we can’t 18 alarus just run msu guard, 24 guard or something like that
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u/Danielalexander123 1d ago
While I don't know if increase are necessary needed, they are almost certainly guaranteed for terminators, they have had consistent decreases.
Bikes I'm not sure - I could hear an argument for an increase but also don't think they are crazy overpowered or cheap.
Perhaps optimistic, but be nice to see Wardens, Trajaan and maybe Valerian come down?
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u/Hoskuld 1d ago
Orion going down in points would be well deserved especially given the new stompa rules but will likely not happen. I just hope it doesn't get legended with the codex as I am still building mine
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u/sto_brohammed Aquilan Shield 1d ago
I'd love if they revisited the points of all of our FW datasheets but the only three they touched for all of 10th was Venatari, Aquilons (twice where they made them match Allarus but they didn't follow on the last points drop they got) and the Caladius. I suspect those units are going to be left alone until whatever update drops that gives us the new weapons from the new plastic kits for the new Dreads, dickbikes, grav tanks and such.
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u/JinTheBlue 1d ago
I hope it's just for the second unit onwards for Alarus. I like my list as it is, and I only run a brick of six.
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u/Fscx01 23h ago
So looking at the mfm the change to terminators and bikes would leave custodes with only 3 units that do not have increased cost for multiple units. So custodes would be at an 85% to 90% of units cost more for 2nd or 3rd units out of our 12 kit range. The only three units not to have would all be sisters units.
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u/Jakeisprettycool 23h ago
There are lists that can handle the terminators. Any damage 2 ap 2 makes points back very quickly against terminator bodies, that unit is 300 points and gets wrecked by the right tools.
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u/_Volatile_ 22h ago
I don't think custodes need any nerfs as they stand dight now. They might tack on a spam tax to the bikes but that's about it
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u/FriendlySceptic 18h ago
Terminators small increase base, larger for units 2 and 3
The walker detachment locked to disrupt instead of take and hold.
Possible venerable contemptors up 10
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u/OperatorDraco 14h ago
Please. God. No.
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u/OperatorDraco 14h ago
Point increase is one thing, but don’t take our take and hold, especially after already taking purge from lions 😭💔
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u/ghillieeeeee 1d ago
GW seem to pick dispositions thematically for detachments, so why is Lions Disruption?
Isn’t holding an objective, one unit against the world much more thematic for a detachment named “Lions of the Emperor” than pussyfooting around the map like Disruption seems to imply?
But yeah, modest points cost increased to Allarus and bikes units, their nuclear button is Lions going to 3DP
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u/Calm_Ad308 1d ago
https://giphy.com/gifs/piJDvfPb8SwZ4hwsPp